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MeetChristians.com / Forums / Unorthodox Doctrinal Discussion

No. 0     Original Topic:  I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 10:46 AM   Viewed 1061 times     
I don't want to make this a long thread becuase I dont like long postings and im sure some of the others don't either.

Some teach, that some will remain dead forever in hell

while others teach The Lord tortures man by a literal fire in hell forever

I dont understand how either one of those could be true when we have col 2:10-14 saying we are complete in him and why.

How can dead forever or torture by literal fire forever = complete in him?

complete in Him strongly goes agaisnt both of the beliefs above.

*** No one has to give a response if unwilling but I do hope you will at least give some thought to this. You all have a nice day. Im heading out to the grocery store. Be good and see you all later.

No. 1     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Verbatim   Gender: F   Age: 64   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 12:56 PM     
This is truth- it's like this.

Unregenerated go to a holding place called Hell, upon physical death, until final judgment.

Regenerated go to Heaven to be in the presence of the Lord, upon physical death, until final judgment.

Unregenerated who are in Hell, will be thrown into the Lake of Fire, forever.

Regenerated will be in the presence of the Lord in Heaven, forever.

Everyone remains in a conscience state of mind.


This is a very simple explaination to it all.
No. 2     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 2:13 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

I don't want to make this a long thread becuase I dont like long postings and im sure some of the others don't either.

Some teach, that some will remain dead forever in hell

while others teach The Lord tortures man by a literal fire in hell forever

I dont understand how either one of those could be true when we have col 2:10-14 saying we are complete in him and why.

How can dead forever or torture by literal fire forever = complete in him?

complete in Him strongly goes agaisnt both of the beliefs above.

*** No one has to give a response if unwilling but I do hope you will at least give some thought to this. You all have a nice day. Im heading out to the grocery store. Be good and see you all later.



If you read your Bible more clearly and took God's Word more completely/whole instead of "cherry picking" His Word, you may understand more clearly.

The problem is not what others believe or do not believe, it is your own lack of understanding of His Word that is the issue. You appear to hear only what you want His Word to say.

And I do not express this in a demeaning manner. It is simply very obvious.
No. 3     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 3:57 PM     
Verbatim everything you said before this comment below is true

Unregenerated who are in Hell, will be thrown into the Lake of Fire, forever.

I know people don't bleieve it but this comment is where the problem lays. Lake of fire is a metaphor and metaphors cannot be taken literally. I havent got time right now cuase im heading out to the hospital to visit a patient. But if people would give me the chance, I want to do my best to prove it without fighting, anger, name calling and well nothing that doesn't glorify God.
No. 4     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Verbatim   Gender: F   Age: 64   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 4:14 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

Verbatim everything you said before this comment below is true

Unregenerated who are in Hell, will be thrown into the Lake of Fire, forever.

I know people don't bleieve it but this comment is where the problem lays. Lake of fire is a metaphor and metaphors cannot be taken literally. I havent got time right now cuase im heading out to the hospital to visit a patient. But if people would give me the chance, I want to do my best to prove it without fighting, anger, name calling and well nothing that doesn't glorify God.



No thanks..save your breath, I am not interested.


No. 5     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 6:19 PM     
ok then
No. 6     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 6:47 PM     
If you read your Bible more clearly and took God's Word more completely/whole instead of "cherry picking" His Word, you may understand more clearly.

survivor I wish you would take your own advise. If you did you would see that the fire in the "lake of fire" saves man which would be impossible based on your belief. A real literal fire would not save anybody.
No. 7     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:05 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

If you read your Bible more clearly and took God's Word more completely/whole instead of "cherry picking" His Word, you may understand more clearly.

survivor I wish you would do the same thing. If you did you would see that the fire in the "lake of fire" saves man which would be impossible based on your belief.


Salvation is per God's Word per my belief. No need to share with me your made up version. And I have never uttered a word about there being a literal fire. But you are not in alignment with His Word regardless.
No. 8     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:11 PM     
so what your saying is you don't care that the scripture tells us...the fire saves man.

If your prefer to continue believing other doctrine you are free to do so.

The lake of fire is a metaphor that symbolizes Jesus Christ and is how the fire saves man.
No. 9     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:14 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

so what your saying is you don't care that the scripture tells us...the fire saves man.

If your prefer to believe other doctrine you are free to do so.


Do not put words in my mouth. Scriptures say no such thing as you share. The blood of Christ provided the gift of Salvation.
No. 10     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:24 PM     
Icor 3:15 is the verse.

The lake of fire is a metaphor that symbolizes Jesus Christ and is how the fire saves man. A real literal fire couldn't save man but Jesus Christ does and since Jesus Christ saves man, he couldn't stay dead forever either.
No. 11     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:34 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

Icor 3:15 is the verse.

The lake of fire is a metaphor that symbolizes Jesus Christ and is how the fire saves man. A real literal fire couldn't save man but Jesus Christ does.


