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MeetChristians.com / Forums / General Discussion

No. 0     Original Topic:  The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Denise   Gender: F   Age: 58   on  Nov 4, 2013 at 8:53 PM   Viewed 30632 times     
I keep reading remarks about "Bitcoins" but I don't have a CLUE what anyone is talking about.

Am I the only one who is totally ignorant about this? :shock:




Stefan Molyneux looks at the rise of Bitcoin and discusses its history, mining, fees, altcoins, regulatory hypocrisy, worldwide awareness, comparisons to gold, anonymous transactions, possible government attacks and what the future holds for the decentralized cryptocurrency.

Bitcoin Address: 1Fd8RuZqJNG4v56rPD1v6rgYptwnHeJRWs
Litecoin Address: LL76SbNek3dT8bv2APZNhWgNv3nHEzAgKT

0:00 How the ruling class controls human livestock.
1:35 How Bitcoin works
8:47 What is money? Is Bitcoin money? (come on, what do you *think* the answer is? )
15:04 Demographics
19:47 Why Bitcoin is better than predecessors
26:54 History (skip here to hear him say "Satoshi" funny)
28:50 Purchasing power of government-issued money going down
40:03 Bitcoin's future popularity
42:15 Big Banks and Big Government hate Bitcoin!
45:00 Not anonymous by default but can be if you want it

A very special thanks to Kristov Atlas, author of the upcoming comprehensive guide to bitcoin anonymity, for his assistance with this presentation. Get the latest updates on his book at: http://www.anonymousbitcoinbook.com

I have NO idea what radio show this is from.. may be a British radio show.. may be Canadian.. may be American.. it's a funky radio show and perhaps not a good one.
No. 1     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 18   on  Nov 4, 2013 at 10:20 PM     
Has been around since like 2008 along with several others that popped on the scene. Bitcoin seems to have gained the most foothold in such digital currencies.

My experience thus far has been that most I personally know are not using bitcoins so much as an alternative "underground" currency as designed, but rather investing in and accumulating them more so for potential capital gain.
No. 2     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 1:15 PM     
Bitcoin Stock has been hitting all time highs as of late.
No. 3     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 2:42 PM     
I'll check out the video in the OP when I get a chance, but here are a few links of the latest information - not all positive but very fair, I think.

Peter Schiff's latest commentary -




FOLLOW THE MONEY commentary from Saturday's show - (there is a free ebook about bitcoin basics at the end of the interview.

http://ftmdaily.com/


Schiff is very cautious about bitcoins, rightfully so.

Robinson (FTM) is cautious but somewhat optimistic, and so is his guest interview.


Bottom line for me from all of this is the advice from FTM - don't invest money you can't afford to lose but say around an extra $35 that you won't miss? Go for it!
No. 4     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 5:13 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Bitcoin Stock has been hitting all time highs as of late.



I personally know some individuals that have done very well investing in Bitcoin and buying the "coins". It was an opportunity I opted to pass up. At least thus far. The stock market has treated me so well the past couple of years I have not been all that tempted to look elsewhere for passive income.
No. 5     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  unspoiled   Gender: M   Age: 49   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 5:17 PM     
If we had a better structured society, we could be having a decent living without striving for passive income which is in many cases, just a nice word for "I'll take advantage of some situation where I don't have to work and others do".

I know some "Christaans will invoke some Biblical passage to try to defend their want for as much of this as possible.
No. 6     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 5:22 PM     
unspoiled wrote:

If we had a better structured society, we could be having a decent living without striving for passive income which is in many cases, just a nice word for "I'll take advantage of some situation where I don't have to work and others do".

I know some "Christaans will invoke some Biblical passage to try to defend their want for as much of this as possible.



To each their own, but the Bible counsels us wisely on not allowing our "talents" to lay idle.
No. 7     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  unspoiled   Gender: M   Age: 49   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 5:27 PM     
ok...some people's talents are in making connections within their race to get to top positions in banking and then to invoke havoc on entire populations. they certainly are not having their talents go to waste.
No. 8     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Nov 26, 2013 at 5:31 PM     
unspoiled wrote:

ok...some people's talents are in making connections within their race to get to top positions in banking and then to invoke havoc on entire populations. they certainly are not having their talents go to waste.



I hear ya.
No. 9     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Nov 27, 2013 at 9:21 AM     
So Bitcoin edging Gold? Bitcoin is Top Headline News today, I need to find out more about this Bitcoin..


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/bitcoin-not-gold-has-the-midas-touch-2013-11-27
No. 10     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Nov 27, 2013 at 9:48 AM     
insular926 wrote:

So Bitcoin edging Gold? Bitcoin is Top Headline News today, I need to find out more about this Bitcoin..


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/bitcoin-not-gold-has-the-midas-touch-2013-11-27




I am interested in the trend. I just keep pushing getting more "educated" to the backburner. So much to keep up with these days.
No. 11     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 6, 2013 at 6:38 AM     
I am not attempting to promote their investment opportunities or their educational package, but some interesting info shared here:

http://pro.moneymappress.com/NVXBITCOIN49/LNVXPC03/
No. 12     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 6, 2013 at 6:54 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:
Bottom line for me from all of this is the advice from FTM - don't invest money you can't afford to lose but say around an extra $35 that you won't miss? Go for it!



$35 might have been about all one would have needed to invest. When Bitcoin first came on the scene, $1 invested in Bitcoin was worth like over $44000 or $47000 within 2 years.

But I do need to add that a "crash" in Bitcoin value soon followed.
No. 13     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 6, 2013 at 10:36 AM     
Whenever I see the word Bitcoin it makes me want to get out a small coin and physically "bite down" on it.
No. 14     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 6, 2013 at 11:50 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I am not attempting to promote their investment opportunities or their educational package, but some interesting info shared here:

http://pro.moneymappress.com/NVXBITCOIN49/LNVXPC03/



I did a search on ebay. It appears Thomas Edison really did attempt to promote a currency backed by agriculture from what I have been able to find thus far.
No. 15     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 7, 2013 at 4:27 PM     
Take this for what it is worth. Just read it this afternoon in a tech investment newsletter I get:


"Dear Reader,

The White House has taken notice of a story we've been following very closely here. The rise of Bitcoin.

In October, President Obama summoned the head of Google, Eric Schmidt, to the Oval Office and asked him face to face if Bitcoin was "something he has to worry about."

The answer is yes.

As I've been telling you, 36 U.S. cities in 20 states have "dumped" the dollar for Bitcoin. Americans are starting to demand their salaries be paid in it.

But this is happening around the world. China is abandoning both their gold and U.S. dollars for Bitcoin.

And look at what happened this week. During a private meeting, the Council on Foreign Relations discussed Bitcoin's future as "an alternative reserve currency."

Something like this has never happened before in history... it's happening right now.

And you need to understand that what's coming could have major implications for global economies, the international monetary system, and your wealth.

Regards,

Michael Robinson
Editor, Strategic Tech Investor"
No. 16     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Dec 11, 2013 at 4:37 PM     
Something else for you to be ignorant of, Denise. Ripple - the second largest crypto-currency after Bitcoin. 3 weeks ago one Ripple (or XRP) went for 1 cent. As of last Saturday, it went for 6 cents, so if you had bought $20 worth of Ripples 3 weeks ago, they would now be worth $120.
No. 17     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Denise   Gender: F   Age: 58   on  Dec 11, 2013 at 5:07 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Something else for you to be ignorant of, Denise. Ripple - the second largest crypto-currency after Bitcoin. 3 weeks ago one Ripple (or XRP) went for 1 cent. As of last Saturday, it went for 6 cents, so if you had bought $20 worth of Ripples 3 weeks ago, they would now be worth $120.


Not a bad return.

But I'm still not sure I truly understand because it doesn't seem to be "tangible assets" and my mind is a long way from mathematically inclined.

A chap in Wales invested in Bitcoins. Left them alone - FORGOT about them. And they increased in value. Tossed his computer out.. then remembered that he had over 1 million pound STERLING in bitcoins on that computer.

My mind was reeling trying to digest what I was reading.

You lose your computer and lose your investments because of that? :unsure:

There is no records anywhere but the ones you have on YOUR hard drive?

:shock:

That seems to me a bit like a financial tight wire act without a net.

And I don't like heights. :tongue:
No. 18     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 19, 2013 at 1:02 PM     
Bitcoin takes a beating: down nearly 50% as China cracks down



Bitcoin prices screenshot


After a record run, Bitcoin prices have tumbled back to earth after the Chinese government announced a series of bans on the currency. Here is a chart and some background.


Remember the giddy highs of $1000 Bitcoin? That’s so two weeks ago. Lately, the virtual currency is in the midst of another of of its famous crashes — or swoons if you prefer — as bad news trickles in from overseas.

Here’s a chart, via Bitstamp, that shows the latest price tumble. The currency reached a new record high of around $1,132 on December 5th but has since lost nearly half its value:


After falling to lows of around $650 this week (it’s hard to pinpoint an exact price as rates vary significantly between various exchanges), the currency is slowly ticking up again.

The Chinese government appears to be the culprit for the currency’s latest misfortunes. Bloomberg reports that central bank officials have banned banks from clearing Bitcoin transactions, and said that all transactions in the currency must cease by Chinese New Years in late January.

Coinbase, a news site that provides reliable accounts of the Bitcoin world, claims the China ban was responsible for a one day fall of more than $200.

Despite the recent price troubles, some US-based investors remain bullish on Bitcoin. Last week, a group of influential venture capital firms, including Andreesen Horowitz and Ribbit Capital, announced a $25 million Series B for Coinbase, a company that wants to turn Bitcoin into a mainstream payment platform.
No. 19     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 23, 2013 at 10:08 AM     
Wow, I like Overstock.com and have done business with them in the past and it's all been good...



http://money.cnn.com/2013/12/20/technology/innovation/overstock-bitcoin/index.html
No. 20     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 23, 2013 at 8:20 PM     
OK now listen up, I won't do PayPal, no, but I would do Bitcoin, yes.
No. 21     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 10:13 AM     
Some guy on a radio show this morning was explaining the whole Bitcoin process but it's kinda confusing, he did say though that currently 1 Bitcoin is worth 600 dollars.

Here is the website that he uses..

https://www.mtgox.com/merchant



No. 22     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 1:36 PM     
insular926 wrote:

OK now listen up, I won't do PayPal, no, but I would do Bitcoin, yes.



They are likely to soon go hand in hand. Other than still accepting payment via cash because they legally have to, many services and vendors are quickly converting over to only accepting payment via PayPal as the payment service provider. Your BitCoins will likely only be accessible via PayPal to make such a payment. Merchants and vendors simply do not like contending with multiple payment providers and PayPal has become their one stop provider.

There is one other fast growing merchant services provider out there called "Anovia". They are expected to gain a big share of the market quickly for they are owned by the largest home/consumer services provider in the world.

Your BitCoin payment is likely going to have to be transacted via one of the merchant service providers such as PayPal or Anovia.

The other digital forms of currency out there that some thought may provide competition to BitCoin are simply not gaining acceptance. Were as something now like 36 offices of local government services accept payment via BitCoin. BitCoin is the only such form of alternative currency that is garnering the attention and "respect" of governments worldwide.
No. 23     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 2:14 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:



Your BitCoin payment is likely going to have to be transacted via one of the merchant service providers such as PayPal or Anovia.




Is this personal speculation, Darrell? I follow the Bitcoin news fairly closely and have heard absolutely nothing like this at all and due to the reasons behind the creation of Bitcoin, I would find this idea unlikely.
No. 24     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 3:53 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:



Your BitCoin payment is likely going to have to be transacted via one of the merchant service providers such as PayPal or Anovia.




Is this personal speculation, Darrell? I follow the Bitcoin news fairly closely and have heard absolutely nothing like this at all and due to the reasons behind the creation of Bitcoin, I would find this idea unlikely.



Speculation on my part and the so called financial, investing, and marketing experts. Merchants and vendors for convenience, security reasons, cost per transaction (they get a better rate per transaction by allowing one merchant services provider to process all their transactions) are adverse to more than one source processing their payment transactions. At the moment, regardless of the variety of charge card versions they may accept, the transactions are most often conveniently processed via one merchant services provider. If BitCoin is not able to offer merchants and vendors some real attractive reason and/or incentive to accept payment via their current means of processing a transaction, their speed of acceptance and growth is going to be hindered. Processing through a services provider such as PayPal, who if I am not mistaken now has more than half the online transaction market and growing quickly, is a likely alternative for BitCoin if they desire to gain widespread acceptance quickly. Otherwise, there is speculation their acceptance and growth could be slowed down greatly or they even fall by the wayside as other so called alternative quick payment methods have not able to compete with the likes of PayPal. Transaction processing and/or merchant services is one of the most competitive financial markets that exist.

Buying BitCoins via PayPal is already becoming a preferred method to anonymously acquire BitCoins. A merger, as far as least processing BitCoin transactions via PayPal, is being seen as the next logical progression. BitCoin may be able to avoid it, but other payment methods that have opted to do so have seen their demise.
No. 25     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 6:45 PM     
OK now Darrel, look, Banks DO NOT like Bitcoin AT ALL but Banks DO LIKE PayPal, why do you think that is???

Also now REALLY THINK ABOUT IT, PayPal COSTS the Merchant 3 percent of EVERY SALE while Bitcoin is ZERO, yep, no cost for a transaction, which payment method do you think The Merchant will eventually go for? I'd say Bitcoin "hands down".

I don't think they'd combine the two because you're still having to pay 3 percent with PayPal, why make it more complicated than it already is?

It's likely to be one OR the other.
No. 26     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 7:29 PM     
Check it out, it's A Bitcoin Converter!


http://preev.com/
No. 27     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 10:28 PM     
insular926 wrote:

OK now Darrel, look, Banks DO NOT like Bitcoin AT ALL but Banks DO LIKE PayPal, why do you think that is???

Also now REALLY THINK ABOUT IT, PayPal COSTS the Merchant 3 percent of EVERY SALE while Bitcoin is ZERO, yep, no cost for a transaction, which payment method do you think The Merchant will eventually go for? I'd say Bitcoin "hands down".

I don't think they'd combine the two because you're still having to pay 3 percent with PayPal, why make it more complicated than it already is?

It's likely to be one OR the other.



It is probably going to cost a large volume merchant much more than 3% per transaction for a long time just to setup their sites to be able to accept, process, and manage a BitCoin payment. They would much rather pay a merchant services provider such as PayPal or any other only 3% or much less to manage and take responsibility of the service for them. Besides 3% is not the concrete fixed rate. For high volume merchants the rate is negotiable with most merchant services providers down to much less than 3% depending on the volume of transactions processed.

BitCoin may not go that route. It is going to depend on how quickly they want to become a widely accepted form of payment. But the merchants that want to accept BitCoin are going that route.

It is currently not free for most merchants to be able to accept BitCoins because they already use a service provider. A merchant pays a minimum monthly fee to the current processors of BitCoin transactions regardless if they ever even have someone pay with BitCoins. Most merchants have no interest in owning BitCoins and being concerned about the fluctuating values.
No. 28     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 24, 2013 at 10:46 PM     
My question is why would a merchant not want to pay someone like PayPal 3% to process a BitCoin transaction for them versus paying employees to manage and process the transactions, pay someone to manage their ownership of BitCoins, and pay to process them into cash?

Paying someone else 3% sounds like a bargain versus what it is costing merchants that currently accept BitCoins.
No. 29     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 25, 2013 at 12:47 AM     

http://gizmodo.com/man-forgets-about-buying-27-of-bitcoin-is-now-worth-a-1454150399
No. 30     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 25, 2013 at 8:47 AM     
Several people on EBAY are selling Bitcoin through PayPal but something else unexpected ALSO came up, two other electronic currencies I haven't seen before, infiniteCoin and LiteCoin, both mimicking Bitcoin, interesting...


http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=ebay&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR12.TRC2.A0.Xbitcoin&_nkw=bitcoin&_sacat=0
No. 31     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 25, 2013 at 10:57 AM     
I have read about several other such currencies.

It has yet to be seen, but it expected only one such currency will become accepted widespread. BitCoin appears to be the one with their foot in the door about to "give in" on founding principles to become that currency.

Actually, I do not think it is so much them "giving in", but if the currency is going to become widely accepted and useable, it is merchants that appear to be controlling that picture.

At the moment, the most widely used method to transact in BitCoins is to essentially own them. Thus far, as far as using BitCoin for transactions, owning them is only popular with individual consumers. Merchants are resisting owning BitCoins to simply be able to accept them. Instead they are accepting them via such as "brokers" that process the transaction and give them cash rather than the merchant directly receiving BitCoins. The merchants are paying monthly fees and transaction fees for this service essentially the same as charge card processing is handled today. Merchants do not desire to put in place the resources to manage the processing of BitCoins. Whatever merchant service provider that is able to tap the bulk of this market is going to be the BitCoin winner. At the moment, the only two that appear to have that clout is PayPal and Anovia.

PayPal simply because of already having the global currency and financial experience not to mention already owning more than half of online transaction processing in the world, but to the other extreme is such as Anovia which is kind of like a "grass roots" movement amongst individual and/or consumers, leveling the playing field to allow the "little guy" a piece of the pie. Such may appeal to the BitCoin users, investors, followers, and supporters if they find they really do require such an intermediary.
No. 32     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 25, 2013 at 11:10 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:



Your BitCoin payment is likely going to have to be transacted via one of the merchant service providers such as PayPal or Anovia.




Is this personal speculation, Darrell? I follow the Bitcoin news fairly closely and have heard absolutely nothing like this at all and due to the reasons behind the creation of Bitcoin, I would find this idea unlikely.



Many merchants currently accepting BitCoins have already turned to paying "brokers" to process the transactions for them into cash. It is being found that most merchants do not want to own BitCoins just to be able to accept them as a form of payment. Same principle as a merchant may not want to own the charge card company just to be able to accept a charge card.
No. 33     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 26, 2013 at 8:01 PM     
Bitcoin is awfully expensive but it might still be worth getting and it appears that it's being talked about as A Gold Standard in The Crypto Currency World and that Litecoin would be considered The Silver Standard.
No. 34     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 26, 2013 at 8:07 PM     
Every thing I read says Bitcoin is well worth investing in and actually just getting started as far as the potential for fantastic returns. But then again most those articles are published by those vying to be your Bitcoin broker. Good or bad, that does appear the direction of getting into Bitcoins is moving.
No. 35     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 26, 2013 at 10:49 PM     
I don't know. Obviously there are individuals out there buying and using bitcoins, but it appears to be a "scary" ordeal to get involved.

As with most else I become involved in, I decided the best way to become experienced is to jump right in there.

I setup an account this evening with what is supposed to be the most popular exchange being it is a PayPal style site. But the functionality of the site is so poor and shaky I refrained from submitting my bank account info to make an exchange. Appeared to be a very insecure and suspicious site.

Maybe the site is simply overloaded this evening due to the overstock.com news release about an hour or so ago that they are setting up to accept bitcoins as a merchant.

I am going to investigate buying bitcoins via PayPal which has got to be way more secure and efficient than what I experienced this evening. At least I know I have buyer protection if I purchase via PayPal.
No. 36     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 26, 2013 at 11:10 PM     
From the quick search I did on Google, it appears many have found methods/sources to obtain their bitcoins via PayPal. Thus far, at least to me, such appears to be the safest and most trusted avenue. I have years of experience with PayPal's reliable and safe service.

Think I am going to slow down a little on this and review all the data I have more thoroughly. I have obtained a Bitcoin information package from a highly respected financial and investor research service. I have used their resources in the past and the data and training obtained from them has earned me multiple times more than I paid them for the info. Going to see what their DVD and printed literature provides me before I do much else.

As much financial "stuff" as I already do with no hesitation online, I did not feel secure at all with the bitcoin "broker/exchange" sites I visited. But I obtained that list directly from the official bitcoin site.
No. 37     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 26, 2013 at 11:37 PM     
What little experience I gained tonight, the process seems little different than trading on the currency exchanges, which I do. The only difference is that bitcoins are a currency option to exchange for.

Although it appears you are maybe not paying a transaction fee, you are paying an intrinsic premium depending on the difference in values of the currencies being exchanged and likely to pay a broker a transaction fee to fund your account/wallet with your bitcoins once the exchange is made.

From what I am reading, many merchants definitely are paying a fee to accept bitcoins same as they already pay to accept charge cards. Sounds like there are methods to accept them without fees if their volume of transactions remain under a specified level but it appears many are not opting for those methods. The methods are numerous, confusing to say the least, and time consuming to manage for a business owner. From what I read many business owners are opting to pay fees to have bitcoins converted to cash for them. They are really not directly accepting the bitcoins as payment. Kind of like a customer from Japan walking into a store in the US and paying with his Japan bank based charge card. The currency exchange happens behind the scenes resulting in US dollars deposited into the US store's account versus Japanese dollars. Many merchants are accepting bitcoins, but it is US dollars being deposited into their accounts after a broker/exchange converts the bitcoins to cash in the background.

The bitcoin broker/exchange sites I visited had different processing/transaction rate schedules for the consumer/user of bitcoins versus the merchant accepting bitcoins as payment.

No. 38     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:07 AM     
Yeah, as anxious as I was to own some bitcoins this evening, I am going to wade through and digest the data a little more.

Probably no room for "sloppy thinking" here.

God blesses and bails me out of lot, but this requires a little more thought.
No. 39     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:19 AM     
In the last 24 hours, the value of 1 Bitcoin has increase 94 dollars, do you realize this???
No. 40     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:29 AM     
insular926 wrote:

In the last 24 hours, the value of 1 Bitcoin has increase 94 dollars, do you realize this???



Yes, I seen that. I think it had a lot to do with the overstock.com announcement which will not even be effective until like June 2014. But investors are funny that way. Nobody desires to be left out.

There was also a lot of talk in financial news that bitcoins became more popular during the Christmas shopping period.
No. 41     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:35 AM     
I actually seen the overstock.com announcement within minutes of it hitting the financial news wires. It almost prompted me to jump into bitcoin within seconds of reading it. But I held back.

The more I read, it is sounding as if I may be able to invest in and/or own bitcoins same as I now own any other marketable investment commodity in my existing stock brokerage accounts.
No. 42     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:46 AM     



http://www.cryptocurrency.org/altcoins/
No. 43     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 9:08 AM     
If it hadn't been for Stormchaser posting information about "Bitcoin" over in the Political Forum, I wouldn't have even known about Bitcoin, the only reason I brought this thread up is because one day I was searching through the threads titles to find two of them to put together for my Thread Title Game and decided to go ahead and pull it up in the general, it did seem like an interesting topic.
No. 44     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:40 PM     
I just learned that Nokia owns the copyright to the most popular bitcoin mining, transaction, and wallet software being used. Interesting.

I do not grasp it all as of yet, but supposedly I can earn bitcoins by allowing my PCs processing power and Internet bandwidth to be used for mining and processing transactions. As time allows, I already do something similar with SETI, PGP, and RSA but I earn nothing tangible for it other than knowing I am assisting with what I feel are good/interesting projects capable of doing good.

Anyway, the software is installed on one PC and synching to the Bitcoin network at this moment. This can be a very long process. Hours depending on your PC and available bandwidth.

Actually, I had the software installed last night. But was not familiar enough to know that I needed to leave my PC on and accessing the Internet for the software to fully synch with their network. So I am a little behind my desired schedule on this process before I can do much else.
No. 45     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:45 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I just learned that Nokia owns the copyright to the most popular bitcoin mining, transaction, and wallet software being used. Interesting.

I do not grasp it all as of yet, but supposedly I can earn bitcoins by allowing my PCs processing power and Internet bandwidth to be used for mining and processing transactions. As time allows, I already do something similar with SETI and PGP, but I earn nothing tangible for it other than knowing I am assisting with what I feel are good/interesting projects capable of doing good.

Anyway, the software is installed on one PC and synching to the Bitcoin network at this moment. This can be a very long process. Hours depending on your PC and available bandwidth.

Actually, I had the software installed last night. But was not familiar enough to know that I needed to leave my PC on and accessing the Internet for the software to fully synch with their network. So I am a little behind my desired schedule on this process before I can do much else.


Hey, I'm with you, I know exceedingly LITTLE about all this Bitcoin and Litecoin CryptoCurrency Genre, however my interest in it is very quickly spawning, VERY quickly, seriously, I want to work on purchasing at least 10 bitcoins and 33 Litecoins, yep.
No. 46     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 12:55 PM     
LOL. Current status is that my PC is receiving block code history generated 58 weeks ago. Even on my best PC and my fastest Internet connection I can see this synch process is going to take a while. Wish I had realized last night I only simply needed to leave the software running when I went off to bed.
No. 47     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 4:28 PM     
Another tidbit:

I already mentioned that Nokia is the copyright owner of the software that appears to be the most widely used to mine bitcoins and process the peer to peer transactions.

It just dawned on me this afternoon, any day now as soon as the "i"s are dotted the "t"s crossed, Microsoft will own Nokia. The ink is almost dry.

Quite interesting how this bitcoin thing is playing out.

No. 48     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 4:50 PM     
No. 49     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 4:55 PM     
It is looking like my existing desktop PC is maybe not capable of being used as a bitcoin "mining rig". It may be able to mine, but most likely never able to mine fast enough to ever make it worthwhile to power the PC. Appears I am going to have to custom build a new PC with specific hardware to be able to efficiently and cost effectively mine bitcoins or purchase one specifically built for bitcoin mining.

Appears that many of these custom built rigs/PCs for mining can require a cash outlay of over $8000 and up to about $15000 just for the hardware.
No. 50     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 5:07 PM     
We have two local computer parts stores geared towards the extreme computer hobbyist. I will hit them Saturday to see what kind of motherboards, CPUs, and graphic cards they have on the shelf. Often they have what are called barebones systems partially assembled for dirt cheap. You only have to pop in your choice of CPU and memory, install your OS, and you are good to go. I have custom built several custom PCs for others using Digilink barebones kits.

Otherwise, I may soon be placing an order for computer parts from Newegg or Tiger. My existing desktop is definitely not going to be bitcoins compatible hardware in any efficient manner. I am about to stop the current wallet install and sync until I obtain better hardware.
No. 51     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 5:12 PM     
Now see with me, I personally don't see a value in buying such a mining system, although it is quite fascinating to learn about, instead I'd just rather buy at some point at least 10 Bitcoins and just sit on them for investment purposes, also buy at least 30 Litecoins, I'm going to work on doing this within this coming year.
No. 52     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 5:14 PM     
I don't know. I am approaching having downloaded 50% of the blocks. Maybe I will let her finish. This hard drive is of the latest and greatest vintage. I will simply transfer this hard drive to a new motherboard, CPU, memory, and graphics card setup at first opportunity, and see what happens.

The mining software may run well enough on this PC for me to at least become familiar with the process.
No. 53     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 27, 2013 at 5:37 PM     
I have learned this much, all that have attempted to tell me what they know about bitcoins have had no first hand experience. I appreciate their effort to help, but I have quickly learned they really have not the slightest idea of what it really takes to get involved with bitcoins as a peer to peer user, merchant, investor, or as a miner.

As computer and online savvy as I consider myself, I can easily see why most are shying away from directly becoming involved with bitcoins and opting for and/or begging for a PayPal like service as I am reading is maybe about to happen.

Actually, there already are quite a few such services. It appears the bitcoin network itself has already backed away from actually being the front end processor of exchanges.
No. 54     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 21   on  Dec 28, 2013 at 9:18 AM     
Well, all the blocks have finally downloaded but this appears to only be a bitcoin wallet and not also bitcoin mining software as per the description on the official bitcoin website. But I am finding much information on the website to be vague and inaccurate.

An interesting feature in the wallet is the option to select whether you desire to pay a fee or not pay a fee to process your bitcoin transaction. There is a comment that selecting the option to pay a processing fee expedites your transaction versus not paying the fee. I wonder how long a transaction takes if you do not opt to pay the fee?

If I were a very impatient man and/or not so determined to participate in bitcoins, this is a venture I would have already walked from just due to the shear frustration of obtaining accurate and reliable information.

It is appearing that even those heavily involved really do not know what is going on. They only know what worked for them to the extent they are involved. Kind of like much else I guess. You make what you make of it and do your real learning via trial and error.

This appears to be one of those things you pick the best avenue based on the best info you have, and move forward altering as you learn.

Guess I better just slow down and watch that DVD and read that literature.
No. 55     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Dec 28, 2013 at 9:32 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

We have two local computer parts stores geared towards the extreme computer hobbyist. I will hit them Saturday to see what kind of motherboards, CPUs, and graphic cards they have on the shelf. Often they have what are called barebones systems partially assembled for dirt cheap. You only have to pop in your choice of CPU and memory, install your OS, and you are good to go. I have custom built several custom PCs for others using Digilink barebones kits.

Otherwise, I may soon be placing an order for computer parts from Newegg or Tiger. My existing desktop is definitely not going to be bitcoins compatible hardware in any efficient manner. I am about to stop the current wallet install and sync until I obtain better hardware.



Now I do like to watch videos of various Bitcoin Mining Rigs but I guess I don't understand what they're purpose is, alright, I guess it's "to mine" more Bitcoins, but with all the electricity it takes to supposedly do this, wouldn't it be more profitable to just buy some Bitcoins right now and to just sit on them to sell at a later date?

But now if you're having fun running The Mining Rig, then I can understand this too!
No. 56     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 6, 2014 at 1:02 PM     
Bitcoin tops 1000 dollars!!! (for 1)


http://www.businessinsider.com/there-are-now-a-million-bitcoin-wallets-2014-1


No. 57     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 6, 2014 at 1:08 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Bitcoin tops 1000 dollars!!! (for 1)


http://www.businessinsider.com/there-are-now-a-million-bitcoin-wallets-2014-1





I just read an article that states even countries are bailing on hoarding gold and migrating to bitcoins. Some even selling gold and putting the money into bitcoins. But I am kind of at loss as for real viable reasons that can sustain the value of bitcoins.
No. 58     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 6, 2014 at 1:10 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

Bitcoin tops 1000 dollars!!! (for 1)


http://www.businessinsider.com/there-are-now-a-million-bitcoin-wallets-2014-1





I just read an article that states even countries are bailing on hoarding gold and migrating to bitcoins. Some even selling gold and putting the money into bitcoins. But I am kind of at loss as for real viable reasons that can sustain the value of bitcoins.


10-4!!!
No. 59     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 15, 2014 at 11:27 AM     
At this point, although Bitcoin appears to be the leading and fastest growing alternative currency, its value as a long-term investment is very speculative. A little research reveals bitcoin is exactly following the paradigm of past investment hypes that have failed as an investment.

The verdict is still out for me. Although I may be interested in bitcoin as an investment, I think there are better alternatives to US currency other than digital currencies and/or physically owning gold and silver.
No. 60     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Christian_gent   Gender: M   Age: 42   on  Jan 19, 2014 at 10:12 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I just read an article that states even countries are bailing on hoarding gold and migrating to bitcoins. Some even selling gold and putting the money into bitcoins. But I am kind of at loss as for real viable reasons that can sustain the value of bitcoins.


Same here. Like paper currency, Bitcoin is backed by nothing (precious metals, property...etc) so owners have speculative amounts of data.

Now what I am starting to see is the possibility of a digital currency backed by gold or/and silver. How will it be redeemable though? Much like our "greenbacks" used to be, it can easily be blocked with the stroke of a pen. Don't know.

No. 61     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jan 19, 2014 at 9:13 PM     
I have a local friend and brother (actually a member of my home church) who is a financial investment counselor but is pretty vague about what Bitcoins are. I recommended to him the following interview and commentary. I may have even posted it here but I didn't go back to November's postings to find it if I did.

At any rate, esp. for Darrell, it might be a good thing to contact the guy being interviewed in this podcast - he seems pretty knowledgable.

http://ftmdaily.com/ftm-radio-show/the-bitcoin-bubble
No. 62     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM     
Very slow acceptance of Bitcoin is happening, much slower than what I would like, probably be eons before it's accepted in the vast majority of places..

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/money/2014/01/21/jackpot-two-vegas-casinos-will-take-bitcoins-though-not-for-gambling/
No. 63     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 1:01 AM     
I have done a little more research into Bitcoins. Transaction fees are quickly becoming the norm with service providers claiming to provide convenience, speed, and security. The average seems to be around 1% for a peer-to-peer transaction up to a 5% fee to transfer into and out of Bitcoins. Possibly even more to transfer on the exchanges.
No. 64     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 1:07 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

I have a local friend and brother (actually a member of my home church) who is a financial investment counselor but is pretty vague about what Bitcoins are. I recommended to him the following interview and commentary. I may have even posted it here but I didn't go back to November's postings to find it if I did.

At any rate, esp. for Darrell, it might be a good thing to contact the guy being interviewed in this podcast - he seems pretty knowledgable.

http://ftmdaily.com/ftm-radio-show/the-bitcoin-bubble



Thanks Storm. I thought I was already a subscriber to ftmdaily but I do not recall seeing anything from them lately. Maybe I did it with an email address I no longer use.
No. 65     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:13 AM     
I did finally get a chance to sit down and do my 3 DVD Bitcoin course called "The Bitcoin Virtual Roadmap" by Michael Robinson of The Money Map Press. Very interesting and very informative. This was first produced in mid 2013 when bitcoin was still under $100 per coin. At that time Robinson was very bullish on bitcoins but was adamant about advising the money you invest in bitcoins should be money you can afford to lose. As of today, the value has actually increased more and faster than he appears to have expected to occur.

Robinson shared potentials indicating that $1,000 invested could return over $43,000 within 3 years. I looked at some more recent info of Robinson's as of November 2013 and he was still very bullish on bitcoins.

Robinson kind of lays out 4 scenarios or plays to earn money in bitcoins:

1. Simply buying and holding. Very risky for most with bitcoin values where they are right now, but Business Insider currently predicts the price of 1 bitcoin has the potential to be $100,000 to $1,000,000 if bitcoin only captures 1%-10% of the current global currency market. Robinson says if it only ever makes it to $5,000 it will be a windfall even buying at $1,000 per coin.

2. Trading bitcoins on the exchanges similar to currency trading. Risky but feasible if you follow your charts and buy and sell based on triggers determined following 50 and 200 day averages same as trading any other security. Quite feasible to produce daily income given bitcoin daily volatility. Also appears quite feasible to arbitrage trade between funds on the exchanges. The wide price differences between the individual funds make such trading an attractive potential. For example, one fund just today had the price at $953 per coin were as another fund had the price at $791 per coin. One could feasibly buy a coin on one exchange at $791, transfer the coin to the other exchange immediately increases its value to $953, and then cash out pocketing the $162 per coin minus transaction fees all in one day or possibly a matter of even only seconds. My concern, at least on the sites I have visited thus far, it appears bitcoin transaction processing is very slow. The price could change drastically against you before you could complete your transaction.

3. Investing in bitcoins via the coin funds. Some are paying 30% annual dividends right now and paying out weekly. If you hold for the dividends, there is predicted potential weekly dividends of high as 280% possible within 3 years based on bitcoin's current track record of growing 8% per week.

4. Mining bitcoins yourself. Robinson pretty much shares that the cost to become a stand alone bitcoin miner is high for the equipment and the time to mine a coin will sway most individuals from attempting it. I quickly learned this before even viewing the DVDs. Robinson does see great potential in joining a mining pool that utilize the computing power of your PC via the Internet to mine bitcoins as a mutual effort and you earn bitcoins with no cash outlay other than the utility expense to operate your PC and have Internet access. Mining was my primary interest in bitcoin to begin with.

Bottom Line - Robinson sees straight up buying bitcoins as having the best potential for most. Hold bitcoins as an asset with trading on the exchanges when appropriate. He predicts that every $100 invested in bitcoins can very feasibly return $4,367 within like 3 years.
No. 66     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:15 PM     
Regardless of which manner one may opt to invest or own bitcoins, a wallet is required and obtaining one is the first step to complete. It will serve as your virtual checking out.

Over the past couple weeks I have reviewed several and have narrowed it down to three.

1. Bitcoin-Qt from bitcoin.org - The original wallet and still the most popular for technical types. It is referred to as the favorite of "purists" and considered to offer the best protection and privacy but not user-friendly and not accessible from such as phone aps etc. I currently have a Bitcoin-Qt wallet. But after checking it out a little more, I would say probably not the best starting place for a beginner and I will not start here.

2. Blockchain from blockchain.com - Easy to set-up. minimal features. Seems to be a somewhat popular choice but not enough features for me.

3. Coinbase from https://coinbase.com/?r=52e41905225b26793f0000bf&utm_campaign=user-referral&src=referral-link - Easy to set-up and very user friendly. Appears to offer the most features and tools of any wallet available and thus appears to be the favored wallet by most. Just today I setup a wallet here. If you use the above link to sign-up it will count as a referral for me. I thank you in advance.
No. 67     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:19 PM     
Which one do you feel the most comfortable with?

Also..

What is the current rate of one Bitcoin right now in US Dollars?
No. 68     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:51 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Which one do you feel the most comfortable with?

Also..

What is the current rate of one Bitcoin right now in US Dollars?



I like coinbase best thus far. My account is being verified for instant buying and selling at this moment. Otherwise it takes like 4 business days to complete a regular bitcoin transaction. A bitcoin today is running about $860. Just yesterday they were down to like $751 on one exchange and at one point I noticed as high as $953 on another exchange. $860 is down from just recently being shy of $1000.

I have learned you can trade in fractions of bitcoins also. Do not know all the ins and out yet. I do know that for some reason you are limited as to how many coins you can buy and/or sell per day. At least I am limited at the moment with the coinbase account. I think once you get your coins transferred to an exchange account the limits are dropped.
No. 69     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:56 PM     
If I click "buy" this very moment a coin will cost me $815.23
No. 70     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 2:57 PM     
If it ever dips to around 688 or less, I'd come in and swoop one up, yes!
No. 71     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:16 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

If I click "buy" this very moment a coin will cost me $815.23



Actually, if I want to own it instantly it will cost 3%-5% more in fees. If I am willing to wait 4 business days for actual delivery of the coin to my account there is no additional fee. At least it appears there is not.
No. 72     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:23 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

If I click "buy" this very moment a coin will cost me $815.23



Actually, if I want to own it instantly it will cost 3%-5% more in fees. If I am willing to wait 4 business days for actual delivery of the coin to my account there is no additional fee. At least it appears there is not.



I was wrong. There are also fees for buying just one coin per a regular 4 day transaction, $8.29. But that is much less than the 3%-5% of the cost of the coin just to have it in may account instantly.
No. 73     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:25 PM     
It appears that once I do buy at least one coin and hold it for at least 30 days, my limit gets raised to 50 coins per day.
No. 74     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:27 PM     
For a few minutes there I could have got one for like $813 but the price is edging higher.
No. 75     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:30 PM     
Thus far, the coinbase site appears to operate very much like PayPal other than bitcoins are the primary currency.
No. 76     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:32 PM     
Just bought my first bitcoin at $813.60
No. 77     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:34 PM     
Already up $4 LOL
No. 78     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:36 PM     
Problem: Bitcoin is not private..

The Bitcoin payment network offers a highly decentralized mechanism for creating and transferring electronic cash around the world. Unfortunately, Bitcoin suffers from a major limitation: since transactions are stored in a public ledger (called the “block chain”) it may be possible to trace the history of any given payment — even years after the fact. Worse, since the Bitcoin ledger is public, any party can recover this information and data mine to identify users and patterns in the transactions. In other words: Bitcoin transactions are conducted in public.

The Bitcoin protocol and clients address this in two ways: (1) all Bitcoin transactions are conducted using public keys as identifiers, and these public keys are not linked to individual names. And (2) Bitcoin clients are capable of generating many public keys (“identities”) to help users resist tracking. Unfortunately, a growing body of research indicates that these protections are insufficient. This information may allow data miners to link individual transactions, identify related payments, and otherwise trace the activities of Bitcoin users.

The most common solution to this problem is to use Bitcoin laundries – services that mix together many users’ bitcoins in order to obfuscate the transaction history. Laundries suffer from a number of potential drawbacks, however, as they must be trusted to return coins. Moreover a compromised or malicious laundry offers no anonymity.
No. 79     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:40 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Problem: Bitcoin is not private..

The Bitcoin payment network offers a highly decentralized mechanism for creating and transferring electronic cash around the world. Unfortunately, Bitcoin suffers from a major limitation: since transactions are stored in a public ledger (called the “block chain”) it may be possible to trace the history of any given payment — even years after the fact. Worse, since the Bitcoin ledger is public, any party can recover this information and data mine to identify users and patterns in the transactions. In other words: Bitcoin transactions are conducted in public.

The Bitcoin protocol and clients address this in two ways: (1) all Bitcoin transactions are conducted using public keys as identifiers, and these public keys are not linked to individual names. And (2) Bitcoin clients are capable of generating many public keys (“identities”) to help users resist tracking. Unfortunately, a growing body of research indicates that these protections are insufficient. This information may allow data miners to link individual transactions, identify related payments, and otherwise trace the activities of Bitcoin users.

The most common solution to this problem is to use Bitcoin laundries – services that mix together many users’ bitcoins in order to obfuscate the transaction history. Laundries suffer from a number of potential drawbacks, however, as they must be trusted to return coins. Moreover a compromised or malicious laundry offers no anonymity.



Not sure if this information is quite true. Some wallets store the bitcoin transaction data offline.
No. 80     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:42 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

Problem: Bitcoin is not private..

The Bitcoin payment network offers a highly decentralized mechanism for creating and transferring electronic cash around the world. Unfortunately, Bitcoin suffers from a major limitation: since transactions are stored in a public ledger (called the “block chain”) it may be possible to trace the history of any given payment — even years after the fact. Worse, since the Bitcoin ledger is public, any party can recover this information and data mine to identify users and patterns in the transactions. In other words: Bitcoin transactions are conducted in public.

The Bitcoin protocol and clients address this in two ways: (1) all Bitcoin transactions are conducted using public keys as identifiers, and these public keys are not linked to individual names. And (2) Bitcoin clients are capable of generating many public keys (“identities”) to help users resist tracking. Unfortunately, a growing body of research indicates that these protections are insufficient. This information may allow data miners to link individual transactions, identify related payments, and otherwise trace the activities of Bitcoin users.

The most common solution to this problem is to use Bitcoin laundries – services that mix together many users’ bitcoins in order to obfuscate the transaction history. Laundries suffer from a number of potential drawbacks, however, as they must be trusted to return coins. Moreover a compromised or malicious laundry offers no anonymity.



Not sure if this information is quite true. Some wallets store the bitcoin transaction data offline.


Here is where I got this information from, it appears that Bitcoin and Zerocoin are MEANT to work together somehow...

http://zerocoin.org/
No. 81     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 3:45 PM     
Up $5


But if I sold right now, the fees involved would put me in the hole on the transaction.

Just a learning exercise right now to see how all functions.

A guy at a restaurant today told me the bitcoin exchanges do not process transactions fast enough to make arbitrage trading of bitcoins viable. But I reading differently in the information from some investment advisors.
No. 82     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 4:02 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

Problem: Bitcoin is not private..

The Bitcoin payment network offers a highly decentralized mechanism for creating and transferring electronic cash around the world. Unfortunately, Bitcoin suffers from a major limitation: since transactions are stored in a public ledger (called the “block chain”) it may be possible to trace the history of any given payment — even years after the fact. Worse, since the Bitcoin ledger is public, any party can recover this information and data mine to identify users and patterns in the transactions. In other words: Bitcoin transactions are conducted in public.

The Bitcoin protocol and clients address this in two ways: (1) all Bitcoin transactions are conducted using public keys as identifiers, and these public keys are not linked to individual names. And (2) Bitcoin clients are capable of generating many public keys (“identities”) to help users resist tracking. Unfortunately, a growing body of research indicates that these protections are insufficient. This information may allow data miners to link individual transactions, identify related payments, and otherwise trace the activities of Bitcoin users.

The most common solution to this problem is to use Bitcoin laundries – services that mix together many users’ bitcoins in order to obfuscate the transaction history. Laundries suffer from a number of potential drawbacks, however, as they must be trusted to return coins. Moreover a compromised or malicious laundry offers no anonymity.



Not sure if this information is quite true. Some wallets store the bitcoin transaction data offline.


Here is where I got this information from, it appears that Bitcoin and Zerocoin are MEANT to work together somehow...

http://zerocoin.org/




Interesting. But I do know at least the Bitcoin-Qt wallet claims to store all transaction data offline and not accessible supposedly keeping the data private and secure. The other major wallets claim their transaction processing provides the highest level of financial transaction privacy and security available claiming to be better than bank level security. For however secure that may make one feel.

Regardless, I do not think I am too worried about the transaction tracing Zerocoin refers to.
No. 83     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 4:34 PM     
Now I could sell it and walk with a little. Up over $50.
No. 84     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 4:48 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Now I could sell it and walk with a little. Up over $50.



I can easily see were as it may be worth it to pay the extra fees and have the coin immediately accessible. If I had the coin actually in my wallet right now, I could transfer it to the exchanges and sell it as of 2 minutes ago for a gain of $160+.
No. 85     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 25, 2014 at 6:06 PM     
No. 86     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 7:48 AM     
Bitcoins are as high as $990 this AM on the most popular exchange. Looks like I should have purchased more than one.
No. 87     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 8:39 AM     
I am amazed at how I can pop into Coinbase this AM and buy a bitcoin at $815 USD but then also pop into the exchanges and see them trading at $990 USD. I guess this is the potential for arbitrage trading resulting in turning investing in bitcoins into daily income that some of the investment advisers are talking about. Even between the exchanges there are some wide differences between the market prices.

Arbitrage trading is quite easy on the typical currency exchanges. I have sat down in the early AM and in a matter of minutes had $1200 suddenly be worth like $12000 trading in and out of the various currency exchanges. The transactions happen within seconds. Almost instantly. Of course it can also just as quickly go the other way. But never losing more than you opt to put at risk. You control your losses.

I am told such trading is not as easy with bitcoins because of the required time to execute a bitcoin trade. But even given that, there appears to be wide enough price differences I easily see the potential for easy profit trading in this manner.

To get some first hand experience I plan to have an account on the Mt. Gox exchange within the next couple of days. Mt. Gox supposedly controls at least 70% of the bitcoin trading volume. The higher level of volume should increase the efficiency and speed of a trade. {url]www.mtgox.com[/url]
No. 88     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 8:58 AM     
I was prepared to buy another this AM but the price even on Coinbase has shot up in just the past few minutes prompting me to wait until after church and see what is going on later this afternoon.
No. 89     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 12:25 PM     
The price simply keeps edging higher.

I learned today that if I had opened my Coinbase account via a referral link I and the one that referred me would have each earned $5 in bitcoin as soon as my first coin purchase was completed. Wish I had found someone now and signed up via a referral link even if they were a stranger. I simply do not like to see people miss out on those kind of bonuses even when they are small. Over time they add up.

I am having dinner today with several associates from other income stream activities. I am going to provide all of them a referral to Coinbase.
No. 90     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 12:37 PM     
don't be deceived
No. 91     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 2:58 PM     
insular926 wrote:

don't be deceived



Same as with most any investing, other than maybe real estate, you cannot lose more than you put at risk. It is totally controlled by you. That is why I do not understand all the "hang-ups" concerning stock investing.
No. 92     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 3:04 PM     
Could anyone from the outside break into your mailbox and steal the bitcoin from you?
No. 93     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 3:35 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Could anyone from the outside break into your mailbox and steal the bitcoin from you?


Theft is possible, but "No". My mailbox provides no method of access of the data required. Even if enough data was available from my mailbox they would then need to hack into my bitcoin wallet and somehow obtain the private portion of the block chain. It is my understanding that even then they cannot steal the bitcoins unless the data is stored accessible via online. My Bitcoin-Qt wallet stores the data offline. Not totally sure at this time how Coinbase provides the protection, but it is my understanding they are likely the most secure of their "kind".

The only digital way to steal a bitcoin is to steal the private cryptographic key to unlock a specific address. Supposedly such has happened. But again only if the data is accessible from online access. I suppose if someone physically broke into the facility where the data is being store offline and maybe stole such as he drives and/or paper printouts, then there is potential to pull of the theft.

At this point, I have not determined my ultimate method to protect my private portion of the bitcoin block chain.

Regardless, a bitcoin is supposedly the most difficult of any kind of currency or alternative to cash to steal.

Some people actually do hold their bitcoin data physically. I am not fully sure what comes into play in that case.
No. 94     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 3:38 PM     
It is my understanding even if bitcoins are stolen, it is even a harder task to spend or "launder" stolen bitcoins than it may have been to steal them.
No. 95     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 47   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 3:58 PM     
ya know my eyes must be playing tricks on me. I thought this thread was about biotin vitamins and I see its about some kind of money. I misread the word bitcoin for biotin.
No. 96     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Denise   Gender: F   Age: 58   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 4:17 PM     
texascowgirl283 wrote:

ya know my eyes must be playing tricks on me. I thought this thread was about biotin vitamins and I see its about some kind of money. I misread the word bitcoin for biotin.



My computer monitor is sat on the trailer floor ... too far away to really read much.

A few days ago Curtis posted a thread and I did a double take. I was SURE it said, "DOG CANNABIS" and I clicked on the link ready for a fight thinking that dogs were being drugged..


I felt like such a fool when I re-read the subject matter... "DANG CANNIBALS."

:laugh:
No. 97     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  texascowgirl283   Gender: F   Age: 47   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 4:38 PM     
:biggrin: that's funny.
No. 98     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 5:32 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Could anyone from the outside break into your mailbox and steal the bitcoin from you?



From what I have read and gleaned from investment advisors promoting bitcoins, is that Bitcoin-Qt storing all pertinent data offline as well as you having a back-up of your data is the ultimate protection against your data being stolen by "hackers".

If not going to use a service that stores all data offline, the next best level of protection is supposedly an account that requires what is called "two-factor" access using a smartphone app. This involves accessing your account online via a user ID and password, but also requires verification via a smartphone app authorizing access to the account. Coinbase offers this level of access.

If that is not desirable or convenient, then the next best was at least verification via a text message sent to your smartphone. IE: In addition to using an ID and password, a code text messaged to your smartphone must be entered to gain access to the account.

Many banks and financial services are implementing such levels of access before you can enter an account online. Some even provide you a small keychain size device capable of providing a random code that must be entered along with your ID and password to gain access to your account.
No. 99     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 5:48 PM     
BTW - I did attempt to buy more bitcoins today when the price dropped to $814 USD, but was not allowed to. I was provided a message stating that I could not make another bitcoin transaction until the previous transaction was completed taking up to 4 business days.

This time factor has been the biggest complaint thus far I have heard from bitcoin enthusiasts interested in investing. Supposedly, after you jump through enough hoops and all "verifications" that you are who you say you have been completed, the restrictions relax.

I have two wallets and could have possibly made the purchase with restrictions via the other wallet, but did not try. I have not taken the time yet to even initiate the verifications required to allow to me purchase within that wallet.
No. 100     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 5:54 PM     
I am also still pursuing the mining option.

I just got home from Sam's Club a little while ago. Looking at off the shelf PCs. They had some very good buys compared to Best Buy where I checked earlier today. Looking to setup one PC and leave it running 24/7 dedicated to bitcoin mining.
No. 101     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 26, 2014 at 7:49 PM     
2300 getting laid off from Sam's Club, anyway, let me know how it goes with mining, it sounds interesting.
No. 102     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 11:45 AM     
The average value of a bitcoin is down today.

But depending on which exchange you go to, the actual selling price has a wide spread of being lower and/or higher than the average value.
No. 103     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 1:56 PM     
insular926 wrote:
anyway, let me know how it goes with mining, it sounds interesting.



I am no longer looking to setup as a stand alone mining operation. Appears too costly at this time. Takes around a $20,000 investment just to obtain the required hardware. Most sources for the required hardware are sold out and months behind on filling existing orders.

I am looking to join one of the "mining pools". There are many and already a lot of competition. Buy you can become involved using most any traditional PC and Internet access.

From what I have read, the Bitcoin network is growing at a bewildering pace. The biggest opportunity to gain on any manner of mining is likely to be as Bitcoin hits critical mass. Now would be the time to get on board before the whole world does and not really be risking anything other than PC time and the electricity to power it. You setup as a business and it all becomes tax write-offs anyway. Waiting much longer to get involved in the mining aspect may result in mining not being worth the time and effort.

Having said all the above, the best opportunity for profit potential that I currently see with bitcoins, regardless if they stay around or not, is trading them on the exchanges and taking advantage of the wide fluctuations in price. Taking advantage of the volatility is the current method most becoming involved in bitcoins these days are becoming wealthy with them. Most of us have likely already missed the big run up opportunities involved with buying and holding without having to put lots of capital at risk.
No. 104     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 4:25 PM     
OK, picked up another PC this afternoon. Not what I would really like to have for a new PC and not what I would build if personally building one, but I could not pass up the price. And at this time I was really only looking to have something free to just leave going 24/7 for such as bitcoin mining and a couple other shared computer power projects I am involved with.

For the most part, my primary PC is always operating 24/7 as it is. But with a lot of "stuff" running in the background tending to slow things down when I sit down to do something else.

I happened to check out Kim Komando's recommendations over the weekend. I was surprised to see her recommend at least 8GB of ram. 12GB if an affordable option. Seems many low cost off the shelf PCs these days have as little as 4GB.