I did not post in this thread to debate Scripture with you. I was providing a response as to why you do not understand others. They have a grasp of what God's Word actually shares as a whole. I am at a loss as to how you derive your understandings of Scripture. Appears you piece meal Scripture coming to your own conclusions regardless of what God's Word shares in completeness. You appear to ignore many Scriptures.

No. 12     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:42 PM     
They have a grasp of what God's Word actually shares as a whole.

so they beleive

And There are no scriptures I ignore. What's going on is people are foolishly taking metaphores in a literal sense and you cannot do that.

a metaphor is always symbolic of something else. Lake of fire metaphor symbolizes Jesus Christ and is why the fire saves man when the man is being tried in the fire.
No. 13     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:47 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

They have a grasp of what God's Word actually shares as a whole.

so they beleive

And There are no scriptures I ignore. What's going on is people are foolishly taking metaphores in a literal sense and you cannot do that.

a metaphor is symbolic of something else. Lake of fire metaphor is Jesus Christ and is why the fire saves man when he is being tried in the fire.


Jesus' own Words share differently than you.

Regardless of how much error you think others are in, your fruits indicate you have not a clue of what Scriptures actually share.

I am finished discussing the matter.
No. 14     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 7:55 PM     
which words would you be speaking of? the lake of fire which is a metaphor? define metaphor.

Actually lets go the other way and assume its literal and not a metaphor. It still could not harm man becuase a literal fire can only burn physical things. we wont have our physical body anymore, its turning back to dust where it came from. without a physical body our souls cannot be harmed by a literal fire.

So either way, no harm is done to the man.
No. 15     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 64   on  Nov 2, 2017 at 9:27 PM     
Instead of "how," you should be asking "why."



No. 16     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Verbatim   Gender: F   Age: 64   on  Nov 3, 2017 at 7:32 AM     

Texascowgirl wrote:
I dont understand how either one of those could be true when we have col 2:10-14 saying we are complete in him and why.


The ones complete in Lord Jesus, are the ones who are REGENERATED.

This does not apply to the, UNREGENERATED.



No. 17     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Verbatim   Gender: F   Age: 64   on  Nov 3, 2017 at 7:40 AM     
Texascowgirl wrote:
Some teach, that some will remain dead forever in hell



The body dies...but the soul lives forever.




Eternal death means..spiritual death...separation from God.

Eternal life means...spiritual life...not separation from God.
No. 18     Reply: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 3, 2017 at 8:38 AM     
The body dies...but the soul lives forever.

After he resurrects it from the grave/hell/the sleep of death yes the soul of man lives forever. And we have proof that all will hear his voice and rise. john 5:28

Eternal death means..spiritual death...separation from God.

But eternal death is not biblical which you just stated yourself in the above quote when you stated the soul lives forever. Plus there are just numerous verses proving all are saved.

Eternal life means...spiritual life...not separation from God.

agree.

separated from God. we may have different definition for it but all it means is we sin and God dont. thats it. It does not mean God abandons us. It just means sin makes us enmity agiasnt God. In fact he said he would never abandon/foresake us. But if he ever did it would mean he abandons all of us beucase all fall short of the glory of God beucase all have sin.
No. 19     Reply: Re: Re: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  Verbatim   Gender: F   Age: 64   on  Nov 3, 2017 at 8:45 AM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

The body dies...but the soul lives forever.

After he resurrects it from the grave/hell/the sleep of death yes the soul of man lives forever.

Eternal death means..spiritual death...separation from God.

But eternal death is not biblical which you just stated yourself in the above quote when you stated the soul lives forever. There is just numerous verses proving all are saved.

Eternal life means...spiritual life...not separation from God.

agree.

separated from God. we may have different definition for it but all it means if we sin and God dont. thats it. It does not mean God abandons us. But if it did it would mean he abandons all of us beucase all fall short of the glory of God beucase all have sin.



I maybe thought you wanted to learn...!

I do not argue God's word...it is sin.

Either you listen, or you don't.


No. 20     Reply: Re: I dont understand how.....   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 51   on  Nov 3, 2017 at 9:08 AM     
verbatim the only thing I wanted to learn from people here is why they claim God abandons us when God made it crystal clear, he will never abandon or foresake us and why they cannot see the Lord is the savior of all.

God wants unity not division/separation which you yourself said just the other day. And he will bring us together as one even if some don't trust him. He will do it. He came to heal the spiritually ill..the lost...not the spiritually healthy. He came to save the lost, not torture them forever and not leave them dead forever but to heal their spiritually dead minds bringing them all to the knowledge of the truth. (which I see happening in the lake of fire second death judgment where he changes the mind of men by raising them incorruptible.) Through his death and resurrection we are saved. And our salvation is undeserved and a free gift from God. It is nothing we work hard for..its a free gift

rom 5:10-11 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. Not only is this so, but we also boast in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

The ones complete in Lord Jesus, are the ones who are REGENERATED.

The ones who are complete in Jesus Christ are the ones he died for which is everybody.