This new PC was actually a demo at my local Sam's Club. I broke most all my own rules on buying this. It is an all in one desktop with a 23" monitor, 1TB hard drive, but only 4GB of ram. For a primary desktop I have never been one to recommend an all in one. Not sure how easy it may be or if even possible to upgrade the ram. A brand new in the box same model was $599.99. Same thing on Amazon is like $580. Sam's Club let me have this for $393. I did complain about some scratches in an effort to get a lower price but did not prevail. Last time I purchased a Sam's Club clearance or demo item they knocked another 20% off when I voiced a concern. The only thing they offered me this time was a 24 hour return policy. In the past, when I have purchased such a clearance or demo item from Sam's it has been with a "no returns" policy.
No. 105     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 4:46 PM     
Because the PC was a demo and I have no idea what it may have experienced sitting on the shelf as far as files added, files deleted, defaults edited, etc. and do feel like attempting to search it all out, I have opted to do a complete system restore back to factory defaults. Thus far very slow. But a 1TB drive with any PC I have owned has taken some considerable time to totally reformat and re-install everything.
No. 106     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 4:51 PM     
I may just head off to the gym while the PC does its thing. My plans were to hit the gym late this evening but I somehow feel like I am wasting time to look over and see the PC only 4% completed. And I still have to burn system back-up CDs/DVDs once that is done. I want to get all such system and hardware things checked out and exercised before my 24 hour return period is up.
No. 107     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Christian_gent   Gender: M   Age: 42   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 6:39 PM     

Feds Nab BitInstant CEO In Silk Road Bust, Charged With Laundering $1 Million In BTC
Posted 7 hours ago by John Biggs (@johnbiggs)

http://techcrunch.com/2014/01/27/feds-nab-bitinstant-ceo-in-silk-road-bust-charged-with-laundering-1-million-in-btc/

The Silk Road is still claiming victims, today taking down BitInstant CEO Charlie Shrem and Robert M. Faiella, a BTC broker, known as BTCKing or BTC-KinG. Police arrested Shrem, 24, yesterday at JFK airport and Faiella, 54, in Cape Coral, Florida. According to a release, the pair are charged with “conspiring to commit money laundering and operating an unlicensed money transmitting business.”

The DEA, IRS, and Manhattan U.S. Attorney stated that the pair were instrumental in selling about $1 million worth of BTC to Silk Road users which, according to the complaint, was used to buy and sell drugs. “Hiding behind their computers, both defendants are charged with knowingly contributing to and facilitating anonymous drug sales, earning substantial profits along the way,” said DEA Acting Special Agent in Charge James J. Hunt.



Click on link for the FULL story.

No. 108     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 10:15 PM     
Christian_gent wrote:


Feds Nab BitInstant CEO In Silk Road Bust, Charged With Laundering $1 Million In BTC



One of Bitcoins most attractive uses is for illegal activities. Despite the so called privacy of transactions, moving large amounts or values of bitcoins is the way those up to no good with bitcoins are easily getting caught and/or at least noticed and put on a "watch" list. From what I have read, the transactions are not as "invisible" from the "authorities" as many may think they are.

Silk Road has been a "target" for some time. The authorities were biding their time and making sure they had all the "i" and"t"'s dotted before moving in.
No. 109     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 27, 2014 at 10:47 PM     
Out of curiosity I just looked through the information I have from investment advisors to see if any of the sites and exchanges they recommend are related to the Silk Road incident in the post CG posted. None are recommended in anything I have, but more "crooks" may yet be revealed related to Silk Road activity. I would have to see if I can find the video, but it seems "BitInstant" was featured in a bitcoin convention just last summer.
No. 110     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 28, 2014 at 12:12 AM     
Wow! I got the new PC all refreshed and running. This is not the top of the line that is available as far as CPU speed and ram, but she sure is much faster than my old PC. And I thought she was fast until using this new one. It has been a long time since I have purchased a new PC other than another Surface Pro tablet which I got sometime last year.
No. 111     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Jan 28, 2014 at 9:36 AM     
bitcoin ya'
No. 112     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 28, 2014 at 11:05 AM     
Average price was down this AM, but has rocketed back up. For the most part, bitcoin values seem to be stabilizing making it a little more reliable as a viable currency. A currency as volatile as bitcoin has been is not stable enough to be a reliable currency.
No. 113     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 30, 2014 at 1:09 PM     
I noticed today that Coinbase raised my limit on buying to $3000 per day and on selling to $3000 per day.
No. 114     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 30, 2014 at 2:43 PM     
Intuit announced today that they have partnered with Coinbase by making their financial app Mint.com able to now also track bitcoin transactions processed by Coinbase.

I personally have not been a fan of Mint.com, but Mint provides personalized financial insights to 14 million users and links users to more than 20,000 different banks, credit cards, loan and investment accounts, allowing them to view their financial statements in one place. That is huge.

This partnership marks a milestone in the ongoing evolution of bitcoin with Mint becoming the first personal finance and money management tool enabling users to view their bitcoin transactions.

My guess is that Quicken, being they are also an Intuit product, will enable the same potential very soon if they have not already.
No. 115     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 30, 2014 at 10:49 PM     
Having 2nd thoughts on the mining. Maybe I simply do not know what I am doing but seems I keep running into road blocks and the entire Bitcoin industry seems so new that nobody really knows what they are talking about.

One site leads you to believe specific ASIC hardware is required to mine while another site leads you to believe you can simply join a mining pool and use most any PC but the faster the better. You go to these mining pools and they recommend which software to download and then the software says use with ASIC only. But you start reading the readme files and it says you can manually reprogram the settings and use with CPU or GPU but not recommended. And nobody can explain why.

Best I can tell, the return is simply too low to use any processor less than an ASIC. You would actually lose money. CPU and GPU simply take more time and use more electricity than you will ever earn in bitcoins with the current price of a bitcoin as high as it is. I have read that mining on a CPU laptop you will shortly damage it due to excessive heat, a GPU desktop can tolerate the heat but requires a $1000 graphics card but again not worth the time and investment. At this time, only an ASIC based rig is cost and time effective and they are not cheap. The interest in bitcoin mining has quickly drove demand up resulting in major back orders for the hardware and the prices simply keep getting higher. Does not matter if self-built or purchased custom built.

If going to use less than an ASIC, supposedly you will lose money mining everything except Feather Coin or Litecoin.

Anyway, I registered with a mining pool (BTC Guild) today, created one worker, but not yet mining. I was already registered and attempting to install and activate the software when I became more aware of the CPU drawbacks involved.

I love the new PC though.
No. 116     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 31, 2014 at 8:11 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:
Best I can tell, the return is simply too low to use any processor less than an ASIC. You would actually lose money. CPU and GPU simply take more time and use more electricity than you will ever earn in bitcoins with the current price of a bitcoin as high as it is. I have read that mining on a CPU laptop you will shortly damage it due to excessive heat, a GPU desktop can tolerate the heat but requires a $1000 graphics card but again not worth the time and investment. At this time, only an ASIC based rig is cost and time effective and they are not cheap. The interest in bitcoin mining has quickly drove demand up resulting in major back orders for the hardware and the prices simply keep getting higher. Does not matter if self-built or purchased custom built.



Actually, after doing a little more research today, I think I have been misled again. As a bitcoin becomes worth more in value, the more likely you can earn money with a slower inefficient PC used as a mining rig.
No. 117     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 31, 2014 at 9:17 PM     
OK. As of about 10 minutes ago I am mining bitcoins on the newest PC. Have yet to crunch the numbers and see if it is fast enough to make it worth it.

Also in the process of sitting up another PC to mine litecoins.
No. 118     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 31, 2014 at 10:22 PM     
Yeah! In about 18 minutes I was credited with 0.00000001 of a bitcoin. Which I think equals .000009 USD value of a bitcoin. LOL. Going to take a PC with at least a much faster graphics card. But I at least finally got the basics down as to how to get a PC setup to mine and not have to purchase one of the expensive mining rigs. I think I can pick up another off the shelf PC and pop in a good graphics card and possibly be mining bitcoins at an efficient rate. I have a way to get "free" electricity, but would still have the investment in the PC and graphics card.

I have read that people have PCs operating 24/7 to earn only about $3 USD per week in bitcoins. I would think they are using much more electricity than that to power the PC not to mention the "wear and tear" on the PC.

Supposedly, with going into the code and making a few code changes, I can use this same mining program to mine litecoins. Not sure if I feel like attempting that this evening.

I did attempt to mine with my old PC. Frist thing I ran into was needing to upgrade the video card drivers to those that enabled my graphics card to be OpenCL. Once I did that the mining software was able to find my PC's processor but it appears it simply too outdated of hardware to utilize. Refuses to find the graphics card and I keep getting a connection error. If I cannot get past these hurdles it is definitely not capable of mining bitcoins or litecoins either.

No. 119     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Jan 31, 2014 at 10:36 PM     
I just learned I have 2 operations running in the background other than the mining software taxing my PC's processing speed. Not to mention all the other stuff that typically runs in the background anyway such as security software, etc. Will be interesting to see how much mining speeds up once these applications are complete. Once my bitcoin wallet and litecoin wallets complete their sync process, I can close those windows and see if I get a speed boost.
No. 120     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 12:27 PM     
I have made my first wallet to wallet bitcoin transfer. Primarily just to get myself firsthand familiar with the process before I use bitcoin to pay another party.

I have also now placed my first online order using bitcoin to pay another party.
No. 121     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 12:40 PM     
I was up until the wee hours of the morning researching bitcoin mining methods.

Early today I entered a 1 year contract with a hosting service to virtually provide me the computing power to mine bitcoin. Essentially I am paying a host to provide me the computing power to mine via the Internet and/or cloud technology. This allows me to mine without having to physically own and operate the advanced hardware necessary to effectively mine. The hardware is theirs, but via a dashboard easily accessible via the Internet, I still direct my own mining activity as if I physically owned the hardware.

I have also become aware there are "secondary PCs" that you simply plug into the USB ports of your existing PC capable of effectively mining, even though your primary PC may not be "powerful" enough to mine on its own. Still looking into this. The "secondary PCs" are not cheap. Lowest cost one that I would consider going with at this time is like $1500 and they are on backorder.
No. 122     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 1:16 PM     
My plan still stands, I will work on buying 3 bitcoins and then sit on them, not bite them.
No. 123     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 2:45 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I just learned I have 2 operations running in the background other than the mining software taxing my PC's processing speed. Not to mention all the other stuff that typically runs in the background anyway such as security software, etc. Will be interesting to see how much mining speeds up once these applications are complete. Once my bitcoin wallet and litecoin wallets complete their sync process, I can close those windows and see if I get a speed boost.


Shutting down utilities running in the background did not really improve the mining hash rate. In fact, at this moment I am mining at only 20% of the speed I was able to attain last night. Not sure why. I thought the hash rate was solely based on your individual PC's throughput. Maybe it also has something to do with Internet bandwidth available at the time, but it should not.

The interesting thing is that this afternoon I created a second miner on the same PC as one already mining and activated him mining for the same pool. Although the second miner is much slower than the first, activating the second miner did not reduce the speed of the first miner at all. So I am leaving both mining.
No. 124     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 2:49 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

I just learned I have 2 operations running in the background other than the mining software taxing my PC's processing speed. Not to mention all the other stuff that typically runs in the background anyway such as security software, etc. Will be interesting to see how much mining speeds up once these applications are complete. Once my bitcoin wallet and litecoin wallets complete their sync process, I can close those windows and see if I get a speed boost.


Shutting down utilities running in the background did not really improve the mining hash rate. In fact, at this moment I am mining at only 20% of the speed I was able to attain last night. Not sure why. I thought the hash rate was solely based on your individual PC's throughput. Maybe it also has something to do with Internet bandwidth available at the time, but it should not.

The interesting thing is that this afternoon I created a second miner on the same PC as one already mining and activated him mining for the same pool. Although the second miner is much slower than the first, activating the second miner did not reduce the speed of the first miner at all. So I am leaving both mining.



Hmmm... I switched the second miner to using the video card's processor. Although still not quite as fast as the speeds I was able to attain last night, the second miner is now mining at 3 times the rate of the first miner without impacting the speed of the first miner.
No. 125     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Christian_gent   Gender: M   Age: 42   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 3:30 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

I just learned I have 2 operations running in the background other than the mining software taxing my PC's processing speed. Not to mention all the other stuff that typically runs in the background anyway such as security software, etc. Will be interesting to see how much mining speeds up once these applications are complete. Once my bitcoin wallet and litecoin wallets complete their sync process, I can close those windows and see if I get a speed boost.


Shutting down utilities running in the background did not really improve the mining hash rate. In fact, at this moment I am mining at only 20% of the speed I was able to attain last night. Not sure why. I thought the hash rate was solely based on your individual PC's throughput. Maybe it also has something to do with Internet bandwidth available at the time, but it should not.

The interesting thing is that this afternoon I created a second miner on the same PC as one already mining and activated him mining for the same pool. Although the second miner is much slower than the first, activating the second miner did not reduce the speed of the first miner at all. So I am leaving both mining.



Hmmm... I switched the second miner to using the video card's processor. Although still not quite as fast as the speeds I was able to attain last night, the second miner is now mining at 3 times the rate of the first miner without impacting the speed of the first miner.



Never seen someone quote himself this many times, lol.

No. 126     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 3:48 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Early today I entered a 1 year contract with a hosting service to virtually provide me the computing power to mine bitcoin. Essentially I am paying a host to provide me the computing power to mine via the Internet and/or cloud technology. This allows me to mine without having to physically own and operate the advanced hardware necessary to effectively mine. The hardware is theirs, but via a dashboard easily accessible via the Internet, I still direct my own mining activity as if I physically owned the hardware.



My first contract miner began mining minutes ago. We will see how this goes.

I have two more contract miners pending payment. Paying with bitcoin is not quite as convenient as they might like to make it sound. Kind of a cumbersome process of making transactions and transferring bitcoin between wallets and/or accounts taking as long as up to 4-5 business days just to get setup to make a transaction using bitcoin. Once you have a wallet funded the process comes down to at least being able to make a transaction within minutes, but then everybody wants their piece of the "pie" taking a small amount of your bitcoin balance for processing the transactions and transfers. The Bitcoin network is a lot like a form of an MLM or network marketing model, only operated digitally.
No. 127     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 5:15 PM     
OK, went into Task Manager and shut down lots of background running tasks. That resulted in the fastest mining rate I had achieved up to that time with only about 25% CPU use.

But I have also now figured out how to go into the mining software and direct it to use either CPU processing power or video card processing power. I switched my physical miner over to video card and my hash rate improved from 600 khash/s to 20 Mhash/s. Given the cost of electricity that is not a very effective mining rate, but I earned 4 shares in just a few minutes at that speed versus only earning 2 shares last night in probably almost 2 hours of processing time.

Added: In the past 30 minutes I have earned 14 mining pool shares with the hardware miner verses taking me 2 hours to earn 2 shares last night before I figured out how to speed things up.
No. 128     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 5:31 PM     
I think that is great I got my hash rate up to that speed. Simply now need a PC that I can install a much faster graphics card into or invest in the USB "secondary PCs". The old PC is simply not worth the required upgrades. The new PC has a built in graphics card and no slots for me to upgrade. I need to find a way to make my existing bitcoin activity provide the funds to pay for hardware.

I am contemplating picking one of my best selling ebay items and taking those funds and deploying multiple contract miners. There is one item that for every 2 I sell, I can deploy one contract miner for a year at the current rate. I will have two contract miners deployed today. This would essentially be providing me bitcoin for no out of pocket cost at all. As the income from this method grows, I will then possibly invest in more powerful owned hardware.

Hard to imagine there is potential to essentially create a viable income for free. I have most always viewed income from ebay as essentially free, but if I can get the setup and operating costs covered, this has the potential to far exceed my income from ebay with essentially no effort once all setup.
No. 129     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 7:50 PM     
If I ever went back for a masters degree, I think I would like to get one in crypto currencies.
No. 130     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 7:52 PM     
Darrell,

So tell me this, can you mine litecoin and bitcoin on the same machine?
No. 131     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 7:53 PM     
OK, I came across a low cost USB antminer bitcoin rig on ebay. I purchased one just to try it and see what it is all about.

Also my second contract miner has been deployed.

I have located two lower cost sources per GH/s for contact mining, but you are looking at a minimum of about a $1000 per yearly contract for 10 GH/s to 100 GH/s of computing power. My current contracts are $40 per year for 1 GH/s of computing power. I am going this route at the moment with plans that ebay earnings will fund them for me. BTW - the 100 GH/s for $1000 is a bargain, but I feel the need to test this on lower scale before investing that much. Also I cannot find any info supporting the credibility of the provider.

Added: I have found a source for contract mining at only $10.83 per 1 GH/s yearly contract with a minimum of only having to buy 1 GH/s. But they are backordered. I am currently on that list for 1 contract.
No. 132     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 8:06 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Darrell,

So tell me this, can you mine litecoin and bitcoin on the same machine?



I have read that you can with the right equipment.

Supposedly you can plug both USB bitcoin and litecoin antminers into the same PC for as many USB ports as you have available or run both mining programs on the same PC. Of course one will slow each other down as they share processing power. I have a bitcoin antminer ordered. Looking for a litecoin antminer at the moment. These are not all that powerful, but I am just after them to get some experience without making a huge investment in hardware until I feel more confident with what I am doing.

Thus far, I have not been able to get any of the litecoin mining software that I have downloaded to function. But I have been so busy getting the bitcoin stuff setup and operating that I put litecoin on the back burner. I did create my litecoin wallet.
No. 133     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 8:14 PM     
I have one of the following antminers for bitcoins in route to me. Supposedly the same thing is available for litecoin. I have simply not taken the time to search for one.

I am sure it would take several of these operating at one time to mine any real worthwhile amount of currency, but I am just looking at them as a learning experience at the moment. I have as many as 2-5 PC/laptops/tablets often going at any one time. If it appears that one of these really works, even though the volume mined by one is small, it may be worth plugging several into my various PCs that are already operating anyway and collectively in the idle time they might be worth operating.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/171205462103?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649
No. 134     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 9:10 PM     
As of within the past hour, I now have slightly over 5 GH/s of processing power currently mining bitcoins. I have crunched the numbers and supposedly at the current value range of bitcoin, that should produce in the neighborhood of $1.00 USD to $1.07 USD per day in bitcoin. We will see. Of course, if we see a big rise in bitcoin value my USD earned per day goes much higher. As well as a drop lowers my return.

My fixed out of pocket expense to setup my current bitcoin mining operation and keep it going for one year has been $200 USD. Although I did pay for it all with bitcoin that went up in value since I purchased them.

5 GH/s of processing power will mine bitcoin 24/7 for next 365 days for the $200 investment. I do not have to leave any PC powered or maintain Internet access. No cost experienced for electricity use. It is all functioning in a cloud on its own.

And the route I finally went can be done for considerably less cost per GH/s. But the alternatives are not in stock and/or available at the moment. I desired to not wait any longer. If what I am currently doing works out, as soon as available I am adding another 5 GH/s for 54.15.

No. 135     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 9:14 PM     
Could you solar power the thing or at least part of it?
No. 136     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 1, 2014 at 9:28 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Could you solar power the thing or at least part of it?



With an adequate power storage system and ample sunlight, my guess would be yes.

Because I did not desire to buy the costly hardware at the moment and did not desire to be concerned about electricity cost, I opted for sitting up most my mining operation with one of the cloud providers. I do have one physical PC here at home also mining but currently at a slow rate of only 20 MH/s. I am primarily only leaving it going to check out the reliability of the mining software I am using and transfer of the bitcoin as paid out so that if do decide to invest in personal mining hardware I will already know which software, pools, and networks I can rely on.
No. 137     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 2, 2014 at 4:16 AM     
Finally, with a lot of trial and error manually changing settings in one of the mining programs, I was able to start mining litecoins. But I apparently still have something not quite correct. Only mines for a short while and then crashes the PC. I really thought it would be easier to mine litecoin versus bitcoin, but not so thus far.
No. 138     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 2, 2014 at 12:40 PM     
Still struggling to keep a litecoin miner consistently deployed. It is the graphic card that keeps shutting down. I am not sure why yet. I have updated drivers, etc. but mining litecoin shuts her down quickly. Although for the short time I have mined I have already been credited by the pool with earning litecoin. More than I can say for bitcoin.

I have been rewarded shares for two different pools for mining bitcoin, but thus far I see nothing crediting them to me in bitcoin value. Some pools pay out daily were as you may be setup for a monthly pay out with others. As well as a minimum number of shares being earned before you are paid your bitcoin because the transaction fees associated with moving bitcoin can eat up profits quickly when very small fractional amounts are moved with several individual transactions. Enough that the fees could render a low volume miner as not earning anything if you made a transaction to get credited your bitcoin at very small fractional volumes. You can figure that in most cases, at least 1% of your of your net bitcoin earned is going to get paid to someone as a transaction fee. Many have a figured a way to earn bitcoin without directly buying and/or mining bitcoin.

Appears I lost well over 100 shares mined in slush's bitcoin pool because some glitch did not allow the shares to be credited to me. At least not yet. They may eventually get credited. I happened to notice that although the mining program was logging that I had successfully mined shares, the pool stats were not crediting me with anything. I deleted my miners and started over and shares are now being credited to both the program and the pool. Jut just not enough volume to trigger bitcoin being credited to my wallet yet.
No. 139     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 2, 2014 at 8:06 PM     
I currently have 2 workers deployed mining bitcoin on 2 home PCs and appear to be getting properly credited for shares of the pool. I can obviously see that neither of these PCs are efficient for mining. But it has been a good learning experience.

I still cannot get either PC to successfully mine litecoin. At least not without eventually experiencing a graphics card crash. When my schedule allows, I have a 3rd processor here ready to go that I am going to see if it is capable of mining bitcoin and/or litecoin. I would like to get at least 1 mining litecoin being it appears that even a slow processor is capable of doing so and with the value of litecoin low, earned shares could add up quickly. And the window of opportunity is still wide open for litecoin.

The first window of opportunity on bitcoin is coming to a close in like 4-6 months. So rather than invest $$$ at this time for hardware mining, I have opted for cloud mining. I currently have 3 contracts deployed totaling to 5 GH/s of computing power. By the end of the day tomorrow, I will have over 100 GH/s of computing power mining bitcoin. If this proves successful, I am then entering another contract deploying at least 500 GH/s mining bitcoin.
No. 140     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 3, 2014 at 10:29 AM     
Hmmm... My 100 GH/s of mining power may not get deployed today. Appears the host provider in Texas has backed out of our deal costing me $40 in bank wire fees. At least at the price of $9.99 per GH/s. Not sure what happened.

I do know that competing service rates are $31 per hosted GH/s to $99.90 per hosted GH/s. My existing operating 5 GH/s cost me $40 per GH/s. I thought I had a deal with them at $9.99 per GH/s but to get that rate had to enter a contract for a minimum of 100 GH/s. I did so. At the current value of bitcoin, that much computing power can feasibly mine well over $500 per month in bitcoin.

It is difficult to actually get anybody on the phone for these things. Most all want to deal online/email and want bitcoin as payment. But this host said they would accept a wired bank payment but then refused the wire this AM. I just purchased more bitcoin this AM just in case the method of payment is the issue, and I can then pay them with bitcoin.

Ah, I am tired of messing with this right now. Off to the gym I be.
No. 141     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 3, 2014 at 2:56 PM     
Between the two slow PCs, I am actually racking up pool shares better than I thought. I have not quite grasped the pool share distribution system and what quite determines the value of a share. For example: Early today I was credited with 47 shares worth 0.00000092 BTC. Following that I was credited with 1 share worth 0.00000023 BTC by itself. And since then credited with 12 shares worth 0 BTC. A little confusing at this point. But both PCs are mining bitcoin all be it slowly.

I do not know my stats for cloud mining yet. I have emailed them for an update. Maybe I am missing something, but I cannot seem to pull the status online in the manner they say to.
No. 142     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 4, 2014 at 12:12 AM     
The biggest "con" I see thus far with bitcoin as an alternative currency is it takes too long to make an exchange. It is not an "instant" transaction like using a charge card. Typically an hour+ to 4 days to complete a transaction using bitcoin. Whatever you are paying for with bitcoin better not be an emergency needed item or you better not be hungry.

Otherwise appears to be a "cool" concept, thus far.

I will be mining and trading on the CEX.io bitcoin exchange as soon as my transaction to fund my account with them is complete. Not sure how long that is going to take.
No. 143     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 4, 2014 at 12:17 AM     
It took making a few transactions to grasp this, but it appears the time it takes to complete a transaction with bitcoin depends on the receiver of bitcoin. Apparently there is a way for the receiver of bitcoin and/or maybe the host of their wallet to set how many network confirmations are required before the transaction can be completed. Apparently some kind of security process.
No. 144     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 4, 2014 at 1:27 AM     
I deployed 4 GH/s mining the GHash.IO pool early this AM. I have 5 GH/s mining the NimbusMining default pool. And my own PCs mining less than .3 GH/s.

Dead in the water mining litecoin, but I would like to be. My 3rd processor I tried would not mine either bitcoin or litecoin. Video card not compatible.
No. 145     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 4, 2014 at 3:26 PM     
Wow! I am finally seeing other than pool shares credit for mining. My actual shares of bitcoin are now increasing as a result of mining.
No. 146     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 12:44 AM     
Got my Antminer running. As far as mining speed goes, it far exceeds my two current PC miners. In fact, the one PC miner is so slow I have shut him down. If I have that PC booted for some other reason I start him up.
When comparing GH/s to GH/s, rivals my cloud miners. But in realty, at this point, costs more to obtain and operate than a cloud miner.

A little research indicates by buying in multiples or simply shopping around around, you can buy these little Antminers for under $25 each. Even then, you have to consider operating cost and obsolescence. Cloud mining power is pretty cheap on CEX.io and convenient and easy to mine with.

But I would consider a bank of these little Antminers for mining litecoin.

Despite bitcoins popularity and growing acceptance, I still consider it highly speculative, but worth the risk to own some. If I can get the mining cost down to being a little more reasonable, I would prefer to acquire bitcoin by mining rather than laying out cash. Even with mining cost at the high end of the range, at current values, one would close to double their money invested into mining bitcoin in about a year. The amount you earn depends on how risk adverse one is.
No. 147     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 1:02 AM     
Wow! I decided to see how the little Antminer was doing before hitting the bed. In less than an hour of operation it has exceeded the total number of shares my two PC miners have earned since I first deployed them days ago.
No. 148     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 11:47 AM     
I have now reached a point were as bitcoin earned from mining is assisting with the expansion of my bitcoin mining project.
No. 149     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 8:46 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I have one of the following antminers for bitcoins in route to me. Supposedly the same thing is available for litecoin. I have simply not taken the time to search for one.

I am sure it would take several of these operating at one time to mine any real worthwhile amount of currency, but I am just looking at them as a learning experience at the moment. I have as many as 2-5 PC/laptops/tablets often going at any one time. If it appears that one of these really works, even though the volume mined by one is small, it may be worth plugging several into my various PCs that are already operating anyway and collectively in the idle time they might be worth operating.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/171205462103?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649



Hmmm. My opinion of these little Antminers as possibly just being a novelty to be able to say "I mine bitcoin" is being rethought. I am only operating one, it has far exceeded my mining achieved with GPU mining and rivaling what cloud mining is achieving for me.

I have been in contact with the wholesalers in China and Hong Kong about purchasing some in bulk, but once shipping cost, time to deliver, and all else is taken into account, for only about $5 more per unit I can obtain them from state side ebayers and Amazon sellers and in qtys much lower than the wholesaler requires.

The wholesalers did offer me a fantastic deal on the previous model at like $7 each. But the previous models mine much slower and would require banking more than one to achieve the same mined volume and requires just as much electricity to power one as it takes to power the new much faster model. In the bitcoin forums there are many saying they can get them for $25 each, but it turns out they are paying that for the old model I can get for $7.

Based on the performance I have experienced thus far, these Antminers appear worthwhile if you are one that leaves your PC on pretty much 24/7 anyway. I do. They also do not require running out and buying a new PC or any other hardware. Simply need available USB ports and Internet connection.

Although more costly, I have located a model that will also mine litecoin and can mine bitcoin at the same time. But research is leading me more towards using the model like I have to mine bitcoin or any of the other SHA256 based currencies and exchange for litecoin later versus investing money to mine litecoin.
No. 150     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 8:49 PM     
I have also learned that I can "overclock" this existing Antminer that I have and achieve at least 33% more performance out of one unit.
No. 151     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 9:10 PM     
I just got info from a wholesaler offering me a better deal on the new models. I only have to purchase 5 at a time and with every 5 they will give me a 10 port USB hub for free. I am going to review the details, but I am looking at buying a supply from them for my own use and reselling to others.

These are the same name brand model as the one I already have. They are claiming they can be "overclocked" to achieve 240% faster speeds. Not sure I believe that.
No. 152     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 6, 2014 at 9:34 PM     
I just "overclocked" my Antminer and I am exceeding the stock hashrate by at least 50%. If these little things can maintain that rate and hold up at that speed and heat, that is a lot of mining bang for the buck in such a little device.

I have attempted to "overclock" as the wholesaler states can be done but I cannot achieve a connection with the mining pool at that speed. Probably a baud rate setting I need to tweak. But it appears the chip can operate at that speed.

I am still not convinced it is possible to maintain such a rate with these. But the rate I am getting is impressive.
No. 153     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 8:54 AM     
The value of bitcoin is down considerably since I finally put funds at risk. But at the same time the cost of computing power to mine bitcoin has dropped considerably. Which is why I much more prefer pursuing a cost effective means to mine bitcoin versus directly putting more funds at risk to own bitcoin.

It is appearing that one can get the cost to mine down in some scenarios to effectively being free to mine if you buy hardware and/or cloud hashing power correctly (in the scenarios of using hardware to mine you may still have the cost of electricity to consider). There appears to be an established market for selling used hardware and hashing power can be sold on the exchanges same as digital currency. In fact, there is one exchange that utilizes the excess hashing power to mine other digital currencies and essentially awards those to you for free. IE: From my bitcoin mining efforts on GHash.io I now also own NMC (Namecoin), IXC (iXcoin), and DVC (Devcoin). None of which I set out to directly own but GHash.io is the pool where my exchange purchased hashing power is mining bitcoin. The excess hashing power is used to mine other currencies and awards them to pool members. I can withdraw these currencies at any time and do with them as I please. At the moment I am simply allowing them to accumulate with plans to withdraw later and purchase litecoin and maybe bitcoin if and when the value is down.
No. 154     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 8:56 AM     
What's bitcoin at as we currently speak?
No. 155     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:03 AM     
insular926 wrote:

What's bitcoin at as we currently speak?


Average has it at about $735. I know you can currently get bitcoin in the $720s at Coinbase. One exchange even has it at less than $700 at the moment. But at the same time you can turn around and sell it on another exchange for over $900. This is how many are currently making their money with bitcoin. They are not buying and holding bitcoin, they are trading in bitcoin.
No. 156     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:05 AM     
bitcoincharts.com probably provides the widest market coverage of bitcoin value in a one stop site.
No. 157     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:17 AM     
BTW - A Bitcoin ATM machine is now in use in Vancouver with plans to install them soon, if they have not already, in New York, Berlin, Hong Kong, and London.

At least 36 city governments across 20 US states are now accepting bitcoin to pay for from water bills to parking tickets.

Nearly every bank will currently accept bitcoin as a direct deposit to customer accounts and are now issuing debit cards denominated in bitcoin.

More than 700,000 American business are now accepting bitcoin as payment including CVS, Nike, Lowe's, and Walmart.
No. 158     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:28 AM     
bitcoinstore.com

spendbitcoins.com

thebitcoincatalog.com/order
No. 159     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:33 AM     
On average, as a result of my mining efforts, I am now getting credited with a small amount of bitcoin every 6-15 minutes.
No. 160     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 53   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:36 AM     
If we can get the baby to 550 or less, I'll buy 3 bitcoins all at once and hold onto them.
No. 161     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 9:43 AM     
insular926 wrote:

If we can get the baby to 550 or less, I'll buy 3 bitcoins all at once and hold onto them.



$595 on European exchanges right now.

The most credible investment advisory research I look at concerning bitcoin, still recommends "buy and hold" as the best method for bitcoin at this time. But at the same time advises it be funds you can afford to lose.

On the low end, they predict the value of 1 bitcoin hitting $5000 within a few years.
No. 162     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 11:34 AM     
Just purchased my 2nd Antminer. These units are proving to be just as fast and effective as my cloud mining. Cost 50% per GH/s less out pocket cost to set up. And do not require a contract. I own them. Can sell them later. Whatever. Plus I simply think it fun to have one along with me this coming week that I plan to be on the road and play with mining using my SurfacePro.

On the con side they do require operating a PC connected to Internet and, although little, use electricity. Thus far there appears to be enough bang for the buck that I have that covered.

The biggest pro that stands out for me with cloud mining is that it operates 24/7 with my computers off, me gone, me sleeping, does not require any physical effort from me or any hardware to be owned and maintained. I could go to the library and setup cloud mining.

It simply cost me less at this time to implement my own hardware mining that is just as effective as cloud mining.

In fact, as soon I have a proven functioning Antminer bank operating, I am considering contracting my own hashing power out to others for hire. They will pay me to mine for them. I see people online selling use of their hardware and/or cloud contracts for as little as 2 hours use for $15. I can contract a year of cloud mining for as little $11 and sell a lot of 2 hour blocks of time earning multiple times more back than the $11 investment over a year. In fact, I already own 4 such contracts I could start leasing out today if I desired. Seems to be a lot of people drawn to it right now for a fast and easy way to simply say they own some bitcoin without really doing anything.

I knew the "light" would eventually come on indicating a business income opportunity in this for even the little guy.
No. 163     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 1:57 PM     
As of this afternoon, at least short-term, I have over 218 GH/s of hashing power mining bitcoin.

Trying out a concept. I have developed a plan to totally fund digital currency mining via income from ebay. I really do not care if it is cost effective when comparing dollars spent to actual dollar value of digital currency earned as long as ebay income covers all cost involved. The goal is to accumulate digital currency with no current out of pocket investment. Sure I could be using the ebay income for something else, but this is my planned option at this time.

I will fund digital currency mining with ebay and at the same time offer contracted currency mining services to generate a new alternate source of income. I will be able to totally do this from anywhere without concern of packing, shipping, etc. and also fund my new interest.
No. 164     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 2:18 PM     
Make that 400 GH/s out there mining now. If these contracts prove successful, which the one deployed about an hour ago has worked flawlessly and I have already been credited the bitcoin, these are likely what I will be reselling to others.
No. 165     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 5:30 PM     
I have posted 2 ads on ebay offering hosted bitcoin mining service. We will see what happens. I only need to sell a few contracts to financially support my own mining activities.
No. 166     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 7, 2014 at 6:27 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Trying out a concept. I have developed a plan to totally fund digital currency mining via income from ebay. I really do not care if it is cost effective when comparing dollars spent to actual dollar value of digital currency earned as long as ebay income covers all cost involved. The goal is to accumulate digital currency with no current out of pocket investment. Sure I could be using the ebay income for something else, but this is my planned option at this time.



I just read what I posted and I may have shared this a little confusingly.

What I am doing is using ebay generated income to buy 1 year contracts of hosted computer power to mine bitcoin. The cost of the contracts are not cost effective enough for me. Do not return my investment quickly enough for my liking. Therefore I am reselling the contracts in smaller blocks of time to assist with educating those interested in mining but not yet quite ready to invest much in cloud mining, hosted mining, or in hardware to mine until they understand the process a little better. Same learning curve I just went through by "trial and error" but they can do so with a very low cost method. It may also meet that "niche" of those that just have to say "Yeah, I own some bitcoin" or "I have mined bitcoin" with laying out as little as $5 to $10 to do so.

My goal is that a few blocks of time sold over a couple of weeks totally pays for my 1 year contract and the balance of the year the contract mines for me for free. And I start the process all over until I have several contracts mining for me for free.

As profits allow and ROI is adequate, I may then invest in my own hardware to provide hosted computer time. In fact, not sure if I am ready to roll it out yet, but I am about to start leasing time on Antminers via the Internet. A buyer can get an idea of what an Antminer may do for him for a couple dollars without buying one upfront. If happy with the results, the goal then would be that they purchase the hardware from me. I have one now and in the process of purchasing more.
No. 167     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 12:22 AM     
LOL. Although very slow, I just learned how to make a smartphone mine bitcoin.
No. 168     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 6:33 PM     
I am now getting credited with Bitcoin on a daily basis for essentially free. Along with Namecoin, Devcoin, IXcoin. When these three accumulate to enough credit I will likely trade them for Litecoin.
No. 169     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 9:21 PM     
Funny how something can come into your life and turn things upside down so quickly.

As it stands now, Bitcoin appears to have maybe started an entirely new revenue stream for me that I can operate entirely from anywhere and easier than ebay.

I made contact today with overseas vendors representing a manufacturer of computing hardware. My data and quotes from them are prompting me to make a 180 degree decision on the contract reselling. Although being I have already purchased contracts of hosted mining time, I will continue to sell time until I recover costs of the contracts and then migrate them to mining solely for my wallet. I am running into issues with providers of cloud mining not being able to deliver as promised. When I find a good deal they seem to have some delay as to why they cannot now provide me the processing power. Two deals have fell through, one service I have paid for is having problems keeping their servers operating 24/7, another is doing just fine. But I am actually selling processing power from them rather than contracting it out. Buyer owns the hashing power once purchased from me and can do what they desire with it. Use it to mine, sell it, or trade it. In the meantime, until I have a buyer for the power it mines for me.

But it now appears I can obtain hardware directly from overseas at reasonable enough cost it appears it may be worth it to setup my own data center of owned hardware and sell processing time directly as well as mine my own currency.

I plan to order one processing unit from them in the coming week. Would have ordered it today, but the expected delivery would put it arriving when I am out of town and I do not want to chance FedEx just leaving it outside. FedEx Home Delivery often does such. So I will not place the order until mid-week.

If the processor performs per the specs they provided and I can make the thing operate 24/7, one stand alone unit should be able to mine $470-$600 worth of bitcoin per month if the value stays hanging in the $670-$800 per coin range. I am able to get the units at a low enough cost that in less than 30 days one unit pays for itself.

Of course I still need to get one in hand and put it to the test. I need to provide electricity and an Internet connection. These costs still need to be considered but I plan to contract enough processing time to others to more than cover those costs.

I have been in contact with a gentleman that owns 3 processors from the same manufacturer my units would be from. His units contain a faster chip making them about 60% faster than my units will be but they also cost about 7X what I will be paying per unit. Anyway, he claims to be clearing about $45 per day in bitcoin per unit. I crunched some numbers taking into account his processing power and I am not sure I believe him. Bitcoin would have to be around $1100 per coin to clear that much per day based on my calculations. I came up with that he is likely clearing $35 per day per unit.

If this unit works, is economical to operate, and reliable, I will purchase more. Otherwise it will end up on ebay where I see similar units selling for more than 5X the cost.
No. 170     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 9:39 PM     
BTW - The mining I currently have operating, on average, appears to be earning me $4-$5 per day. I have an out of pocket cost of $600 in contracts that I expect to earn back leasing out the processing time only until my out of pocket cost is redeemed. I have about another $350 invested in assets of which is recoverable if I shut down and sellout. The contracts I could feasibly continue to derive revenue from for 1 year with no further cost involved.

All said and done, I really feel like I set it all up for free. Profits from ebay funded the project.
No. 171     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 10:01 PM     
And I am not even taking into account what income may come from Namecoin, Devcoin, and IXcoin. I have not had the time to even research what they are or how much they may be worth. They simply keep accumulating in my wallet.

I am mining 3 pools. One of the pools offers what is called merged mining. I have not bothered to take the time to grasp all the details, but apparently when mining bitcoin your hashing power is not 100% utilized. They have setup up their pool were as this "idle" hashing power is used to mine other digital/crypto currencies and provide them as free gratis to the pool members. It is my understanding they soon plan to mine Litecoin in the same manner.
No. 172     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 8, 2014 at 11:16 PM     
Just minutes ago I finished communicating with another PCB prototype and small volume manufacturer in China. Their cost of hardware is simply more than I am willing to invest at this time. But they did inform me they have their own cloud mining hosting going online February 17th. They quoted me a cost lower per GH/s than the host in Texas that already failed me. Also said they would discount it another 5% if I become an affiliate as well as pay me a 5% commission for any business I send their way via the affiliate relationship. With the cost of their hardware and services that could add up to be quite a commission check.

I am strongly considering their cloud mining hosting. I am preparing to go out of state in a couple days for other business and simply have too much on my plate right now to commit to such a decision this evening. I would also like to give the Texas company one more opportunity just because I somehow feel more secure with the data center located here stateside. But with the Internet it really does not matter where the data center is located as far as the quality of the hashing power. In the past week I have used hashing power from so many different sources that I really have no idea where the servers and processors are located. Having said that, my issues with server down time has been with one of the most respected cloud mining hosts in the industry. They supposedly provide multi-redundancy with 6 data centers. IE: You should never be down. If the servers fail at one center you are supposedly automatically routed to one of the others. But I have experienced total loss of mining power with them over the past 24 hours several times. Hard to contract such unreliable service out to others. Would make me look bad. And the hardware is from one of the most respected manufacturers. Both supposedly located here in the US.

Anyway, I just crunched some numbers and it appears that for every $855 I invest in processing power from the China company, based on current bitcoin value, I can feasibly earn $402 per month. Pretty hard to get that kind of ROI on anything else right now. And that is if I use the power for bitcoin mining for myself only. I could also contract the power out to others and potentially earn more than $400 per month. At that ROI I may consider more than one contract with them. But I do not want to rush my decision. Need to pray about it.
No. 173     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 11, 2014 at 12:36 AM     
Completed my first transaction today selling bitcoin mining power to another. Actually, they made the purchase from me late Sunday night but I was not aware of it until Monday AM. But only took me seconds online to transfer the ownership to them.

But I did pull some of my listings today selling mining contracts. I have a family member having surgery this week as well as I need to go out of state before the end of the week. I needed to remove something from my plate. Was simply getting too many contacts and interest that I do not have time for right now. I even got messages today asking what I still had available after pulling listings. I thought I had it pretty well automated to were as someone simply needed to click on the link in the listing and they could go straight to the actual provider of the service, order it there, and the provider pay me 3% for the referral. But thus far they contact me directly to make the purchase and I then transfer ownership to them from my own inventory of mining power. Much more profit margin for me that way but I just do not have the time to deal with it at the moment.
No. 174     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 11, 2014 at 1:16 PM     
Bitcoin down to $643 average.

Maybe bad for some, maybe good for me. I am accumulating at lower value.

Short-term, the good thing is that I had already unloaded most that I had put up out of pocket cash for. Actually, I used it to make purchases when the value was over $800.
No. 175     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Feb 11, 2014 at 8:31 PM     
I have no longer been following this discussion for it has gone far beyond my own interest level, even though I was one of the first, if not THE first, to begin posting about Bitcoin on this site. Even so, this discussion might be interesting for most...


No. 176     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 11, 2014 at 10:09 PM     
Very interesting discussion. Schiff confirmed a lot of my basic thoughts and findings since I have become involved in bitcoin, but on others he is somewhat off base. Presents too many assumptions really having nothing to do with bitcoin. The other guy I felt presented more valid thoughts specifically related to bitcoin.

Bottom line, Schiff is communicating to be skeptical at this stage. Bitcoin is speculative. I agree. He even stated himself he should have gotten in some time ago but now appears to think there is more risk than reward potential. I personally think there is opportunity depending on how you go about getting involved and what you do with your bitcoin as you earn it.

I prefer my risk in bitcoin to be essentially free. Of which I am almost there. As of today, based on the current value of bitcoin. I am mining bitcoin at an average pace equivalent to earning $254 USD per month.

That is average income from mining. I am more than doubling my investment on selling hashing time to mine bitcoin, but not doing much of that at this point.

No. 177     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 11, 2014 at 11:38 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I am more than doubling my investment on selling hashing time to mine bitcoin, but not doing much of that at this point.




I no sooner than posted this when a customer purchased two contracts from me. If this continues, all of my out of pocket costs to set up mining will be reimbursed quickly.

It is a win-win transaction for Buyer and myself. Buyer can experience bitcoin mining without committing to a costly one year contract and/or does not have to invest in any hardware at all. If they like what they experience and opt to purchase more hashing time on the exchange, the exchange then awards me a 3% commission of whatever GHs the buyer purchases directly from them.
No. 178     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Feb 12, 2014 at 12:32 AM     
Darrel, are you putting yourself in the position of selling bitcoins to clients. I'm asking as I might, and I stress the word 'might', be interested at one point or another.
No. 179     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 17, 2014 at 9:11 PM     
Hey Brad, bitcoin could have been purchased for under $350 this past weekend. I got some that low. Now back up to over $600.

I actually acquired mine for free being what I got was mined when it was that low. I laid out no USD for it.
No. 180     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 17, 2014 at 9:40 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Darrel, are you putting yourself in the position of selling bitcoins to clients. I'm asking as I might, and I stress the word 'might', be interested at one point or another.



Indirectly at the moment. Possibly planning to do so directly later.

Currently what I am doing as far as marketing to others is either selling them or leasing them the processing power to mine bitcoin (today I used my hardware to mine two different other digital currencies for a customer). I am involved in this in three different avenues at the moment.

The most direct manner is I have purchased mining hardware and lease use of it by the hour. The customer does not directly and/or physically use my hardware, but they pay me to redirect my current mining effort to mine their bitcoin for a specified period of time. I simply log into my pc and enter their credentials which digitally reroutes my mining efforts to credit their account for bitcoin mined instead of my account. By the way, I purchased 5 stand alone high speed miners today that at the current value of bitcoin will pay for themselves in less than 2 weeks mining directly for me. I will experience even a much faster ROI using them to mine for others.

Alternative to virtual leasing of my hardware, I have purchased long-term contracts of processing power that is mining for me as well as being leased out to others for short periods. The contracts mine 24/7. They mine directly for me until I have a customer paying for some time.

And lastly, I outright purchase processing power that I own until I resell it. It actually has buy/sell value similar to buying/selling stock. I keep it mining directly for me with ads posted online offering it for sell. After they pay me, I simply log into my account from anywhere and transfer ownership to them via a voucher. They redeem the voucher at an exchange that immediately directs the power to mine for them. I sell some almost daily now.

Technically I do sell bitcoin as I convert my coin earned from mining to USD, but thus far I have only done this via the open market per my wallet and/or the exchanges. Operates quite similar to traditional stock/currency trading. Many had the opportunity this past weekend to acquire bitcoin at under $350 and within just a couple hours sell it for over $600.
No. 181     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 24, 2014 at 11:10 PM     
As of today, I finally have a "stand alone" (plugs into PC USB port but has its own processors, power supply, and cooling fan) bitcoin mining rig functioning. Only running at 4.4 GH/s at the moment but potentially capable of 66 GH/s as I plug in more processor chips and do not exceed the potential of the existing power supply.

I started with only one pair of processors just to "burn-in" and test the home built rig before I invested $$$ into more processor chips. Prior to this evening I had only been successful at getting the processors to mine individually. At least one would fail every time I attempted to bank them together. Today's testing was successful with multiple processors operating at same time. Been running smoothly and cool for a couple hours now, therefore I ordered more processors this evening.

Depending on which pool I deploy the rig to (actually I can mine 3 pools at once with this), I am able to mine more than just bitcoin. With plugging in different processors, I can even mine litecoin with the same rig. A pretty versatile setup. Probably not fast enough ROI to build for resale at this point, but I see people spending much more on much less efficient methods to mine virtual currencies.

Brad mentioned he likes looking at the rigs. She is not the prettiest thing, but here she is for something that can be thrown together cheaply and quickly and functions well. Setup was the only issue, getting the PC's USB port to see the USB hubs and recognize the multiple processors banked together in the hubs. She is about 8" X 8" at the base and no more than 7" high.

You really can have your own "goose" that lays golden eggs.










No. 182     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 25, 2014 at 1:45 AM     
Plans progressing faster than I anticipated. Posted my first ad this AM as a reseller of bitcoin mining hardware.
No. 183     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 26, 2014 at 11:18 AM     
By the end of the week, I should have enough hardware and/or contracts in place mining digital currencies that even at the current lower value of bitcoin, they should be producing $450-$600 per month not to mention the potential additional income from contract and hardware leasing and hardware sales. And for the most part the venture has funded itself.

I have other hardware coming that could double or triple that return, but not expected to arrive until May. I have another source in China that may be able to provide hardware sooner.

All said and done, after proving to myself this is viable, I am not sure it is a venture I desire to maintain. At least not all aspects. I have a couple young people inquiring as to what they may take over.

Network marketing is easier and potentially more productive for the time committed.
No. 184     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 26, 2014 at 3:40 PM     
I just deployed another 13.2 GH/s to mining bitcoin. Should have a piece of hardware in hand by Thursday afternoon that I can make mine litecoin.

Exchanged all my namecoin for bitcoin yesterday.
No. 185     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 26, 2014 at 10:10 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Darrel, are you putting yourself in the position of selling bitcoins to clients. I'm asking as I might, and I stress the word 'might', be interested at one point or another.


Storm - I am not sure what your goals are related to owning Bitcoin, but currently for about $18 I can set you up with your own cloud mining account with 1 GH/s of mining power. GH/s value varies continuously like the value of a stock, but lately averages less than $18 per GH/s. That is not much mining power and will mine very slow, but it is a cheap and easy way to earn a little bitcoin and learn the process without having to setup an account/wallet and directly buying bitcoin and/or setting up any hardware. Essentially you mine your own bitcoin virtually.

Some actually start with as little as .1 GH/s for much less money yet, but it will be a good while before you see much of any mining results. At least with 1 GH/s you will see some viable results within 24 hours. At bitcoin's current lower value, 1 GH/s will only produce about .09-.10 in bitcoin per day but again allows one an easy and low cost way to get their feet wet. It is basically a set it up and ignore it process. It mines 24/7 without you having to do anything other than add more processing power if desired.

No. 186     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 26, 2014 at 10:32 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:
Probably not fast enough ROI to build for resale at this point, but I see people spending much more on much less efficient methods to mine virtual currencies.




I am having second thoughts about my decision to not build these for resale. This rig was setup for personal use, but I am seeing similar rigs auctioned off on ebay for $200 to $300 that offer much less and do not look as good. I can probably build these for like $75 or less in material.
No. 187     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 27, 2014 at 2:27 PM     
Finally!!! It appears I have located a US based distributor of digital mining hardware that really has on hand what they say they do. Although I most often obtain price quotes from the overseas sources that cannot be beat, it is "hit and miss" as to if they can really deliver. Gets frustrating to think you have a deal in place and then open an email to find they have cancelled on their end of the deal. They either cannot meet the need or have been offered more money by someone else. Most give me some excuse like not being able to verify my payment, but when I go back to their website they are either no longer offering the item or have more than doubled, sometimes tripling, the selling price.

Thus far, the most reliable sources in this industry have been sellers on ebay.

Even with a distributor being US based, paying such distributors can be a real pain. Seems most will only accept bitcoin or a bank wire. Bitcoin is much more difficult to pay with at this time than the picture that has been painted, and many of these distributors are so new it is often difficult to get a bank to wire a payment to them. Even harder if they are out of the US. Many do not accept credit cards with some claiming they are a bitcoin based business and only desire to deal in bitcoin, with others claiming most merchant services providers will not approve them for credit card service being the typical scenario in this industry is that the buyer is pre-ordering hardware to be built and delivered at a future date. Appears some credit card providers are balking on approving payment for merchandise these days were as delivery is known to exceed a specified time frame.
No. 188     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Feb 28, 2014 at 7:32 AM     
No. 189     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 28, 2014 at 1:28 PM     
I have been somewhat of an amateur magician since I was a kid, and I have laying around many such little "props". But I do not have that exact same coin.

I do have 3 physical bitcoins and a Bitcoin T-Shirt.
No. 190     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 28, 2014 at 1:44 PM     
BTW - When I first started looking into this bitcoin mining stuff, the best prices I could find on hashing power was like $40 per GH/s. I now have that out of pocket cost down to about $7.25 per GH/s and potentially free if you lease out the power a time or two to recover your out of pocket cost. After such you are then essentially mining your own bitcoin for free.
No. 191     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Feb 28, 2014 at 10:49 PM     
Finally also mining Litecoin as of this evening. Have a little research to do to determine if it is worth it, but everything I read says it is more profitable than mining Bitcoin.

It was actually very easy to setup and get going once I had compatible hardware. I have read that most any PC video card will mine Litecoin, but I was not successful with getting any of my existing video cards to do so. I finally purchased a USB device that is functioning nicely.

And it cost me much less than installing a new video card that is capable of mining Litecoin.
No. 192     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 1, 2014 at 9:19 PM     
I have not crunched the numbers on litecoin mining yet, but bitcoin mining is now earning me about $12 USD/day at the current average value of $550/Bitcoin. I have one PC mining 24/7 which was already on 24/7 anyway and most the time the Internet service not being utilized. It is now. This same PC is also mining the litecoin. I am also mining 3 other digital currencies with my mining contract "idle" time.

Selling miscellaneous services related to bitcoin brought in about $1650 for the month of February and I was not fully engaged in that activity for the entire month. For about two weeks I sold a few contracts and hashing power. Now also selling mining hardware. I expect this to grow with the contacts I am getting requesting hardware quotes and delivery dates.

Mining revenue per day could be higher, but I sold off like 1/3 of my cloud hashing power which brought in more income than allowing it to mine, and used that income to buy more hardware.
No. 193     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 2, 2014 at 10:03 PM     
No. 194     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 10:00 AM     
insular926 wrote:





Those block erupters they are using in the video are already old technology. They once cost like $30-$40 each and may still bring $30 each on ebay. I can buy them brand new from one of my sources for $3 each.

I have several of the new, up to 5X faster than those in video, block erupters mining myself. I can get the new ones for as little as a 1/5 of what they are selling for on ebay. But there is more cost effective hardware for mining. Even though I sell those little erupters on ebay, for the most part I have moved on to more effective hardware. Those little erupters work well and reliably, but they simply cost too much unless you can find a wholesale source as I have.
No. 195     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 10:00 AM     
No. 196     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 10:44 AM     
I am not sure how old this Schiff video is. Good video except for maybe Schiff is simply not up to date. Bitcoin has already proven most everything Schiff shares in the video as inaccurate or misleading at best, except for the attributes he presents that render Bitcoin like gold.

I can agree with Schiff in that Bitcoin may not be something you want to be running out and spending $$$ directly on to accumulate and hold much long-term, but it can essentially be accumulated for free and readily converted to USD, spent today for goods and services, and our government is accepting Bitcoin as payment. Most of us cannot easily achieve all those factors with physical gold.

Bottom line, despite all the sound logic that can maybe presented against Bitcoin, Bitcoin is presenting a current opportunity that is attractive to many. Sure, Bitcoin may go "bust", but who really cares at this point? Someone has to be the pioneer and get the arrows in their back by moving forward rather than running away.
No. 197     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 11:06 AM     
Bitcoin or Gold, if I had a choice right now to take the same amount "in value" of Gold or Bitcoin, I'd take Bitcoin.
No. 198     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 12:29 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Bitcoin or Gold, if I had a choice right now to take the same amount "in value" of Gold or Bitcoin, I'd take Bitcoin.



I too would take the calculated and/or "educated risk" in Bitcoin.
No. 199     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 4:25 PM     
No. 200     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 4:49 PM     
From what I have been reading, other countries are far ahead of the US in general acceptance of Bitcoin even with ATM machines popping up for them. France has even declared Bitcoin a legal currency.

The amazing difference I see is that major chains in the US appear to be scrambling to accept Bitcoin much faster than individual merchants, especially with Bitcoin now having major corporate, investor, and financial names speaking out in support of Bitcoin and major International organizations backing Bitcoin.

In fact, there are many businesses now only accepting Bitcoin as direct payment and will only accept USD via a 3rd party method such as a wire transfer. I hear some saying that is not legal in the US, but recently I have personally had to wire funds to two different companies to pay for orders because I did not have enough Bitcoin confirmed in my account to make payment, therefore I wire transferred USDs to them to get my goods faster.
No. 201     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 9:28 PM     
I am only attempting to share what I know is valid about Bitcoin via my own personal experience.

This past weekend, my own daughter says like "I do not understand Bitcoin, but if you think it is a good thing, then I want in". I replied "I am not necessarily saying it is a "good thing" overall. I am saying there is a limited window of opportunity that my years of experience indicate there is worthwhile reward for the little to no risk involved to own some. To pass up such an opportunity is like saying computers will never be a household item, or no one will sit and use the Internet for hours, or like asking who really needs a cell phone."

As of yesterday, she is now earning Bitcoin for totally free. Of course she is using hardware that already paid for itself and I had already essentially abandoned other than I was still mining with it as it is listed for sale.
No. 202     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 11:41 PM     
BTW - I have not totally abandoned gold and silver. I own several gold, silver, and copper plated commemorative bitcoins like the following.


No. 203     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 3, 2014 at 11:49 PM     
An unplanned side benefit of my cube bitcoin miners sitting on the floor is that they make excellent little heaters. I have two of the following with more on the way. Not sure what this may render when warm weather gets here.





BTW - I get these direct from the overseas distributor for like 1/10 of what they sell for here in the USA.
No. 204     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 12:26 PM     
Brad - I am going to take back a little of what I shared about those little USB block erupters depicted in the video of the mining rig you shared. Although the erupters in that video are the older slower speed technology, I just received a shipment this AM of the new faster models and they indicate a lot of potential for the money. Especially for someone starting their mining out on a shoe string and cannot afford investing into such as a KNC miner. You can start out small and simply plug in more erupters as you expand. BTW - My shoe string mining has finally provided me enough return that I ordered me a 250 GH/s KNC this AM.

I currently have 18 of the little USB erupters plugged into my homebuilt rig. Although I intentionally have them clocked to run slower until I test everything out, they can be overclocked to 2.2 GH/s. Times that by 18 and you have 39.6 GH/s mining. Even though the little things can cost anywhere from $49 each to $99 each, if you shop right you can get them delivered for like $14.00 each which is what my last ones cost me. That is pretty reasonable per GH/s. A 30-38 GH/s block erupter cube runs over $300 for a used one to over $500 new. Of course you have to add good quality powered USB hubs and have a fan blowing on the little USB erupters to keep them operating non-stop effectively with as many as I have running at once, but they work reliably.

Prior to today I had 8 of them running 24/7 for a couple weeks. No issues whatsoever. I now have 18 of them going for an investment of about $300 including the 18 erupters, 3 powered hubs and cables, and fan. At the current rate of bitcoin such a rig will mine $107 per month minus whatever electricity may cost to run them, but these only require about 2.5 watts each compared to a block erupter cube requiring at least 200 watts not overclocked. More if you overclock it to run at 38 GH/s. So the little USBs are very efficient to operate. With the price of bitcoin edging higher the return will be faster yet. BTW - Plugged in along with those 18 erupters is 1 DualMiner erupter that is mining Litecoin. She is experiencing no issues functioning right in the same hub with the bitcoin miners. But this AM I did order a much higher speed miner for litecoin mining than the little DualMiner is capable of. The higher speed unit is also much more efficient making it worthwhile to mine your own litecoin. The DualMiner, at the current price of around $100+ each, serves as simply a learning tool or a novelty miner.

What I have been doing, as I get a shipment of hardware, I sell off enough to pay me back immediately for what I keep mining for myself. Essentially providing me my hardware for free.
No. 205     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 7:36 PM     
I finally have one PC setup as the sole GUI interface to all my mining. Never ever needed a new PC to begin with. What pushed me towards thinking I needed a new PC was that I originally attempted to mine with my old PC's CPU and/or video card rather than invest in specific mining hardware. Neither was powerful enough. A new video card was going to run like $300+. I opted to put such $$$ into a new PC hoping it would be capable of mining. The new PC cost me under $400 and is capable of mining, but only as a novelty. Too slow for mining without adding more hardware to it.

It took investing in mining specific hardware to make mining worthwhile. I have managed to make all such hardware work with the old PC. Essentially all the PC serves as is a visual interface to host the software to start and stop mining and visually display what is going on.

As time and funds permit, I do plan to build a custom stand alone mining PC just to say I done it. I think I can build a custom top of the line miner capable of 600+ GH/s for under $3000. I priced the parts today. To buy such a miner factory built is like $9000 - $12000. Even a used KNC 250 GH/s miner still brings well over $2000. My experience thus far indicates if you get can into hardware for less than $10/GHs, it is worth it to own your hardware and mine one of the pools. The hardware should pay for itself in 30-60 days. Otherwise, contract mining is likely more cost effective and much easier for most.

By Monday, my existing hardware should be bringing in over $800/month with the recent rise in BTC value. I am going to lose 3 days this week on setting up and tweaking hardware. Two major pieces of hardware will be likely sit idle the balance of the week. This week I have 3 full days of real estate classes with the local Than Merrill Group not to mention the evening homework and reading assignments.
No. 206     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 8:37 PM     
My Antminer U1 Rig.

Had more individual plug-in miners but I had to ship what was sold today.:

No. 207     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 8:41 PM     
My KNC Saturn 250 GH/s Rig:

No. 208     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 8:44 PM     
My Erupter Cube Rig @ 38 GH/s:
I have two of these with a 3rd on the way.


No. 209     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 8:47 PM     
My Technobit 24 GH/s Rig:

No. 210     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 8:51 PM     
And my one little DualMiner capable of mining Litecoin and Bitcoin, but I only have it mining Litecoin. I am in negotiations for a much larger and faster Litecoin miner:

No. 211     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 4, 2014 at 9:26 PM     
The faster Gridseed Litecoin miner I am attempting to negotiate a decent price on from a US based distributor. If they do not come through, I have arrangements in place to obtain them from an overseas distributor:




Added: Yeah! The US based distributor has accepted my price offer for these. Price per item is more than I can get them for from the overseas distributor, but they are going to ship them for me for free including any drop shipping to my buyers. Were as the overseas distributor is asking 10% more each for shipping, resulting in a total price per item considerable more than I can get them for from the US based guy. And the overseas guy will not drop ship for me resulting in me paying for shipping again to ship to my end buyer. I say guy. Most my experience has been that these Asian overseas operations appear to be owned and/or at least managed by females.

One is on the way to me for testing. I am sure it will work fine though. These are the most popular brand out there for Litecoin mining. Actually they are a dual miner and can mine both LTC and BTC. But mines faster to allow it to mine only one currency at a time.
No. 212     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 5, 2014 at 4:37 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My Antminer U1 Rig.




Without even fully overclocking it, I have this baby exceeding 30 GH/s. I have ordered a couple different powered USB hubs to see what kind of alternatives I may be able to configure with these and maybe offer an affordable and simple entry level but effective mining rig.
No. 213     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 6, 2014 at 4:13 AM     
This is starting to snowball much faster than I could have ever anticipated. I am currently on track for a return just shy of $1200 per month from Bitcoin mining alone.
No. 214     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 6, 2014 at 12:03 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My Technobit 24 GH/s Rig:




I have struggled to make this unit continuously run. Not sure what the issue is yet. At first, all indications were she was DOA. But I kept tinkering around changing settings and trying different mining proxies and finally got her to mine, but she keeps losing COM port connection. It may simply be an issue with my old PC only having 2.0 USB ports versus 3.0 USB ports. Not to mention I really have the PC loaded up with USB devices. She currently has 23 functioning devices plugged into her USB ports.

If I could keep this little unit operating, she is supposedly capable of 24 GH/s and requires low power which would render her quite a bang for the $$$ invested. That would be the least I have paid yet per GH/s. Thus far, about 21 GH/s is all I have been able to achieve and that is with overclocking the processors.

I can easily home build these units obtaining the components out of Europe, but I need to be confident they are reliable and easy to setup before attempting to market them.
No. 215     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 6, 2014 at 2:29 PM     
Appears I have resolved the COM port issue. Prior to this AM I could not make the Technobot mine more than about 30 minutes without a COM disconnect. This AM I took one port and configured it only for the Technobot. No failures since.

Now that she is operating continuously, the speed is improving as time and "burn-in" progresses. Without overclocking she is now achieving 22 GH/s. That is more in the neighborhood of what the component specs indicate can be achieved.
No. 216     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 9, 2014 at 5:44 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

This is starting to snowball much faster than I could have ever anticipated. I am currently on track for a return just shy of $1200 per month from Bitcoin mining alone.


Crossed that $1200/month threshold sooner than thought I would. Was at the $1200/month pace as of this past Friday evening. Not to mention having now moved almost $4000 in mining hardware in just one week.
No. 217     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 9, 2014 at 8:08 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My KNC Saturn 250 GH/s Rig:




I have only had this miner operating since Friday. Fantastic stand alone miner. Once configured and started via accessing the IP page on the Internet, she only needs to maintain being powered and having an Internet connection. In fact, she does not even connect to my PC via hard wiring at all. Runs quiet, no overheating issues, no loss of connection issues, she simply keeps on mining at about an average of 260 GH/s.
No. 218     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 10, 2014 at 4:07 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

The faster Gridseed Litecoin miner I am attempting to negotiate a decent price on from a US based distributor. If they do not come through, I have arrangements in place to obtain them from an overseas distributor:






This arrived when I was gone over the weekend, thus held by USPS. Picked her up today. Got her running. She is supposedly capable of mining litecoin 4-5X faster than my current litecoin miner. I have not had her running long enough to collect enough data yet. Thus far not even coming in at 2X faster and using much more power to do that.

I have been doing some research that indicates I should be able to operate her on 1/10 the current power draw. But my tweaking efforts thus far cause communications to fail. So at the moment, I am back to the manufacturer provided version of the program that configures her at high power consumption.
No. 219     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 11, 2014 at 2:07 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

The faster Gridseed Litecoin miner I am attempting to negotiate a decent price on from a US based distributor. If they do not come through, I have arrangements in place to obtain them from an overseas distributor:






This arrived when I was gone over the weekend, thus held by USPS. Picked her up today. Got her running. She is supposedly capable of mining litecoin 4-5X faster than my current litecoin miner. I have not had her running long enough to collect enough data yet. Thus far not even coming in at 2X faster and using much more power to do that.

I have been doing some research that indicates I should be able to operate her on 1/10 the current power draw. But my tweaking efforts thus far cause communications to fail. So at the moment, I am back to the manufacturer provided version of the program that configures her at high power consumption.



Finally got her mining at more than 5X my original litecoin miner. Now mining at 300+ KH/s. That is a fantastic speed for such a little miner. 10 of these things can be banked together and run as 1 miner. Also got her way down on the voltage draw. Which means I can easily rig 1 power supply to feed all.

Ended up using totally different mining software than the recommended version to achieve the above. Why such a difference I do not know.
No. 220     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 11, 2014 at 11:12 AM     
Yeah, the little litecoin miner is cruising now. So well that I think I am going to sell the little USB DualMiner. May continue to use it until profits buy me another Gridseed.

On occasion the Gridseed does lose communication with the USB/COM port, but that is more of an issue with using these off the shelf PCs than the miner itself. Most every off the shelf PC I have ever owned has proven to have unstable USB/COM ports if you load them up. In the process of building a custom PC. The basic parts are all here. Just not enough time to do all. Have to set some priorities.
No. 221     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 3:23 PM     
Maybe my mining hardware had to like go through a "burn-in" period or something. For several days I would come back home to find one of two of them not mining for usually loss of communication with the COM port or the mining pool. All have been mining stable for the past day or so now. No issues. Knock on wood.

Piling up bitcoin and litecoin now.
No. 222     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 9:21 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

The faster Gridseed Litecoin miner I am attempting to negotiate a decent price on from a US based distributor. If they do not come through, I have arrangements in place to obtain them from an overseas distributor:




These are the most unique little miners of all I have tried. Although able to mine both Bitcoin and Litecoin separately and/or at the sametime, they are not cost effective for Bitcoin. But they are worthwhile for Litecoin and other cryptos that require a Script miner.

I am going to take one more stab at mining Script with video cards being it appears less costly to do so, but if it does not workout, I am going with these. I should have a shipment of these in hand by next week anyhow being I am going to resell them. Getting lots of requests for them. Not much profit margin on them, but they are very popular miners. Users like to bank 10 of them together for one Litecoin rig.
No. 223     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 10:05 PM     
There are currently hundreds of crypto currencies out there right now with the experts reporting we are on the verge of a new introduction and acceptance of many other than Bitcoin and Litecoin. Technology is also in the works to make the most popular work seamlessly together.

Dogecoin is now supposedly the fast and upcoming favorite. It just came on the scene in December. Dogecoin and its IBM developer have already amassed a $130+ Million fortune.

http://www.fastcolabs.com/3024889/dogecoin-is-now-more-popular-than-all-other-cryptocurrencies-combined

http://www.dailytech.com/Dogecoins%2Band%2BIts%2BIBM%2BDeveloper%2BRide%2BMeme%2Bto%2B130M%2BFortune/article33960c.htm
No. 224     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 10:21 PM     
I have seen a lot of used bitcoin mining hardware out there being dumped at bargan basement prices as to what it sold for new. The users have become scared that if bitcoin loses popularity and/or becomes more difficult to mine, they are going to be left holding obsolete hardware that cost them thousands.

Since I got involved I have picked up mining rigs for 50% of what they cost brand new as recently as November.

Recent positive news on crypto currencies is now driving the price of the used hardware up to more than it cost new. I have hardware I purchased as little as 30 days ago selling for more than I paid for it after I have used it for a month to mine crypto for myself.

What many of these dumpers of hardware have overlooked is that if they bought right to begin with, the hardware should have more than paid for itself by now. And it does not matter if the hardware was for bitcoin and/or litecoin mining, it can easily be reconfigured with as little as a download to make it mine the new currencies.

Many of the sellers of the hardware claim to simply be selling off their old hardware to upgrade to the latest and greatest. But from what I read on the mining forums, many are selling out of fear of losing money on something that should have more than already covered its cost and can still unknowingly be used effectively.
No. 225     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 11:18 PM     
Overstock.com has announced they will soon start accepting Bitcoin as payment.
No. 226     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 14, 2014 at 11:40 PM     
LOL. I was more intrigued with crypto mining when setting up the hardware and software kept me engaged. Now I sit here bored with all of it operating effectively and smoothly.

I am getting online contacts from others requesting me to assist them with sitting up their hardware and/or if they are buying the hardware from me, they are asking me to configure it prior to shipping.
No. 227     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 15, 2014 at 12:19 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My KNC Saturn 250 GH/s Rig:




If I were inclined to risk the funds, I would have as many as these mining as I could afford. This has been the easiest to setup, the fastest, most reliable, and most efficient miner I have used thus far.
No. 228     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 16, 2014 at 4:36 PM     
I have made a pre-manufacture purchase of 20 of these Black Arrow Prospero X-1s. They are stand alone miners and operate at 100+ GH/s. I have already sold 15 of them and they will not even be available to ship until May. I plan to order at least 10 more.

No. 229     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 17, 2014 at 12:55 AM     
Wait! You're now SELLING A Bitcoin Antminer on EBAY?

Tell me about what it does, deal?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AntMiner-U1-BitMain-1-6-GH-s-2-2-GH-s-ASIC-USB-Bitcoin-Miner-/281286813356?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item417e0026ac
No. 230     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 17, 2014 at 1:19 AM     
insular926 wrote:

Wait! You're now SELLING A Bitcoin Antminer on EBAY?

Tell me about what it does, deal?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AntMiner-U1-BitMain-1-6-GH-s-2-2-GH-s-ASIC-USB-Bitcoin-Miner-/281286813356?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item417e0026ac



I sell more than one miner on ebay with plans to be selling others soon.

This particular miner plugs into a USB port. You need to install drivers so that the PC can see it, and then install a free program such as CGMiner to make it mine. The default speed is 1.6 GH/s but it can be overclocked to run at 2.2 GH/s. It gets hot when overclocked, therefore it is recommended to cool them with a fan. I have ordered heat sinks to install on the ones I personally mine with.

At 2.2 GH/s it would take at least 6 months before such a little miner pays for itself if purchased at retail price. At current Bitcoin value 2.2 GH/s results in just over $5 USD/month. But many are banking them together in powered USB hubs to get more bang for the $$$. For example, I have 18 of them banked together producing over $90 USD/month and I am not paying retail for them. This particular device will mine Bitcoin and any other currency based on the same hashing.

I also have a similar USB device that will mine Litecoin and Bitcoin, and any other currency based on the same hashings. I have not quite decided yet if it is cost effective. It is not cost effective for Bitcoin for sure.

All my personal Bitcoin miners together are producing over $1200 USD/month and all hardware has essentially paid for itself. I have two Litecoin miners producing over $50 USD/month and that is with the value of Litecoin drastically down at the moment. These miners have not yet paid for themselves.

All said and done, my ROI is currently much more on selling the mining hardware than from mining. But it is only going to take a minor spike in the value of Bitcoin and/or Litecoin to change that picture.

I am also mining like 4 other digital currencies, but I do not daily track them.
No. 231     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 17, 2014 at 5:53 PM     
Ordered more of both of these miners today. Selling more of the Black Arrow model than I can get my hands on.




No. 232     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 17, 2014 at 8:57 PM     
BTW - when I purchased the miners from the manufacturer today I created my own discount. They quoted me a price in USD. When I was preparing to wire the funds I noticed I could pay in British pounds and did so for an actual out of pocket cost of less USD. I thought that was pretty cool.
No. 233     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 18, 2014 at 12:04 PM     
The next International Bitcoin conference will be right here in the USA in New York in April. It will be the largest such conference to date with over 80 speakers and 19 countries participating. There is currently more positive interest and support of Bitcoin than there has ever been in its history.
No. 234     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 18, 2014 at 12:27 PM     
I will be involved in a lot of real estate activity over the next several days to a couple weeks, but I am going to try and attend this upcoming conference. It turns out that many that run in the same business/investment circles that I do have a great interest in digital currencies. They are looking to me to provide answers and info being it appears I am about the only local follower that has forged out there and stepped into the water.
No. 235     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 18, 2014 at 3:23 PM     
Going to have to order 10 more of these. Sold my own today. I desire to personally have 5-10 of them mining for myself.

No. 236     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 19, 2014 at 1:44 PM     
Just for something to do, I went out and about this afternoon scouting around for available commercial buildings that I might open a computer hardware store in specializing in the hardware required to mine digital currencies. I have not been able to find any such physical store in the state of Michigan.

We have one local private owned store that sells the hardware to build your own PC and/or will build you a custom PC, but even they are lost when I mention specific hardware I need for building a mining based PC. Although unbeknownst to them, they do carry the name brand power supplies and video cards required.

Actually, a really powerful PC like I was originally led to believe is not required. It comes down most to what do you want to mine. If Bitcoin based currencies, then you may simply need support for a lot of USB and/or COM ports for external hardware to be connected. If Litecoin based mining, a good power supply/supplies and several video cards may be all you need.

Many are desiring to see such hardware being used for mining before buying. The little research and experience I have accumulated thus far indicates a great interest in the industry, but simply no where local to go and see the required hardware first hand. For that matter, in this area, we are down to only one store that caters to the true computer hardware hobbyist. Otherwise, you have to make the drive to one of the large college towns such as Ann Arbor and/or Lansing.

I cannot hardly attend any kind of business conference that has nothing to do with digital currencies whatsoever, that at the lunch breaks and evening gatherings the discussions do not end up being about how to acquire and hold Bitcoin and/or digital currencies. The next day someone new will invite me to lunch and start out saying like "hey, so and so tells me you are mining bitcoin".
No. 237     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 19, 2014 at 8:32 PM     
Despite the value of Bitcoin edging downward, my Bitcoin revenue from mining has edged upward. I am now producing $50+ per day or over $1500 per month. This is realized in the pocket money. At this time, I hold little more than $1000 in Bitcoin value at any one time. I quickly convert it to USD or spend it. This past week I have purchased goods totaling around $900 USD using Bitcoin as payment.

Revenue on the other currencies is so little at this time I do not bother to calculate the return.
No. 238     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 19, 2014 at 8:51 PM     



Added one of these this week to the Bitcoin mining operation. Capable of at least 200 GH/s. I need to collect a few days of data, but initial impressions are this will be my most effective piece of hardware to date.
No. 239     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 19, 2014 at 11:11 PM     
Reconfigured one piece of my hardware this evening just to see if I could make it mine Dogecoin. It works. Currently mining away for Dogecoin.

Wow! I am not even running the hardware at full speed and the pool is reporting out that at my current rate I will produce 1300+ Dogecoins per day.

But that only amounts to about $1/day at Dogecoin's current value.

Back to Litecoin for this rig.

I have a slower rig, probably do 500+ Dogecoins/day. I may reconfigure it and allow it to slowly accumulate Dogecoins.
No. 240     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 1:06 AM     
I now have the slower rig mining Dogecoin. I will allow a couple thousand of the coins to accumulate and sit on them.

The pool indicates an estimated production of at least 513 coins per day. I have not yet attempted to overclock the processor and see if she can do more.

Thus far, I have been successful with overclocking every miner I have except this one and my KNC Saturn. Both have mined so well as is that I have not attempted to overclock them.
No. 241     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 10:23 AM     
For some reason the little miner mining Dogecoin shut down on me during the night, but I have going again.

Currently have almost 100 Dogecoins.
No. 242     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 10:27 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Going to have to order 10 more of these. Sold my own today. I desire to personally have 5-10 of them mining for myself.




I now have 24 of these things ordered. Ordered more this AM. They did not allow me to create myself a discount this AM by paying in British pounds or any other currency for that matter, other than Bitcoin and USD. The option to pay in other country currencies would not even display today. LOL.
No. 243     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 1:16 PM     
I just got back home from a luncheon meeting on my potential plans to open a local store geared towards digital currency mining. The meeting went well. Have some wanting to write me checks today. I declined the offers to invest at this time.

I did come back home and ordered more of the same miners as I ordered this AM. At the least, the potential investors each want one and I did accept payment for 4 of those. I have also contacted the distributor requesting a better price. They claim they can knock another 10% off and another $26 off per unit if I desire to arrange my own pickup and/or shipping. But the things will be arriving into the country from customs in Colorado. Might be worth it to let them keep the $26 each and they ship them for me. I don't know. I am not adverse to maybe renting a truck and vacationing in Colorado a few days while making the pickup.
No. 244     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 2:01 PM     
Here is one of the things that amazes me most since I first started importing and reselling International goods.

Since selling the 4 miners this AM, I have received a new offer out of South Korea requesting to buy. I countered with a higher price than they offered. But most these things essentially come to me directly from China. Maybe they will not talk to each other.

I am only dealing with the Colorado distributor for some I need in hand ASAP. Otherwise the manufacturer in China ships directly to me. In fact, I just ordered another Litecoin miner from the Colorado distributor minutes ago because they can ship today. They also presented me a considerably lower price on those this AM along with a better price on the Bitcoin miners.
No. 245     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 4:06 PM     
The South Koreans apparently did not like my counteroffer, but they need to agree to buy a higher quantity before I will sell for less.
No. 247     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 8:49 PM     


Finally got this baby to cranking out litecoin at 400+ KH/s. Ordered another one today. I eventually want 10 of these mining for me unless I can make something else mine litecoin more effectively before I acquire 10.
No. 248     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 20, 2014 at 8:53 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

The South Koreans apparently did not like my counteroffer, but they need to agree to buy a higher quantity before I will sell for less.



This evening the South Koreans counteroffered back, but I declined their offer altogether and raised my posted bottom selling price.

Some computer store in the United Kingdom made me a full price offer on a couple of them though. I sold to them. They paid me this afternoon via PayPal.
No. 249     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 21, 2014 at 12:48 AM     
Setup my Dogecoin wallet today.



No. 250     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 21, 2014 at 11:33 AM     
400+ Dogecoin accumulated.
No. 251     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 23, 2014 at 6:39 PM     
Wow! I am now mining at a rate capable of producing just shy of $2000 Bitcoin per month at the current average value. Accumulating about $65 per day.

Two of my miners are mining other than Bitcoin. Maybe I should redirect all mining efforts to only Bitcoin.
No. 252     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM     
Just about to exceed 1000 Dogecoins, then putting that miner back to Litecoin.

Has taken longer to mine them than estimated due to the PC losing COM port communication with the miner. But I think I have finally figured out why. Somehow when my PC did an automatic update it appears the power saving features got reset back to the defaults. Thus after like 30 minutes of thinking no one was using the PC, it was going to sleep. Such appears to coincide with losing the COM ports. I reset to never go to sleep, and have not lost communication since.
No. 253     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 24, 2014 at 9:31 AM     
Transferred my 1000+ Dogecoin to my wallet and moved the little miner back to Litecoin.

This AM I started researching other crypto mining pools other than the couple I use. Specifically checked out those that offer merged mining or mining more than one crypto at a time. I discovered a new pool that partakes in a quickly growing trend called multi-pooling. Multi-pooling is a pool that offers many cryptos available to mine through their pool and you switch to the one you desire at the time. The Litecoin pool I mine is such a pool.

But this new pool offers an auto-switching feature. It monitors crypto values and targets the one offering the biggest bang for the effort at the time, and if the trend is stable and/or growing for a specified minimum amount of time, with a pre-approved authorization by you to do so, it automatically switches you to mining the best ROI crypto available at the moment. The site even goes a step further by also providing you the option to immediately exchange crypto as earned to your preference whether that be another crypto or USD.

Many if not most that mine other cryptos, are often only doing so because the one they are mining offers the best ROI at the moment and then exchange that crypto for Bitcoin or Litecoin because those two are currently considered the two most stable and the ones that will be around for sure if any cryptos remain viable. This particular mining pool automates that process.
No. 254     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Mar 24, 2014 at 8:43 PM     
You might be interested in the following, Darrell:


BITCOIN EXPO 2014

http://bitcoinexpo.ca/



Let's Talk Bitcoin!
overseas radio network

http://overseasradio.com/lets-talk-bitcoin/
No. 255     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 25, 2014 at 1:49 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

You might be interested in the following, Darrell:


BITCOIN EXPO 2014

http://bitcoinexpo.ca/



Let's Talk Bitcoin!
overseas radio network

http://overseasradio.com/lets-talk-bitcoin/



Thanks Storm. I have every intention of eventually attending one of these.

There is one in New York first week of April and I had plans to be there. But I just got a call from upline today related to my MLM business asking me to make sure I am available and not out of state on April 5th so that I can help with some major training to downline on new services we are introducing in Michigan.

This one you share of not being until like April 14th may be more doable for me. It may also be a more worthwhile expo to attend being Canada and many other countries are considerably ahead of the US in acceptance of Bitcoin and quickly putting the infrastructure in place to efficiently process the transactions and exchanges. It is my understanding there are already Bitcoin ATMs in Canada. But if I am not mistaken, the first US Bitcoin ATM is being installed in New York in April.
No. 256     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 25, 2014 at 2:02 AM     
I would have never seriously believed it until setting up all my own mining rigs, but I have read many are actually heating, at least assisting, their homes with the heat generated by their miners.

When you walk into my family room, which is where my miners are currently located, you can definitely feel the difference in room temp from leaving the living room. Could be an issue come summer.

But I am actually looking at getting a building to setup mining in or at least migrate the things to one of my garages, if I can get Internet service to one of them.
No. 257     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 25, 2014 at 9:40 PM     
Back to mining a little more Dogecoin. I now own 3 miners capable of mining the Scrypt based cryptos. At the moment I will leave 2 mining Litecoin and 1 mining Dogecoin.

I have 14 miners mining Bitcoin and/or SHA-256 based cryptos with another rig that consists of 16 USB miners banked together mining Bitcoin. The GH/s capacity of this rig varies because it serves as my "burn-in" and "testing" rig for the little USB miners. I test all hardware for functionality before shipping to buyers, therefore this rig always has new hardware flowing in with the tested hardware shipping out.

Some miners are mining for me while I have others contracted out on short-term leases mining for others. Leasing the hardware out is very fast way to recover their cost.
No. 258     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 25, 2014 at 10:48 PM     
I may start offering long term mining contracts as some of the 30 stand alone miners I have ordered start arriving. They are not expected to be here before last week of April to as late as mid May. But manufacturing and engineering have both reported to me they are currently ahead of schedule and have overcome recent "glitches". Looking at ordering 10-20 more. They pay for themselves quickly. 6-8 weeks if used for personal mining only, much less time if leased out. In fact, the first 30 have paid for themselves and I do not even have them yet. Potential buyers have already fronted me the money for first come first serve for when I am ready to release them.

I have simply found it too difficult to offer long term mining contracts with miners that are PC dependent. Seems as soon as you turn your attention away they shut down for some reason. Were as my current 4 stand alones have been pretty much plug n play and do not rely on 24/7 operation of my PCs. I can shut the PCs down, leave, and these babies keep on mining 24/7 with pretty much no attention required. I am attempting to implement remote access so that I can be most any where and reconfigure them to mine whatever for whomever as needed remotely.

Subleasing my own primary contracts has not proven reliable either. The data processing centers I lease from are down often. I have only one such pending contract remaining and it may be difficult to get me down that path again. Took me 10 hours today to get my 4 leased mining contracts mining again. Actually only took me like 10 minutes, I gave them 10 hours to resolve it and they failed. I had to rewrite the protocol myself and upload it to their data center to get the hardware mining. The data center personnel seem to lack the know how to do such things. Amazing.

Having said that, I am investigating establishing my own data center for mining. The local governments are already attempting to lure me to pick my location in their jurisdictions. Investigating grants and tax breaks. They all seem to be open arms to Bitcoin and see a very viable digital currency future whether it be Bitcoin or something else. There is a lot of versatility in the industry for switching gears easily to whatever the winner is if positioned correctly. At the moment, with just a couple edits to the config file I can mine pretty much any known SHA256 or Scrypt crypto out there.
No. 259     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 12:23 AM     

http://news.msn.com/science-technology/bitcoins-taxed-as-property-not-currency-irs-says
No. 260     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 12:29 AM     
insular926 wrote:


http://news.msn.com/science-technology/bitcoins-taxed-as-property-not-currency-irs-says


"This is going to be unfavorable to bitcoin miners because they're going to have to include in income the fair market value of the virtual currency on the date they mined it," said William Lewis, a lawyer in Sunnyvale, California, who represents a start-up company creating a platform for virtual currencies.

"It's going to make life difficult for a lot of people who have been mining over the past year, who have to go back and see what the values were on those dates when they mined it."




Interesting. I already knew this was coming. I just did not know to what extent and variation. I am happy to pay income taxes. Only I like to do it late and owe as much as possible without getting hit for any penalty.

Pertaining to the quote from the article. Should not be unfavorable or difficult as stated.

How can it be any more unfavorable than it may already be to earn an income by any other means? Anything else earned is taxable income too. I can think of a lot of other things I would rather not be doing to earn an income.

I get an email with every deposit to my account for mined Bitcoin stating the deposit value in USD at time of credit. It is a deposit receipt stating the value of the Bitcoin at time credited to me.

We have become a Nation of "whiners and complainers".

Other than Denise, I do not know anyone in the USA from another country that "whines and complains" like we Americans do.
No. 261     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 12:58 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:
Took me 10 hours today to get my 4 leased mining contracts mining again. Actually only took me like 10 minutes, I gave them 10 hours to resolve it and they failed. I had to rewrite the protocol myself and upload it to their data center to get the hardware mining. The data center personnel seem to lack the know how to do such things. Amazing.



Appears they are making an effort to compensate for the 10+ hours of downtime. They have my existing 4 contracts mining at more than 4 times the normal speed, thus producing more than 4 times the normal rewards.
No. 262     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 1:27 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:


http://news.msn.com/science-technology/bitcoins-taxed-as-property-not-currency-irs-says


"This is going to be unfavorable to bitcoin miners because they're going to have to include in income the fair market value of the virtual currency on the date they mined it," said William Lewis, a lawyer in Sunnyvale, California, who represents a start-up company creating a platform for virtual currencies.

"It's going to make life difficult for a lot of people who have been mining over the past year, who have to go back and see what the values were on those dates when they mined it."




Interesting. I already knew this was coming. I just did not know to what extent and variation. I am happy to pay income taxes. Only I like to do it late and owe as much as possible without getting hit for any penalty.

Pertaining to the quote from the article. Should not be unfavorable or difficult as stated.

How can it be any more unfavorable than it may already be to earn an income by any other means? Anything else earned is taxable income too. I can think of a lot of other things I would rather not be doing to earn an income.

I get an email with every deposit to my account for mined Bitcoin stating the deposit value in USD at time of credit. It is a deposit receipt stating the value of the Bitcoin at time credited to me.

We have become a Nation of "whiners and complainers".

Other than Denise, I do not know anyone in the USA from another country that "whines and complains" like we Americans do.



Kind of reminds when everyone was whining and complaining about the IRS requirements implemented that require ebay, Amazon, and the others to issue 1099s for what sellers gross. Everybody took a woe is me attitude about having to pay their legal share of taxes on earning an income.
No. 263     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 12:33 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Back to mining a little more Dogecoin. I now own 3 miners capable of mining the Scrypt based cryptos. At the moment I will leave 2 mining Litecoin and 1 mining Dogecoin.



Resolving the COM failure issues has made a big difference. It took me over 2 days to mine 1000 Dogecoin the first time I tried. This time I have already mined almost 1000 in less than 12 hours.
No. 264     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 26, 2014 at 4:21 PM     
Not sure why the drastic overall increase in mining speed, but this 1000 Dogecoin was racked up quickly. Back to Litecoin.
No. 265     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 27, 2014 at 2:37 AM     
insular926 wrote:


http://news.msn.com/science-technology/bitcoins-taxed-as-property-not-currency-irs-says



The really good news about this is that the Feds have now established a precedent recognizing that such as Bitcoin does have legal accepted value in the US. In fact, Bitcoin value increased some with the news being released.
No. 266     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 28, 2014 at 9:46 AM     
Yes, the heat generated is significant. Since I fired up the last two miners that arrived this week, I am maintaining 80 degree temperature without my furnace coming on at all. In fact, for comfort reasons I have already had my air turned on this AM. And still have one more miner that just arrived to fire up with another on the way.
No. 267     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Mar 28, 2014 at 11:43 AM     
The Fierce Battle for the Soul of Bitcoin

By Robert McMillan
03.26.14
6:30 AM







Before most people had ever heard of the digital currency bitcoin, Brian Armstrong, a 27-year-old engineer at the home-sharing website Airbnb, thought it could make him a lot of money. At the time—spring 2012—Airbnb was moving a reported $500 million in payments annually in 192 countries through a patchwork of financial networks, and each one claimed a transaction fee. An anonymous, encrypted, government-free online version of money would simplify all that. It would be faster, more secure, and vastly cheaper.

The problem was that the things that made bitcoin attractive also made it bewildering for noncoders. Using it required balky and hard-to-use software called a wallet. Bitcoins were also a challenge to obtain—mostly you had to purchase them from middlemen who operated in the regulatory shadows and who sometimes turned out to be crooks. The money was hard to spend, because few merchants accepted it—the currency was just too new. Armstrong realized that the way to widespread acceptance of bitcoin was a user-friendly wallet.

He wasn’t the only one thinking about bitcoin’s broader potential. On a discussion forum about the currency, Armstrong met Ben Reeves, a British programmer who ran a bitcoin transaction-tracking website called Blockchain. Reeves understood the technology and was well respected within its tight-knit community of enthusiasts. He had been using bitcoin for a year already and had even built a bitcoin wallet that 10,000 people had tried out. Reeves also wanted to see the currency gain more traction. The two men hit it off and started spitballing ideas for a new kind of company: a PayPal for bitcoin. It would serve as a trusted broker of the cryptocurrency, taking a 0.5 percent charge anytime anyone converted dollars to bitcoins or vice versa. But spending money within the bitcoin network would be essentially free. With a digital wallet and payment-processing services, you could, say, pay that cash-only cab driver with bitcoins via your smartphone. They pitched the concept to the prestigious and highly selective tech-company incubator Y Combinator—and within hours had an invitation to join the class of summer 2012.

But the relationship soon ran into trouble. Armstrong felt that in order for bitcoin to gain mass acceptance, users who lost their wallet passwords would need a way of recovering them. That meant their new company would have to retain access to users’ private keys—the 64-character access codes that convey bitcoin ownership. Without that access, users could forever forfeit their entire bitcoin fortune as easily as forgetting their password.

Reeves disagreed completely. The whole point of bitcoin was that it put the person with the bitcoins in control. If you gave some company access to your bitcoins, you were essentially trusting it as you would a bank. It could lose them to hackers or, worse, steal them outright. These rip-offs were already an all-too-common occurrence in the nascent bitcoin world. If Reeves and Armstrong’s company maintained a backdoor into all of its customers’ wallets, it would be only a matter of time before the government began issuing subpoenas. Yes, the current system meant that users took on more risk, and that would probably turn off some of the more casual ones. But bitcoin wasn’t meant for them anyway. Though Reeves planned to build a currency for everyone, he wanted to start with the geeks. “There simply are not that many reasons why the average person would want to use bitcoin,” he wrote.

The hammer fell just 48 hours before Reeves was supposed to get on a plane to fly to Silicon Valley. Armstrong’s email was diplomatic, even kind. Still, like all breakups, it hurt. “Cofounding is really like a marriage,” Armstrong wrote, “and even though I think we have mutual respect for each other, we don’t work together extremely well.” Armstrong cut Reeves off from their shared online accounts. “I think we have pretty different aesthetics around what sort of product to build,” Armstrong wrote. He was going to Y Combinator alone. Reeves was out.
No. 268     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 28, 2014 at 4:50 PM     
In essence, what the Bitcoin Network boils down to is little different than if the Federal government opted to contract out the printing of US dollars. Instead of directly paying private printers for their cost, time, and effort invested into printing the currency, the contract is the printer is to absorb all cost involved to print the currency. Payment is the currency belongs to the printer in lieu of their efforts and costs involved to print the currency, regardless of current market value whether that be up or down, at time of printing.

The Bitcoin Network operates little differently. If not for those investing their own money, time, and effort to mine Bitcoin, Bitcoin would not exist. Same pretty much goes for all digital currencies in general.
No. 269     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 28, 2014 at 6:15 PM     
I am starting to acquire quite a local following of those interested in Bitcoin. This past Thursday I was asked to attend a luncheon and provide my mining and investment experience with Bitcoin. That was my second such luncheon. Yesterday and today I spent time at the request of others sharing my experience in mining Bitcoin. Mostly young folks that barely appear to be 21 if even 18. Initially, such were a source of info for me, albeit a source I quickly learned that did not know what they did not know, but the tables have turned with them seeing me actually having a successful system in place.
No. 270     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 28, 2014 at 10:18 PM     
The value of Bitcoin has taken a little bit of a hit the past couple of days, thus keeping me from breaking over that $2K/mo target. If the value were to get any where close to where it was when I started mining, I will easily exceed $3K/mo using hardware that is already considered old technology in currency mining. But it has more than paid for itself. Now only requires electricity and my tweaking now and then. Running into some occasional conflicts between the hardware itself. Too many pieces that require a PC to keep them going. I do not have a server, I am operating essentially a mini data processing center with 2 PCs. The hardware resources are limited. The stand alone miners I have arriving by end of April to mid May should eliminate such issues and I will start selling off the hardware that is too PC dependent. In fact, almost every day I sell at least 1 pc of existing USB dependent hardware. But I find myself buying more because it does sell easily and I mine with it until it is sold.

Different story for Litecoin. Does not appear cost effective to mine it yourself at this time. Possibly is if you already own a PC that already has a gaming quality video card installed. Such video cards can easily be used to mine such as Litecoin and Dogecoin. They can mine Bitcoin too, but very inefficiently. A good video card probably taxes your PC's power supply by at least 300 watts.

Otherwise, I see some potential to effectively mine Litecoin with banked Gridseed miners that only require 7 watts each and if I can make one power supply power all. The recommended power supply is too costly to buy one for each miner. I own 2 Gridseeds. I need about 10 of them and need to negotiate a better price than they currently demand, power all with one source and then it might be cost effective to mine some Litecoin. Of course if the value jumps up like Bitcoin did, it quickly becomes cost effective to mine Litecoin.

The entire scenario is prompting me to more seriously consider one of the multi-pools that automatically changes to mining the most profitable currency at the time. Nobody in my circles want to be the "guinea pig". Looks as if it is going to have to be me, same as the rest of this has went. But I really have nothing to lose other than my time to set it up and the opportunity cost of possibly not continuing to mine "as is", but mining "as is" is possibly less profitable than multi-pool mining.
No. 271     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 12:18 AM     
My third Gridseed arrived. I now have three miners mining Litecoin. Turns out I was able to power the two larger and faster Gridseeds with existing PSUs I had laying around here. One is being powered with the PSU from my drone LiPo battery charger while the other is on an old HP monitor PSU I found around here. Now I can take the $100 PSU I just purchased this AM and get my money back. Has not been opened. I am working on a multi-cable that will allow me to power several Gridseeds from one standard PC PSU.
No. 272     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 12:27 AM     
That now leaves me with only one miner that I cannot operate without incurring conflicts with existing operating hardware. If I use 3rd PC or my netbook or my tablet I can get her mining. Not that ambitious at this hour and not sure it is cost effective to run another device 24/7 to get one little miner going. It is only costing me 24 GH/s to not operate her. She is probably going to find herself on the pages of ebay. Good little low capacity miner though. I have ran her leased out to others with low GH/s needs.
No. 273     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 7:59 PM     
Starting to rethink whether Litecoin is worth mining or not. Getting the 3rd Gridseed online has made a big difference in production. And I do not have these babies overclocked. Was afraid I might burn them up and they are costly pieces of hardware. Anyway, some noticeable shares of Litecoin are now accumulating. If nothing else, these Gridseeds banked together would quickly result in a substantial amount of Dogecoin.
No. 274     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 10:00 PM     
LOL. I was just sitting here and thinking how embarrassed I would be for others to stop by and see all the computers, hardware, cables and wires from one side of the place to the other spread throughout 3 rooms.

But I have people asking to stop by and personally see the mining rigs.
No. 275     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 10:12 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My Technobit 24 GH/s Rig:




I just posted this rig for sale on ebay. When I did the functionality test, she mined very reliable and stable and can easily be overclocked. But she just does not fit in with the rest of my existing hardware and future plans. I am quickly migrating towards much faster and greater capacity hardware that is not PC dependent. Although the manufacturer of these just offered to swap out the chips for the latest and greatest for free, I am not going to bother with it. Will provide someone on ebay a good deal "as is".
No. 276     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 29, 2014 at 10:41 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:The entire scenario is prompting me to more seriously consider one of the multi-pools that automatically changes to mining the most profitable currency at the time. Nobody in my circles want to be the "guinea pig". Looks as if it is going to have to be me, same as the rest of this has went. But I really have nothing to lose other than my time to set it up and the opportunity cost of possibly not continuing to mine "as is", but mining "as is" is possibly less profitable than multi-pool mining.



I setup a multipool account today but did not deploy any miners to mine there yet. While reading through their info, it became apparent to me that they always share what they are currently mining. At the moment, I have opted to simply switch my miners from currency to currency manually, but use what the multipool is currently mining kind of like a guide and/or recommendation as to what is more profitable to mine at any given timeframe.

At the moment, for Scrypt they are mining Dogecoin. For SHA256 they are mining Bitcoin. Those are considered the two most profitable to mine at the moment depending on your hardware. I own hardware capable of mining both and I can manually change them at will. Therefore, at this point I am not sure if the multipool really offers me any advantage over the pools I already mine, unless they happen to offer better merged mining. Still researching.
No. 277     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 30, 2014 at 12:11 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

That now leaves me with only one miner that I cannot operate without incurring conflicts with existing operating hardware. If I use 3rd PC or my netbook or my tablet I can get her mining. Not that ambitious at this hour and not sure it is cost effective to run another device 24/7 to get one little miner going. It is only costing me 24 GH/s to not operate her. She is probably going to find herself on the pages of ebay. Good little low capacity miner though. I have ran her leased out to others with low GH/s needs.



Wow! I now have no idle hardware. After mustering the ambition, I could not stand the fact a piece of hardware was sitting there not earning its existence, I tackled and resolved the hardware conflict issues with the Technobit. She is now mining stable and faster than she has ever produced.

Now that only leaves a video card in my most recent PC. I have not tried that one. It takes more wattage to operate most video cards than it is worth attempting to mine with them, but if the PC is already on 24/7 anyway, why not try? Maybe Sunday.
No. 278     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 30, 2014 at 1:38 AM     
OK, I was able to make both the video card and the CPU in my most recent PC mine. For Litecoin it actually mines 1.5 X faster than my little USB miner. But uses much more power to do so. The little USB miner only requires like 2.5 watts were as I bet the GPU in the PC is requiring like 300 watts. But then again, if the video card is already powered 24/7 anyway, why not allow it to mine in the background.
No. 279     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 30, 2014 at 6:19 PM     
LOL. I am starting to see people advertising their mining rigs at ridiculously low prices claiming such as "the weather is getting warmer and I do not have AC". I know where they are coming from.

I am contemplating, if I do not obtain somewhere else to mine from, closing off one room to locate all the miners to, and provide separate AC to that room versus running the central AC so much to keep the entire place cool enough for the miners. I knew they were going to put out some heat, but it is more than I anticipated even with having considerable experience with PCs, servers, and data centers.

I don't know. I am one that even prior to the miners ran my central AC pretty much all spring and summer anyway. Learned a long time ago it cost far less to start her up, draw out the heat humidity once, and keep her that way all season long versus to start her up and shut her down several times throughout the season starting from ZERO each and every time.
No. 280     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 31, 2014 at 7:44 PM     
Some new hardware arrived today. I am now over one Tera hash of processing power mining digital currencies. If the value of Bitcoin alone gets back to where it was in February, at that rate I will be producing over $90 per day in Bitcoin. But I have ventured off and using some of the power to mine other currencies. I have not really crunched the numbers myself to calculate the return. Simply relying on what others in the industry are saying is the most profitable to mine at the given time. Really, I am not putting a lot of merit into those strategies. They are only accurate if you are essentially switching to the most profitable at the time, but also unloading it in a very short time frame after mining. I have actually made out better on the less popular currencies by mining a couple thousand coins and holding them until the value goes up. For example, this weekend I mined a lot of Dogecoin. The value was up almost 50% today versus if I had unloaded upon mining over the weekend. Today was the better day to unload.

I would have more processing power yet, but I sold off some hardware and even gave some away this afternoon. But I have 3 TH/s combined in hardware on order and just completed some communications today in prep for ordering more hardware. The trick is to not allow the hardware to sit idle, turn over existing hardware quickly, always replacing hardware with the next latest and greatest. With that strategy, you most always have hardware mining for you free of cost except for the required electricity. Such is essentially what the largest mining entities in the world are doing. It works for the little guy too.

This industry is in a constant state of fast change pushing for improvements in computer processing power more likely so than any demand in the history of digital technology.
No. 281     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Mar 31, 2014 at 10:46 PM     
These miners are turning out to be the best employees I have ever had work for me.
No. 282     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 1, 2014 at 2:48 AM     
Ordered another Gridseed miner this AM. This will increase my capacity to mine Litecoin or any other Scrypt based currency by 33.3%.

I finally devised a method and got the hardware together to bank several Gridseeds together, up to 20 per controller. I currently have 1 controller ready. Created using a Raspberry Pi device and Linux code. My research indicates the controller provided by the Gridseed manufacturer is not reliable and can only handle 10 devices when it does work. Therefore I sought out a different method to control several with one device resulting in the Raspberry Pi. It simply required some customized code to make it suitable for the task.

The Gridseeds only require 7 watts each if I dedicate them to mining Scrypt based only. Which is all I desire to do with them. Then I can power several from one power supply. I have the cables ready to connect 9 as soon as I get that many miners in hand. Rather than just run out and buy them all at once, I am buying them as I mine enough currency with my existing hardware. Allowing the venture to continue to fund itself.
No. 283     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 1, 2014 at 2:58 AM     
The beauty in my method of doing this, is that it does not really matter to me if the bottom is falling out of crypto values or if the value is skyrocketing to the moon. It is nice for the value to shoot up, but on the other hand, when the value bottoms there could not be a better opportunity for a miner to load up and hold.

It really does not matter what the value is doing. Value drops you simply increase mining productivity because prices drop on the hardware. The value goes up you cash in, sell some hardware off, take a break and save some electricity, whatever. You benefit value up or down.

And cryptos are not going away.
No. 284     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 2, 2014 at 8:54 AM     
I just read this AM that as of mid March there are International businesses now accepting Bitcoin, Litecoin, and Peercoin. I have never mined any Peercoin for myself, but I have used my hardware leased out to mine it for others. Maybe I better take a closer look at it for myself.
No. 285     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 2, 2014 at 11:14 PM     
From my Bitcoin profits I purchased some new more appropriate power supplies for my Gridseeds. These power supplies are more stable allowing to overclock the processors. Those babies are sure mining some Litecoin now. Cannot wait to see what they do with Dogecoin.
No. 286     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 2, 2014 at 11:52 PM     
I have ebay Buyers requesting to now pay me with Bitcoin and/or Litecoin. I am working on setting up the front-end to be able to easily do so.
No. 287     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 3, 2014 at 1:15 PM     
I am not sure if there has been a drop in the difficulty factor or the "luck of the pool" has improved, but the Bitcoin miners are really cranking out some coin this week.
No. 288     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 3, 2014 at 2:52 PM     
Had an Internet outage this afternoon shutting down all my mining except for my 5 contract miners out in the clouds. Comcast provided an estimate of 4 hours down time, but 30 minutes later I was back up. At least the third time this week being down.

I was already investigating a backup provider and have the hardwire landline already installed. Probably going to have to be AT&T DSL. That is what I installed at my Mom's. It is much less costly than Comcast and has been 100% reliable for over a year now. Were as I experience Comcast being down 3-6 times per week. Comcast used to be the best. No more.

Yes, DSL is somewhat slower, but I do not require blazingly fast Internet.
No. 289     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 4, 2014 at 4:17 PM     
bitty coin
No. 290     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 4, 2014 at 5:36 PM     
Well, I have opted to not head off to this weekend's digital currency convention in New York. I was torn between two choices, the convention or helping one of my network marketing friends/peers who is here from South Carolina, and who happens to be one of the company's most successful independent business owners each of the past 6 years and has only been involved 6 years, host local meetings on the opportunity this weekend.

I was headed to New York with plans to leave last night if my daughter's fiancé had not contacted me early in the day yesterday that he is coming to this weekend's local network marketing events. I am considered the leader in the state of the leg he is a prospect of and now feel even more obligated to remain here for those events.
No. 291     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 5, 2014 at 12:12 AM     
Today I was contacted and asked to be a contributing writer for a website on mining digital currencies. Could be fun but not sure about my available time. This all came about by being asked a mining question on ebay about a problem someone was having with hardware an software. I provided like 3 causes and solutions. Next thing I know solving a problem for someone else and then a third. Turns out the first guy owns a website on digital mining.

I was asked a while back to do the same for one of the major suppliers of drone parts. They have even asked me to publish videos of the progress of my projects were as am using their components. I have simply not had the time to take away from other priorities.

Amazon on many occasions has asked be for similar to the above. I have done some writing for them as time permits. Most often it has been related to drones, computers, and/or electronics.

Hey, maybe I can just copy and paste everything from here over to there.
No. 292     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 6, 2014 at 3:25 AM     
"Commodity banks and cryptocurrencies will render central banks desolate -Free the currency, free the people."
No. 293     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 8, 2014 at 7:59 PM     
Online vendors that have started accepting Bitcoin as payment are reporting as much as a 3X sales increase in sales versus sales from customers paying with USD.

I know hardly a day or two can pass without even someone on ebay contacting me and asking if I can accept Bitcoin and/or Litecoin.

On the other hand, many online Sellers and vendors are offering as much as a 10% discount if you will pay with Bitcoin and/or Litecoin.
No. 294     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 10, 2014 at 12:28 AM     
Initiated the process for me to be able to accept Bitcoin as a merchant. Still researching a manner to accept Litecoin. Was hoping for a one stop take care of all option but it appears few have jumped on that bandwagon thus far. Buyers are seeking a PayPal type experience to spend their Bitcoins and Litecoins and few to none offer such at the moment.
No. 295     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 10, 2014 at 1:10 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Initiated the process for me to be able to accept Bitcoin as a merchant. Still researching a manner to accept Litecoin. Was hoping for a one stop take care of all option but it appears few have jumped on that bandwagon thus far. Buyers are seeking a PayPal type experience to spend their Bitcoins and Litecoins and few to none offer such at the moment.



Ironically, the features that make digital currencies attractive to the tech savvy, are hindering its acceptance with the non-tech savvy.

The extra step or two involved that renders a digital currency transaction as being extremely secure and likely the most secure financial exchange that can be made online, is not welcome by the average very impatient consumer.
No. 296     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 10, 2014 at 4:54 PM     
Wow, earlier today it looks like it dipped to 400.00 or better.
No. 297     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 10, 2014 at 11:38 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Wow, earlier today it looks like it dipped to 400.00 or better.


Bitcoin has been in the $400s for several days and is actually now in the $300s. Has caused quite a flood of low cost mining hardware to be available.

I think the recently announced income tax consequences have pushed many out of Bitcoin, especially those that were benefitting for something for nothing. Resulting in the most recent price drop. Ironically the income tax consequences is great news for the potential of Bitcoin and other digital currencies overall. It could not have received any better support at this time.

At the moment I have a greater ROI leasing out my hardware to mine for others versus using it to mine for myself. But there is also a line of thought by many that now is the time to max out mining with the cost of hardware low and accumulate and hold as much Bitcoin as possible. Personally, I either spend and/or liquidate my Bitcoin almost daily. What I was holding I unloaded early this week at like $460 per coin and vendors are offering too much bang for the coin to make it worth holding at the moment. Many provide a 10% or more discount for simply paying with Bitcoin. I am currently holding Dogecoin and Litecoin.

Exciting time to be a digital currency miner.
No. 298     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 11, 2014 at 10:00 PM     
Sold a lot of mining hardware and mining contracts this week. The drop in value has obviously not scared the interest in Bitcoin away.
No. 299     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 12, 2014 at 11:40 AM     
Really cranking on the Litecoin mining right now. I have 6 miners mining Scrypt with 4 more on the way to me. I did just sell one of the low speed Scrypt miners which will leave me with 2 low speed miners and 7 high speed miners for Litecoin and Dogecoin.

I will order more of the low speed miners simply because they easily resell, the cost is low, and they will mine for me until sold.
No. 300     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 12, 2014 at 2:12 PM     
COLUMN-A fair view of the Koch brothers, and explaining bitcoin

Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:10pm EDT
(The opinions expressed here are those of the author, a columnist for Reuters.)
By Steven Brill







(Reuters) - (This is the latest installment of Steven Brill's weekly column, "Stories I'd Like to See.") 1. Getting a full, fair view of the money behind the Democrats' prime enemies:

Their company makes everything from Dixie Cups to Brawny paper towels to Lycra swimwear to a huge share of the plywood, lumber and other products used in construction. It operates 4,000 miles of energy pipelines, according to its website, and an array of oil refineries that can process 670,000 barrels of oil a day.

Other subsidiaries are leading producers of chemicals, fertilizer and electronic and fiber optic systems. Still another unit trades energy products such as crude oil and natural gas. Apparently (the website is vague) it even has a business buying and selling the emission allowances related to pollution control efforts throughout the industrialized world.

The website takes pains to note the company's stunning economic success - its value has grown "more than 3,500 fold since 1960" - "has supported education and social progress. These philanthropic efforts include support for educational institutions, foundations and programs that study and promote market-based solutions to societal problems. [The company] also works to protect, conserve and enhance natural resources. companies around the world have earned nearly 800 awards for safety, environmental excellence, community stewardship, innovation and customer service."

In fact, there's a separate section on the website detailing the company's multiple environmental protection efforts and awards.

What company is this that's supporting all these seemingly good works with its profits? It's Koch Industries, controlled by Charles and David Koch, the billionaire brothers who are funding hundreds of millions of dollars' worth of ads attacking Democrats this year - mostly aimed at putting conservative Republicans in control of the Senate.

An article in the Washington Post last week tried to link the Koch brothers' support for the Keystone energy pipeline to their company's economic interests. But it was so lame - none of their products is due to go through the pipeline - that it made me want to read a complete article, full of unbiased reporting across the range of their business interests. I want to know just how self-interested the brothers' political spending spree actually is.

Sure, any political activism by rich people to limit taxes and government regulation is bound to be in their interests generally. But do the Koch brothers have a more specific agenda, as the Post article tried to prove? Or could it be that Charles and David Koch just happen to believe a conservative government is good for their country?

The brothers and their foundation have also given hundreds of millions to multiple charities that have nothing to do with politics. As an article in the Indianapolis Star points out, the Charles Koch Foundation "underwrites research and teaching at Brown, Mount Holyoke, Sarah Lawrence, University of Wisconsin at Madison, Vassar and some 245 other colleges." The New York State Theater at Lincoln Center has been renamed the David H. Koch Theater because he's such a generous benefactor.

These are not beneficiaries associated with hard right causes.

As the Star also notes, "Koch Industries (which offers same-sex spousal benefits to its legally married employees) also donated $814,000 to the Kansas State University Office of Diversity to assist 'historically under-represented students.'"

Is this all part of a plot to camouflage the brothers' master plan? Or could it be that their outsized effort to buy results at the ballot box is, to them, no different from their outsized gifts to Lincoln Center or cancer care or anything else they think is good for the world?

Much of the media and punditry seems to have entertained that more generous view when another billionaire, Tom Steyer, decided to give millions to anyone willing to block the Keystone pipeline. But the Koch brothers have not enjoyed that benefit of the doubt.

For a few individuals on either side to try to dominate the agenda this way in a supposed democracy raises its own fundamental questions - and arguably shows a cavalier disregard for democracy itself. But the opposition to the Koch brothers has pushed beyond that, to accusations, in Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's words, that they are "un-American" and are "trying to buy America  to benefit themselves."

As a private company, not much is known about Koch Industries, although its website says it has 60,000 employees and annual revenues of "about $115 billion" - which would make it 16th or 17th on the Fortune 500 list of public companies, just ahead of IBM or JPMorgan Chase.

A full-bore look inside the conglomerate would produce all kinds of interesting angles before we even get to the question of whether the brothers' political spending is a wholly self-interested investment by people who care only about themselves. To take one narrow example, what kind of health insurance do employees get at the company owned by the brothers who have financed tens of millions of dollars of attack ads on Obamacare, using fictitious accounts of people victimized by the law?

But the larger question, answered only by a complete look at their businesses and the link between them and the political causes they are funding, is whether the Koch money firehouse is, at its core, their version of an investment in a better planet or, as opponents like Reid charge, a better profit and loss statement. 2. Someone please explain bitcoin:

Okay, I admit it. Although I consider myself a fairly sophisticated businessperson and reporter, and although I have read a ton about bitcoins, I have no understanding of what they are, how they work or are supposed to work.

Please, don't tell me it's "virtual money," or some such thing. Tell me exactly how a bitcoin system is supposed to operate. What is virtual money? Yes, I know that the dollars in my pocket are virtual money - because they're just pieces of paper. But I also know that they're universally recognized and guaranteed by a signature from the Treasury secretary to be "legal tender."

Who is supposed to be standing behind bitcoin and why would anyone believe it's worth anything?

A New York Times story last Saturday about the "miraculous discover of about $116 million in missing Bitcoin" got me frustrated all over again.

Here's the key sentence:

"In a posting on its website in both Japanese and English, the now-defunct Bitcoin exchange Mt. Gox announced that it had found the coins in an 'old-format wallets,' the virtual currency equivalent of finding money in another pair of pants."

Do you know what the means? Or do you just think you should because it's in the Times?

It's time for a sophisticated journalist who can write and speak jargon-less English - like Floyd Norris of the Times, or Jim Cramer of CNBC, or maybe even Michael Lewis - to help us. (Steven Brill)
No. 301     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 12, 2014 at 2:39 PM     
insular926 wrote:
Here's the key sentence:

"In a posting on its website in both Japanese and English, the now-defunct Bitcoin exchange Mt. Gox announced that it had found the coins in an 'old-format wallets,' the virtual currency equivalent of finding money in another pair of pants."

Do you know what the means? Or do you just think you should because it's in the Times?

It's time for a sophisticated journalist who can write and speak jargon-less English - like Floyd Norris of the Times, or Jim Cramer of CNBC, or maybe even Michael Lewis - to help us. (Steven Brill)


Makes perfect sense. If I am not mistaken, the oldest versions of Bitcoin wallets out there did not actually store Bitcoin online. It is stored offline and is still considered by many as the safest method to hold your Bitcoin. But most find it inconvenient.

I have not been involved all that long, and even my first wallet does not store my Bitcoin online. It is stored offline and essentially subject to me losing it, forgetting where I put it, whatever. I can easily see how something could happen even on a large scale such as Mt. Gox especially with it being fairly new territory for everyone involved.

The "finding money in another pair of pants" is very legit. I have more than 6 digital currency "wallets".

Apparently the author of the article has not read any where near as much on Bitcoin as he claims.
No. 302     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 13, 2014 at 1:48 AM     
Well, the storm this evening knocked out Comcast Internet for about 4 hours. That meant mining with my physical hardware was "dead" for 4 hours. Cloud mining continued flawlessly though.
No. 303     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 13, 2014 at 6:45 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Well, the storm this evening knocked out Comcast Internet for about 4 hours. That meant mining with my physical hardware was "dead" for 4 hours. Cloud mining continued flawlessly though.


We're supposed to get some really big storms down here in Texas Way this afternoon and I'm feeling it could be bad because it's been "monstrously windy" here for the last few days.
No. 304     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 14, 2014 at 11:34 PM     
And Comcast advertises that one of their big advantages over DSL is that bad weather does not take them out. Well, it sure does around here. I have never been aware of my DSL to be down in almost 2 years now. Comcast is down every few days.
No. 305     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 14, 2014 at 11:41 PM     
Wow! Bitcoin value back over $450. That slipped past me. I just happened to go to my wallet to spend some this evening and the balance was much higher than I anticipated.
No. 306     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 15, 2014 at 9:46 AM     
All of a sudden this AM I notice the cost of hardware move back higher and there is more interest in buying mining contracts. Price of Bitcoin has jumped back to just shy of $500 this am.
No. 307     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 15, 2014 at 11:38 AM     
Something going on. I have been busy helping others do their income taxes, get IRAs in place and funded, and other income tax related kind of stuff the past couple days and have not kept my ear to the ground related to Bitcoin. But something has garnered more interest in it and Liteoin.
No. 308     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 19, 2014 at 10:47 PM     
Started mining some Peercoin today. It appears to be about the 4th most popular digital currency at this time.
No. 309     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 19, 2014 at 10:58 PM     
Actually, I just noticed that Peercoin is now the third most popular with something called Ripple now in 4th place, with Dogecoin dropping down to 5th place. Of course Bitcoin and Litecoin are still number one and two respectively.

Until today, I had never heard of Ripple.
No. 310     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 19, 2014 at 11:10 PM     
The most interesting new comer is called Mastercoin, just rolled out in March this year, and is already ranked 6th of all digital currencies.

Actually, I am confused as to what Mastercoin really is, a coin or simply an exchange of coins. But it is ranked 6th of cryptocurrencies?

Hmmm, appears it is a coin, you cannot directly mine them. Appears they already exist as one of the altcoins possibly created while mutually mining Bitcoin. Not sure I grasp it yet, but their value is over $70 per coin right now.
No. 311     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 19, 2014 at 11:35 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Started mining some Peercoin today. It appears to be about the 4th most popular digital currency at this time.


Well, it appears I have not successfully mined any Peercoin. The pool appears to be down. Moved this miner back to Litecoin.
No. 312     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 20, 2014 at 7:41 AM     
Bitcoin seems to be very volatile, I wonder just how hard it would be to buy at a low point and then sell at a high point?

I imagine that tons of people are trying to sell at A High Point and many of them don't end up selling because of too many hesitant buyers.
No. 313     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 20, 2014 at 10:40 AM     
insular926 wrote:

Bitcoin seems to be very volatile, I wonder just how hard it would be to buy at a low point and then sell at a high point?



It is very easy. I do it often. I buy under $400 and sell over $500. It regularly runs this range. Easy to buy and easy to sell.
No. 314     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 22   on  Apr 21, 2014 at 7:05 PM     
I cannot keep the little miners in stock. They sell quickly.

Large miners starting to move, but I keep my prices at the high end of the market range. Not real anxious to sell them being they are already mining for me as they sit here in inventory, but as they go I simply order another.

Packaged a large one up this AM to ship off to Algeria. Shipped a small one to UK today.
No. 315     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Apr 30, 2014 at 11:41 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:




Shipped my last one of these today. I do not plan to obtain any more unless the wholesale cost really comes down. They are simply no longer efficient to mine with. Same with the Techno-bits. I no longer plan to offer those either.

People still clamor to buy these as a low cost and easy manner to become involved in digital currency mining, but simply no longer worth my while personally.
No. 316     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Apr 30, 2014 at 12:09 PM     
What is the cheapest setup one can go with, with mining?
No. 317     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Apr 30, 2014 at 12:39 PM     
insular926 wrote:

What is the cheapest setup one can go with, with mining?



Kind of depends on what you want to mine, but for Bitcoin the cheapest setup is simply downloading one of the free software programs and utilizing either your existing CPU or video card to mine with. But unless you have a latest and greatest CPU and/or top of the line video card, most are going to find this an inefficient manner to mine, but you get into mining for essentially free.

Next would be to purchase one or more of the simple and low cost little essentially "plug n play" USB miners, but you will not mine very much very quickly without banking many of these together. But you can get one for under $20.

BTW - There are some contract mining services were as you do not have to own and/or directly operate any hardware, but mine for as little as about $2.50 per GH/s for 5 years or more.
No. 318     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Apr 30, 2014 at 1:51 PM     
I know of many that are currently mining but it is costing them more to mine than they are currently earning, but their goal is that the coins they are currently accumulating will increase in value more than covering their current losses to mine.

If it were not for the fact that I actively turn over my hardware, effectively mining for only what electricity cost me and even then I lease out enough hardware to cover that overall cost, it would also be tough for me to break even with Bitcoin under $500 per coin. When I started it was over $900 per coin. The value per coin does not really impact me so much as far as at least making a profit, for I have devised a process to essentially mine for free. However low the value of Bitcoin goes, I am still in the black for I am accumulating Bitcoin for essentially free. If the value goes up, that is icing on the cake.

Currently, from mining alone, I effectively earn about $50 per day with the hardware I use to mine for myself. I also lease out some hardware earning me more per day than it would mining at current coin value. I also have my Litecoin mining going on, but have simply not had time to crunch the numbers and see if that is operating efficiently or not. I am pretty sure it is costing me more than the value I currently mine, but I expected that going in. The value is expected to eventually go way up for Litecoin more than offsetting the initial investment.

Not to mention all the new digital currencies coming online that the same hardware can be used to mine. Effectively, the digital currency networks pay you to mine the currencies into existence the same as the Feds might pay a printer to print new dollars.
No. 319     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 3, 2014 at 12:21 AM     
In all my experience thus far, the following two opportunities are likely to be the easiest methods to become involved in bitcoin mining. They both provide you a way to get involved in mining without the need to buy, maintain, and power your own hardware.

Not sure which I like best. I currently use both as I migrate my personal mining efforts to "autopilot". At the moment, the first is the lowest cost per GH/s of the two to become involved, can start for less than $12 for a 5 year contract. The second cost more, but you own the mining power for life, can sell it, trade it, give it away.

My experience has been, regardless of which one you go with, as time passes hardware drops in cost and the mining difficulty factor increases, thus mining power becomes less in value.

The first is currently the lower cost method of the two to be in control of more mining power immediately for less cost.


http://pbmining.com/?ref=dlmmining/0/


https://cex.io/r/2/dlmmining/0/


If they have not recently changed, both of these require you to pay them with bitcoin to get started. That can be a starting hurdle for some. Seems many merchants/vendors simply now assume we all have BTC as readily available as we do USD with many new merchants only accepting BTC. Acquaintances of mine desiring to get started right away, have exchanged a few dollars for the required bitcoin and/or GH/s with me to initially fund their accounts.

Keep in mind this is not a get rich quick scheme as the media has maybe made it sound to many. Yes, there is some easy and potentially much money to be made if bitcoin drastically increases in value, but in the meantime, it requires a substantial amount of mining power to accumulate much bitcoin in a short period of time. For example; at the moment 100 GH/s of mining power earns about $3.00 per day at bitcoin's current value.

You can go to the following mining calculator that can give you a "ballpark" idea of how much mining power is required to earn whatever your goal may be to earn via mining:

http://www.alloscomp.com/bitcoin/calculator
No. 320     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 3, 2014 at 10:23 PM     
The world’s first ever Bitcoin job fair was announced today. The increasing popularity of crypto currencies has spawned a shortage of those with specific skills desired in the arena.

I also read today there is a quickly growing number of companies that will pay you your salary in crypto currency if that is what you desire.

BTW - Wisconsin's Alderman accepted Bitcoin contributions to support his state assembly run.

Overstock.com is holding back 10% of all bitcoin payments they receive for investment potential.

I have been invited to, as I am sure many others also have been, a Bitcoin Mastermind Summit.


No. 321     Reply: Re: Bill Maher on Bitcoins   
By:  jadefox   Gender: F   Age: 55   on  May 4, 2014 at 1:51 PM     
No. 322     Reply: Re: Re: Bill Maher on Bitcoins   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 4, 2014 at 7:15 PM     
jadefox wrote:




Funny, but it is possibly some inaccurate info. Supposedly hackers really did not steal the coins from the exchange he was referring to. The coins have since been found in "old" Bitcoin wallets right where they were deposited. And someone possibly committed suicide related to this oversight.
No. 323     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 5, 2014 at 9:42 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

My KNC Saturn 250 GH/s Rig:




Sold this miner, if the guy ever pays me. Therefore I have not shipped yet. In the meantime she continues mining for me. This has been one of the best and most reliable pieces of hardware I have encountered. But already outdated compared to what is currently available. And I am in efforts to commonize hardware making it easier and faster to swap in and out as an existing piece sells and a new piece arrives.

Despite selling her for only 1/3 of what I paid for her (I gave the guy a great deal on her but mining and leasing has more than returned my original cost), what I got for her is enough to buy 4 newer technology miners.

This brand has a following thus maintaining intrinsic value based on the goodwill of the company, reliable support, and a lifetime warranty no matter how many times resold. KnCMiner is one of the first manufactures to provide reliable mining hardware. They are out of Sweden. They have a rep of under promising and over delivering. She is a solid performer but I cannot justify keeping her when the funds she can immediately bring in by being sold can be put to use earning almost 4X what she currently earns for almost the same utilities used and floor space occupied.
No. 324     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 11, 2014 at 4:39 AM     
I am seeing comments posted in the crypto currency forums were as people have stated they have been making bitcoin transactions at ATMs since mid April.

Not sure how widespread this is yet, but just this AM I seen that you can now exchange Bitcoin for currency at traditional banks.
No. 325     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 11, 2014 at 4:47 AM     
I am now producing enough Bitcoin that every 4 days of mining provides enough income to purchase 1 of the most popular miners available at wholesale. I then turn around and sell the miner. I do not need anymore on hand for myself at this time. In fact, I already have like 30 in transit to me.

I have enough miners currently operating that it keeps my main living area temp without air conditioning running at 106 degrees. I need to get this operation moved to an alternative facility as soon as possible or dismantle and migrate 100% to cloud mining.
No. 326     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 12, 2014 at 1:56 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:
I have enough miners currently operating that it keeps my main living area temp without air conditioning running at 106 degrees. I need to get this operation moved to an alternative facility as soon as possible or dismantle and migrate 100% to cloud mining.



When I got back in town this evening after all the Mother's Day celebrating, I tackled this heat issue from the miners.

My daughter is currently working out of town and is now rarely here overnight. Therefore her bedroom is currently not used.

After doing a temporary installation of some 12 gauge electrical wire into her bedroom (existing wire inside the walls cannot handle the load) and running an Ethernet cable out one window and into another (the things can be operated on a wireless LAN but hardwire is more efficient and more reliable) I relocated all the large BTC miners to her bedroom. These are the high wattage pieces of hardware thus produce the most heat.

Just moved the last one a few minutes ago. Heat in the main living area has considerably dropped as well as noise. I never realized how much noise all those little fans were making. Guess I got use to it. But the heat and humidity was becoming unbearable. Was probably helping with weight loss though. I can now close off my daughter's bedroom and use it as a sauna.

I have some high wattage LTC miners arriving this week. I will likely install them into that bedroom also. That will only leave me with some low wattage miners in the family room but they are all destined to be sold and shipped soon.

Looking forward to sleeping with it a little cooler in here this evening.
No. 327     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 12, 2014 at 2:08 AM     
I already miss being able to glance around the darkened room and see all the little LED light flickering indicating the status of each miner.

I was just about to relax and go to bed when I encountered what looks like a better way to run the temporary 12 gauge wire.
No. 328     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  May 19, 2014 at 5:50 PM     
http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/ebay-looking-to-accept-bitcoin-in-the-near-future-via-paypal
No. 329     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 19, 2014 at 6:30 PM     
insular926 wrote:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/ebay-looking-to-accept-bitcoin-in-the-near-future-via-paypal



I knew PayPal was eventually going to get their fingers in the pie. Unavoidable.

Some of us ebayers are already accepting Bitcoin as payment. I have been for a couple weeks now. Buyer select they are paying me with some other merchant service other than PayPal, but then actually pays me with a digital currency. I think I can accept at least 9 different digital currencies at the moment as well as accept mining processing power as payment.

Bottom line, it actually earns me more. I avoid the PayPal fees and many Buyers offer to pay more for the item if I will accept a digital currency.

Then on the other hand, I turn around and go to the distributor/vendor to source the item to ship to my Buyer and they provide me a discount for paying them with a digital currency. One hardware manufacturer provides me an 18% discount and ships for free when I pay with Bitcoin.

Many merchants are holding a portion of their digital currency income as an investment. Overstock.com has announced such. Many are looking for ways to become owners of digital currency without buying it and/or mining it. Accepting it as payment provides an avenue.
No. 330     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 20, 2014 at 2:31 PM     
The value of Bitcoin spiked up today $50+ per coin and caused me to receive a major influx for orders and requests for hardware. In fact, it will more than wipe out my on hand inventory and all of what was locally mining for me. That is good because I purchased all that inventory at a much lower cost per unit before the spike. The balance of the requests the manufacturer will ship for me, but at a higher cost per unit than I typically pay due to today's spike. The typical buyer had already recently went from purchasing only one unit to two, were as today's orders are for any where from 3-5 units per Buyer.

My own mining provides me on average 1 new miner every 4 days for essentially free which had been keeping pace with the demand for that particular miner. But the increased recent interest in Bitcoin has also increased the demand for the higher capacity more efficient hardware such as this miner is. It has forced me to me lay out more funds for inventory than mining provides. Which I make a profit either way, I was simply attempting to keep it an operation totally funded with incoming Bitcoin.

Inventory arrived today and I told the UPS guy I am essentially relabeling it all and giving it back to you today.
No. 331     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 22, 2014 at 1:29 AM     
I read this AM that Bank of America is now officially tracking Bitcoins and looking at a method to incorporate Bitcoin accounts along with customer checking accounts and/or debit cards and the customer decides what currency they are paying with.
No. 332     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 22, 2014 at 1:45 AM     
Bitcoin has shot on past $500 per coin this week. In addition to what I have been mining I managed to purchase some still down in the $400s. I ran into a roadblock attempting to buy as much as I wanted because they simply limit how much you can buy on most the exchanges.

Even the most popular exchanges limit you to buying no more than $1000 per week that you can immediately buy. I am fully verified to buy up to $50000 daily, but the transaction is intentionally designed to a process that takes 4 business days to complete. Supposedly a process to prevent the rampant fraud that is happening.

Many are buying Bitcoin using their charge card, and then after they get the Bitcoin in their wallet claim an unauthorized transaction against their card or that they never received the Bitcoin. Regardless of whatever proof the seller can be provide, the financial institution sides with the buyer giving their money back and letting them keep the Bitcoin claiming they cannot support a transaction for an item that is "digital".

Most the exchanges will now no longer accept a charge card and/or debit card as payment for Bitcoin.
No. 333     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 22, 2014 at 2:04 AM     
Essentially what it boils down to for those attempting to use Bitcoin as a regular currency, you either have to have a substantial balance already in your wallet and/or have a regular stream of Bitcoin in the pipeline coming into your account to efficiently make regular transactions.

This week has just about shut me down on selling mining hardware. The demand for the hardware skyrocketed this week, tapped out my on hand inventory, and most all the manufacturers will only accept Bitcoin as payment. If lucky some will take a bank transfer, with either way taking days to complete preventing hardware from being obtained in a timely manner.

I have had to cancel many of my online ads because I simply cannot get the inventory quickly enough. Were as I have had as many as 20-30 or more miners on hand to resell, I am down to like 6. I expect more by end of week with an order for 30 in the pipeline for the end of the month, but at this point I cannot order any more because I am tapped out on my limit to acquire more Bitcoin quickly enough to pay for them.

The sudden rise in Bitcoin value and the increased demand for the hardware caught me off guard. Been preoccupied with family members in the hospital, daughter's activities, etc.
No. 334     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 22, 2014 at 9:22 AM     
With the value of Bitcoin moving even higher yet this AM, Buyers are all of a sudden switching to cloud mining. Sold 4 contracts within the last hour. Prior I had not sold 4 in the past week.

This is good for I simply do not have enough hardware on hand to sell at the moment. Actually, mining with your own hardware still provides the biggest bang for the buck. You accumulate more than twice as much Bitcoin mining for yourself versus contract mining. But cloud mining is by far the easiest manner to quickly be mining your own Bitcoin. And with the value of Bitcoin shooting up this week people are scrambling to get in the game whatever way they can.

Just to clarify: I have been leasing my hardware to mine for others regularly, but all of a sudden in the past 24 hours most now want to own the mining power and/or the hardware.
No. 335     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  May 22, 2014 at 11:41 AM     
OK, what would a lease cost me? Could I hook the equipment into my laptop computer?
No. 336     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 22, 2014 at 7:05 PM     
insular926 wrote:

OK, what would a lease cost me? Could I hook the equipment into my laptop computer?



When you lease in digital mining you are not actually taking procession of the hardware and mining with it yourself. You are paying someone else to use their hardware to mine for you.

A laptop can suffice as an interface to configure and monitor stand alone miners connected to them via USB ports, but to actually mine with a laptop you are likely to "fry it" within a few days. The typical laptop is simply not "robust" enough to handle the processing demands mining would put on it. Although many laptops have the exact same processing power as many full size desktops and may even exhibit just as capable video performance, but lack adequate power supplies and cooling to stand up to the demands of the continual heavy duty processing mining requires.

You can mine with the stock processor and video card in many off the shelf desktops, but you will not mine for long with most laptops.

The most efficient mining is achieved with a stand alone miner consisting of its own processor, fans, and power supply. Which is essentially a computer but specifically designed for mining. Or by means of a server hosting processor cards designed specifically for mining.

The following two services offer cost effective cloud mining, but I am currently investigating others that claim they do so for less cost yet:

 

CEX.io

 


PBMining
No. 337     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 23, 2014 at 1:28 AM     
Fortunately I found a new reliable source for the most popular miner out there. He is drop shipping for me directly from the same manufacturer I was already getting them from, but he allows me to make the transaction immediately with USD versus having to make the transaction with BTC as all the manufacturers are now requiring. Cost me slightly me more per unit this way, but I am able to obtain and move inventory more quickly without the juggling involved to get enough BTC in a wallet to complete a transaction, thus pocket a little more overall. I am also making out a little bit due to PayPal not requiring me to pay for these orders until after delivered and the Seller uses his own miners to mine for me until my units are delivered.

He is shipping 4 units for me Friday and I will be placing orders with him over the weekend for enough miners to get my own mining back to 2 TH/s. This sudden demand for hardware caused me to have to sell and ship all my own personal hardware to meet the demand.

I have my online ads all posted again.

BTC value up more this AM.
No. 338     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 24, 2014 at 4:14 PM     
This recent surge in Bitcoin value has increased the demand for the hardware thus totally wiping me out of inventory. I have been drop shipping directly from other state side sources who are also now out of inventory and doing the same as I when able. Drop shipping directly from the source in China.

The most popular and reliable miners are now coming out of China. Most Sellers are not able to directly deal with the manufacturers because as I found, most all such sources require payment in Bitcoin. Unless you go through one of the "International brokerages" which accept a charge cared for them, which increases the cost unreasonably and/or it takes 30+ days for delivery.

I resolved my Bitcoin balance issue. Figured out an indirect manner of buying Bitcoin with a credit card. With digital currencies still in slow acceptance by many, many credit card service providers will not approve a credit card and/or debit card transaction known to be for directly purchasing Bitcoin. For reasons being Bitcoin is of digital status and many Buyers have claimed non delivery of Bitcoin and then hit the charge card provider and/or Seller with a chargeback claim. BTW - It is for the same reason that many merchants/Seller are now only accepting Bitcoin. There is no current method to unreasonably hit the Buyer with a chargeback.

Now that I have figured a way to readily provide more Bitcoin to my wallet, I have again started buying directly from the manufacturer and for some transactions they are directly shipping to my end customer for no extra cost. Even my International orders. They typically have them delivered for me within 4-6 days. That is fast compared to other sources. Even faster than I can directly ship them to a customer in many cases. BTW - If I have them on-hand and Buyer desires to pay for it, I can have them delivered next day. Typically I provide Priority USPS delivery for free and most Buyers are happy with that.

This has now resulted in some of my Buyers complaining like "Hey, I see this shipped from China!" I mean what does it matter? Where do they think these are coming from to begin with? They are getting their item within 4-6 days shipped free versus having to wait for me to receive and then forward to them, maybe even have to charge more to cover shipping, but complaining that it came directly from China. Go figure.
No. 339     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 25, 2014 at 2:51 AM     
The Bitcoin world sure can change quickly. Overnight Bitcoin has approached a value of $600. That is up over 33% for the past week.

Bad thing is the cost of hardware, GH/s, contracts, anything related to mining Bitcoin has also increased considerably overnight.

Good thing is I ordered like 20 new miners and increased my cloud mining before the spike up for everything over the past 24 hours. And this spike did not catch me off guard like the one did a few days ago. Having said that though, I sat at dinner with family members just two Sundays ago and advised them then to buy some S1 miners when they were only like $180 each. I did not care if they mined with them and/or just sat on them for resell. They are now pushing $300 each.
No. 340     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  May 26, 2014 at 11:36 PM     
No. 341     Reply: Bitcoin is just another fictional temporal currency   
By:  spiritualman652   Gender: M   Age: 58   on  May 27, 2014 at 10:08 AM     
Bitcoin is merely another "medium of exchange", or "scrip". It is a fictional currency which enables the economic fiction to operate. It will fail as soon as men realized that they are being plundered by it as they are through the fictionalized "Interest-Bearing Certificates" called "Federal Reserve Notes", and "currency" in the other nations.

Bitcoin cannot be permitted to last for very long, anywhere, for there are plans to install an Indentured Slave Program by the Zionists and their agenturs throughout the nations, which are seeking to control all men electronically (See THE REAL-ID ACT OF 2005).

Jeb Bush let the secret slip out when he recently announced that he was going to run for office. He said that he had a plan to solve the immigration problem through "through a path to Residency", and not the "path to Citizenship", as proposed by other politicians. The Mexicans can come and work, and even stay, but they are only "residents". What that means, is that they can reside here in the fictional USA but they are going to be viewed as being "residents" of the New Global Village. All people are to become "transient laborers" under the plans to rebuild the world into a new business model.

You will trade the time in your life, and make deals with your life incrementally, with corporations, all of which are controlled by the fictionalized economic apparatus which is controlled by oligarchies and corporations worldwide..

You will possess no currency in the near future, and you will own nothing. Like your houses and automobiles now, which are only usable by license, and for a limited time, you will be permitted to work and eat, as long as you are productive, and when you reach the nonproductive years of your life, and you are unable to broker a deal which will provide food and shelter for you, you better have plenty of numbers saved up, or you will be euthanized and converted into some lubricant or fertilizer.
No. 342     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 27, 2014 at 3:58 PM     
A shipment of miners direct from the manufacturer finally arrived today.

Got them all unpackaged, online, and mining within minutes, except one gave me some "hassle" I have never experienced. She would communicate with the Internet, would power up and appear to be going to mine, but never provide any indication she was mining. My stats screen on PC indicated no mining results. After several stops and starts and reboots, I opted to do a factory reset. All seems fine now.
No. 343     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 30, 2014 at 2:37 PM     
Bitcoin broke over $600 today.

Good for me because I purchased a considerable amount when it was down in the $400s and $500s. Will likely dump it all soon for USD and then do it all again.

Likely dumping my hoard of Litecoin this week also.

I will keep back a little of both. This past week I dumped all NMC and IXC with the values up. And I actually accumulated those for free. They mine in the background with the same processor I mine BTC with.
No. 344     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 30, 2014 at 3:10 PM     
I ordered my Bitmain S2 1 TH/s miner today. The manufacturer already gives me $400 off on these and with the value of Bitcoin up today it was like getting another $300+ off to buy using Bitcoin. Actually, Bitcoin is all they will accept for payment.

She should be here in 3-6 days. After I configure her and make sure she mines OK for about 48 hours, this miner is likely going to a data center in Troy Michigan. They are going to lease me by the month space including 24/7 electricity, Internet, and maintenance of the miner. The only thing left to work out with them is allowing me access to the miners via the Internet without me having to drive all the way to Troy and/or call them every time I want to reconfigure a miner as I lease the mining power out to others.

I need to migrate the hardware portion of this operation out from under my roof allowing me the freedom to get further away from home more often. Mining has essentially kept me a prisoner for a few weeks.
No. 345     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 30, 2014 at 4:11 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:
this miner is likely going to a data center in Troy Michigan. They are going to lease me by the month space including 24/7 electricity, Internet, and maintenance of the miner. The only thing left to work out with them is allowing me access to the miners via the Internet without me having to drive all the way to Troy and/or call them every time I want to reconfigure a miner as I lease the mining power out to others.



Coincidentally, I just got off a call with the colocation facility in Troy. It appears I may potentially be their largest mining customer. They will provide me my own area within their data center. I am free to come and go during business hours to configure my own hardware and/or they will also provide me access to all my miners via a configuration screen online. Regardless of where I am at in the world, as long as I have Internet access I can configure my miners on the fly. That was just about the last straw keeping me from relocating some hardware to them. Maybe next week.

The only thing that caught me off guard a little, was power supplies. I was under the impression they would provide them. They will provide the electricity, but I have to provide the PSUs. No big deal. My S2s actually come with a self-contained 1000 watt PSU and I can take a $19 hi-quality 750 Watt server power supply, a little wire and connectors, and make it power two S1s.

I could easily go to 100% cloud mining and enjoy the same benefits, but to have that kind of configuration flexibility with cloud mining would currently run me $10.50 per GH/s. Were as owning the hardware myself and hosting it off site I can do for $1.33 to $1.90 per GH/s, depending on which hardware I use, providing a 100% return on investment in 6-8 weeks. After no more than two months it is a "free and clear" operation paying its own way and providing an income.

In fact, I am looking at setting up more than one farm of miners in the colocation center and selling them to others once all established and having paid for itself, with always keeping the most recent farm mining for myself until sold. Will be working with the colocation center next week to obtain a better lease price than they already charge the general public. I can then more realistically price a resell package.

The buyer of a mining package will in effect own the hardware, leave it hosted at the colocation center, and either pay me or the center monthly to keep the hardware hosted. The agreement would be structured to were as if the buyer defaults on making the monthly hosting payments, all hardware falls back to me. And I simply resell the package. My research thus far indicates I can provide such a package for less than 1/2 the going rate and still earn a reasonable return on the sale of each package. In fact, I do not really care if I only break even on the sell of the package. Until sold it mines for me for essentially free, and if the buyer defaults it falls back to me to mine for me again or sell again.
No. 346     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  May 31, 2014 at 12:23 PM     
Bitcoin over $620

Just a few short weeks ago it was only like $285
No. 347     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 1, 2014 at 1:24 AM     
I already feel I am directly dealing with the best manufacturers of Bitcoin mining hardware in the industry, but I keep researching for more cost efficient "cloud" mining for Bitcoin and for better Litecoin hardware and some "cloud" mining for Litecoin.

Doing some research online today I stumbled onto what appeared to be an offer for cloud mining and hardware from a single source. But clicking around the website quickly revealed that at the moment they do not actually offer anything.

A little further research revealed who owns the website and I was able to obtain some info. This particular aspect of his business started basically the same as mine, but the fast paced momentum has pulled him in other directions and spending time with more immediate priorities.

Turns out this guy is a Bitcoin rags-to-riches story (he actually started with 30 video cards mining Litecoin). Less than a year ago the guy was a systems network installer driving around in a $300 Honda. Today he presides over what is considered the largest Bitcoin mining operation in North America. Some estimate the operation potentially earns over $8 million per month. All operated out of a warehouse in the state of Washington.

Anyway, at first impressions, I like the guy. We think alike on digital currency mining. His story is like hearing someone recite to me exactly what I have been going through and been doing for the past few weeks. He just happened to jump in sooner than I.

Also like myself, he is less about competition and more about collaboration with others. Let everybody have a "piece of the pie". I have offers to send me Bitcoin and Litecoin as payment for assistance and consulting I have provided to miners I do not know from Adam, but to date I have accepted nothing for those efforts.

He also thinks the same as I on the alternate coins. His exact words are “Until another coin is created that has its own unique value proposition, the alts will remain as transfer mechanisms for mining bitcoin. If any of the alts really start to pop, you can expect we’ll be building a mine for it.”

Same as I think, he appears to think Bitcoin is the only real value crypto out there right now. The only worthwhile value in the alts being mined thus far is in trading them for Bitcoin and/or a means to mine Bitcoin. Which is what I have been doing with my mined alts as I find exchanges to trade them on. Two or three times per day I trade all my NMC and IXC for BTC and/or more GH/s. I even cashed in all my Litecoin stash for Bitcoin before encountering this guy. I still have 7 Litecoin miners operating but have sold off the major Litecoin hardware.

I am looking forward to a possible collaboration with this guy and/or at least gleaning some insight from the learning curve he has already experienced.

The guy said his ambitions evolved with his interest. I can totally relate.
No. 348     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 1, 2014 at 10:07 AM     
BTC over $655 this AM.
No. 349     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 1, 2014 at 6:58 PM     
With the recent rise in BTC value, at the moment I have one miner by itself producing almost $1000 per month.
No. 350     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 3, 2014 at 12:05 AM     
Bitcoin is making efforts to hit $700 per coin with the start of this week. I actually bit the bullet and purchased more with it over $600 last week and purchased more over the weekend.
No. 351     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 3, 2014 at 12:16 AM     
I negotiated with a guy today to allow me to use warehouse type facility space he has available for free to expand my mining operation into, if I simply help him get started doing the same. I directed him on Sunday what to order as far as his own miners.

This may change my plans to migrate miners to Troy this week. Need to make up my mind soon. I have like 40 "big" miners in transit to me. Either way is a drive for me, but I will be able the miners via the Internet no matter where they are. This guy also does not yet have appropriate utilities and Internet installed, but says it is in the works. The Troy facility is simply waiting on me to ship the miners to them or bring them down myself. I may take them a few, and move a few to this other guy's facility later. I simply cannot operate that many large miners out of my home.
No. 352     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 3, 2014 at 12:24 AM     
I got lucky on the large capacity miner I purchased. No more available right now. The manufacturer is not able to produce any more. The worldwide demand for Bitcoin mining hardware has finally caused a major shortage of components to build complete units.

I know of one major manufacturer shipping their units as of two weeks ago minus the case and LCD display, they can be operated without them. The manufacture of the most popular brand miner is now shipping their largest capacity miner as a do it yourself kit without a case and a power supply. The demand for their smaller hardware is simply requiring all available components and manufacturing capacity.
No. 353     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 7, 2014 at 11:18 PM     
Cool! Sites that sell survival gear and supplies have quickly embraced the crypto currencies. I have browsed sites accepting up to as many as 32 different digital coins. By default of simply mining Bitcoin, I am automatically mining and accumulating other alt coins. Stumbling onto this has now provided me a manner to reasonably exchange every variety of coin I am mining for something of value that I can utilize and/or resell.
No. 354     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 8, 2014 at 12:10 AM     
As of this AM I am finally mining a multi pool as I discussed some interest in sometime ago in a previous post.

A multi pool offers a feature were as your miner automatically switches to mining the most profitable crypto to be mining at any given moment. I thought cool idea in concept, but in reality, it meant little to nothing unless cashing those coins out as earned.

I finally discovered a pool that does just that. And turns out it is like the very first pool I ever registered to mine at. The largest mining pool in existence. Either I overlooked they had such a feature then, or they implemented it since.

Anyway, I have one miner mining multi just to try it out. It continues to mine whatever crypto is most profitable to be mining at any given moment, but I also have it configured to immediately exchange whatever is mined for Bitcoin as soon as mined.
No. 355     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 8, 2014 at 12:13 AM     
Right now the multi pool is mining USDE. It currently ranks as the most profitable Scrypt currency to be mining. At this moment, I have no idea what USDE is.
No. 356     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 8, 2014 at 12:25 AM     
Well, this could be interesting. With the multi pool I have mined 3 different cryptos in the last 10 minutes.

I am glad I am cashing out for BTC immediately, I do not want to be accumulating so many different alts.
No. 357     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 10, 2014 at 7:02 PM     
It has now been publically published that Bitcoin has outperformed every other investment over the past five years.
No. 358     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 11, 2014 at 8:36 PM     
I read in financial news today that loans are starting to be backed by Bitcoin. Especially in emerging economies like Mexico and India, and or economies were as the interest rates to borrow have sky rocketed. In Brazil the interest rate on a personal loan can reach as high as 200%. Bitcoin has opened up a lot of investing and borrowing opportunities that simply did not exist for many.

In fact, as of this week, I now have a seat/shares in an existing P2Pool Bitcoin mining operation who's startup was essentially funded with Bitcoin loans. I just partnered with them this week, which by the way is their two year anniversary. They have survived were as many other such Bitcoin startups have failed. I have been participating with them this week in what is now day 2 of their organization's 3 day anniversary event.

By mid June, probably by the weekend, I anticipate actually having my own what has come to be called a mini mining pool.

No. 359     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 12, 2014 at 7:07 PM     


http://finance.yahoo.com/news/bitcoin-better-investment-startups-193903254.html
No. 360     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 13, 2014 at 12:03 AM     
insular926 wrote:



http://finance.yahoo.com/news/bitcoin-better-investment-startups-193903254.html



Good article.

Most business startups fail. Those that survive often do not see a profit for at least 2-5 years or more.

Anyone can purchase a Bitcoin miner, if they purchase a decent enough miner it will pay for itself within 2 months, and be generating free and clear income from that point on minus your cost of electricity and Internet service. And many have figured a way around those costs.

Of course as the hashing difficulty factor increases and the number of folks that get involved in mining grows, the profits begin to diminish per GH/s. But it is still profit being generated by an asset that is owned free and clear within 6-8 weeks in most cases at the current BTC value. If you desire to maintain the profit margin, you simply add more hardware that again pays for itself. The conditions and factors are dynamic and always changing, so you regularly need to adjust your plan to maintain your desired level of activity.

I currently own enough miners that they alone are capable of (the crypto industry is also providing me income other than from directly mining) producing over $3200 per month free and clear at the current BTC value, which is down from when I first started mining. BTC value is projected to be over $1000 by this coming Christmas. If it were that value and all else remained fairly equal and/or balanced out tit for tat, my current mining assets would be returning over $5200 per month. But if things go as they have thus far, I am weekly acquiring more mining assets. I currently have 12 "adequate" miners directly mining for me and two small cloud mining operations, with 30+ more "adequate" miners in transit to me.

At this point, just since February, Bitcoin mining is approaching replacing the pension and benefits I lost due to the corporation I was employed by filing bankruptcy and the Obama administration "raiding" the pension fund. Other than real estate and day trading, I doubt any other startup could have provided that kind of return so quickly for the investment made. As well as avoid the "risks" involved with real estate and day trading.

BTW - When I say free and clear, I am referring to the cost of the hardware having fully paid for itself. Most will still have electricity and Internet service expenses to keep their miner operating, which at current BTC value an "adequate" miner well more than returns enough to cover those required expenses.
No. 361     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 13, 2014 at 12:39 AM     
BTW - After I left the gym this evening I had plans to stop and purchase some tables and/or racks to get miners up off the floor. I happened to drive by some apartment complex dumpsters and spied what appeared to be a nice table left sitting in front of the dumpsters. It is mine now. Saved me the cost of buying tables and racks this evening. This one table is large and sturdy enough to hold all the miners and power supplies I currently have in house.
No. 362     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 13, 2014 at 1:46 PM     
Bitcoin 2-year performance: 9,812.2%
"Mining Startup" 2-year performance*: 1,341.5%
S&P 500 2-year performance*: 45.7%
Silver 2-year performance: -31.5%

*excludes distributions (471 BTC distributed to owners with 127 BTC remaining with the startup)

The "Mining Startup" is a startup Bitcoin project/venture that I am now a member of. Was started 2 years ago. Although they have not done as well as Bitcoin itself, few other investments have returned 1341% in the past two years. I only see this little venture growing more yet.

I have financially invested into ownership of seats/shares of the venture, as well as just donated 222,435 Bitcoin Mh/s to support operations.

BTW - The "startup" is privately ranked better than 99% of other investments that one could have invested their Bitcoin in over the past 2 years. The venture is essentially funded 100% with Bitcoin.
No. 363     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 13, 2014 at 4:05 PM     
I'm getting into Bitcoin.
No. 364     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 13, 2014 at 5:04 PM     
Everybody and their brother, says for overall production of Bitcoin there is really no difference in mining one pool versus another other than the minimal differences in fees and reward plans.

I feel as if do experience a significant difference from pool to pool.

By the end of next week, I should have enough exactly the same brand and capacity miners on hand that I can do an experiment. I am going to deploy one 180 GH/s miner at the same time of day on each various pool I am most interested in mining. I will document the results over like 24-72 hours.

At the moment, I likely have enough miners around to do such an experiment, but I have many of them contracted out mining for others by the hour. I actually earn more per day using the hardware to mine for others than using it to mine for myself. 2-4 times more. Enough more that it is well worth my while to mine for others and then purchase my own Bitcoin directly. In fact, I purchased Bitcoin directly just a few minutes ago.

Speaking of transacting Bitcoin, I have kind of developed a local following as a result of ebay and my involvement in the industry via other means. Locals are contacting me, wanting to see my "rigs", sit up "rigs" for them, wanting me to exchange USD for Bitcoin and vice versa for them, order hardware for them, pickup their purchase directly from me versus shipping, walk them through setups online and on the phone, etc. Maybe more personal involvement with others than I was looking for. I have done my best to compile the links to the best online guides and videos I am aware of in an attempt to steer them towards those for assistance.

I spent hours online yesterday assisting a Canadian buyer of my hardware in setting up their Scrypt blade miners to be controlled by Raspberry Pi devices versus requiring a PC to host the software. As clear and precise as the PDF docs are that I already provide with the hardware, this seems to happen a lot with newbies. Oh well, goes with the territory.
No. 365     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 14, 2014 at 3:33 PM     
http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/bitcoin-price-rebounds-hitting-550-usd-us-marshals-bitcoin-auction/2014/06/13

"In an announcement made 11 hours ago, US Marshal explains that they will auction the seized silk road bitcoins in an auction that will end on Monday 30th of June."

"What is interesting about the move from US Marshal is that by doing a legal auction of bitcoins, they do legalize the use and trading of Bitcoin."

Despite the above potential ramifications, the US already has government offices accepting Bitcoin as payment and the IRS already recognizes Bitcoin as a legal to own asset.
No. 366     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 14, 2014 at 4:10 PM     
http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/news/bitcoin-atms-coming-los-angeles/2014/06/14

Bitcoin ATM machines will appear in Los Angeles next week.

"Starting next week, Los Angeles Bitcoin users will have the ability to buy and sell Bitcoin at the new Robocoin ATMs. With just a scan of their palm, users have the freedom to exchange currencies through ExpressCoin at two Locali Conscious Convenience stores: one in Venice and one in Hollywood.
Locali owner Melissa Rosen doesn’t currently accept Bitcoin as payment, but didn’t expect the increase in customers that she received due to the news. Rosen has since said that the stores are trying to find a way to accept digital currency now. Luckily, Coinbase makes it easy for merchants to accept Bitcoin, and have recently proven this with Expedia and DISH."

Expedia and Dish have both recently announced they will now accept Bitcoin as payment.
No. 367     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 15, 2014 at 8:11 PM     
Today I was again offered some free warehouse space to migrate my mining operation to in exchange for simply helping them to develop their own operation.

I have taken a look. This is a more viable facility and much closer to me than the other offer. My reluctance is it is kind of a remote location. I am beginning to receive many contacts from those somewhat local desiring to first hand see miners in action and be shown hands on exactly what they need to do. If I am going to go through the efforts to establish such an activity, I need it to be convenient for such.

I may accept this offer just to get started and help these folks get started, but I dread the exercise of relocating the hardware if it does not work out.

Speaking of helping others get started, I am being wooed to offer classes locally as part of local community education programs to teach "starting an ebay business" and "getting into crypto mining". Lots of local interest developing. Those classes would likely not start until next fall. I simply do not have time to put something together for the about to begin summer semester. Just too busy. I am supposed to be San Jose this coming week, Charlotte NC shortly afterwards, potentially a convention in Mexico, back to CA for a convention in Los Angeles, and I have a daughter with a wedding approaching quickly.
No. 368     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 18, 2014 at 9:15 PM     
The Bitcoin mining difficulty factor took a huge spike resulting in less bang for the effort to mine. A miner that would have provided you $900 - $1000 per month just last week now provides about $690 per month. Such hardware was paying for itself in less than two months. It will now take pushing 3 months to pay for itself.

One positive thing that did result from it is that hardware prices that recently spiked also, have backed down some with the increase in difficulty to mine. A high capacity mine that once cost like $5000 - $6000 can now be had for like $1700.

But of course Bitcoin value could rise back to what it was last year and more than erase any real impact the rise in the difficulty factor makes on the in the pocket return.

I have spent much of this week educating others on miners, assisting them with obtaining their hardware, and then setting up their hardware and getting it to mine. I configured 12 miners this week. Was up until like 5 AM today getting miners going. They are all running great, with half of them now overclocked resulting in an 11% increase in their stock OEM mining capability, thus erasing much of the impact the difficulty rise imparted. Of course they do utilize more electricity when overclocked and require improved cooling taking away a little from the bottom line of the faster mining capability.
No. 369     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 26, 2014 at 3:02 PM     
For the past few days I have been in the planning stages of establishing my own Bitcoin mining pool. This avoids any fees having to be paid to an existing pool, pool operators that may not be totally honest, the 51% pool control issues, merged coins belonging to me versus the pool operator keeping them, and is a step towards the original decentralized plan of Bitcoin.

I researched affiliate type agreements but those still did not really provide me my own pool. Just associate use of their pool appearing to be my own pool. Kind of like an affiliate setup.

Not really happy with that idea, I then initiated the process to operate a pool from one of my existing PCs which is capable of doing so, but appears a PC just may not be reliable and efficient enough to be provide confidence in the pool. Those any knowledge of what is required would likely feel better to hear that my pool is hosted on a dedicated server versus a desktop PC.

Today I checked out setting my own dedicated servers. One for Bitcoin and one for Litecoin. Likely will not invest in both at the same time. Bitcoin will be first.

At the moment I am experimenting with mining on the existing direct nodes of those that already have their own private pool and attempting to identify the pros and cons.

Many peers are pushing me to establish my own pool, therefore there appears to be support amongst my circle of acquaintances that would use the pool. I would provide them a pool to mine totally free of any direct charges and fees, in exchange for me keeping all the alternative coins mined in the background as compensation to provide and maintain the secure server.
No. 370     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 26, 2014 at 4:00 PM     
I currently have at least 6 TH/s of hashing power mining Bitcoin and various other SHA-256 currencies directly for me. I have nine miners mining Litecoin and various other Scrypt based currencies. Sold off several of the Scrypt based miners but two of the latest and greatest are in transit to me. Actually, I have these setup as what is called a multipool. The software monitors the highest paying currencies at any time and automatically switches me to the highest return currency to mine at any given moment. I also have it configured to automatically cash out for USD as earned.

I am in the process of researching putting the Bitcoin miners on a multipool, but Bitcoin is most always the most profitable currency to be mining of the SHA-256 and the effort to deploy onto a multipool appears to be of no value other than to see if it actually works, so as I know for sure when and if there ever comes a time it is worth mining SHA-256 in such a manner.
No. 371     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 23   on  Jun 26, 2014 at 4:03 PM     
insular926 wrote:

I'm getting into Bitcoin.


Brad - If you were to establish yourself a Bitcoin wallet or any crypto currency account that provides you a personal bitcoin address that can be mined to, I would gladly point one of my miners to your address, and allow it to mine for you for free for a few hours just to introduce you to a little bit more of what it is all about.
No. 372     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 24   on  Jun 28, 2014 at 5:38 PM     
I was notified and congratulated today that I am being awarded a minted seat on a Bitcoin mining pool. The award also consists of a physical Bitcoin made of silver and assigned its own custom Bitcoin address.

On the open market the coin is worth about $400 when it contains no Bitcoin. Worth more once Bitcoin is loaded onto it. The value of the seat on the exchange could eventually be priceless. All I know is that at this time, in addition to the physical silver coin, I am periodically awarded Bitcoin for the seat same as a stock pays dividends on a share.
No. 373     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 24   on  Jun 28, 2014 at 7:56 PM     
I read excerpts today from a government GAO document that was actually the result of study initiated back in 2007, indicating the US government relenting then and realizing there is no feasible way around not accepting the viability of digital currencies. At least Bitcoin. The drafted document indicates that the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau is going to be assigned the task to draft meaningful digital currency policies for the US.
No. 374     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 24   on  Jun 28, 2014 at 10:50 PM     
I read today that Litecoin mining accounts for almost $200 million of AMD's video cards sales. Unbelievable.
No. 375     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 24   on  Jun 28, 2014 at 11:26 PM     
I learned today how to setup a virtual server in the clouds. For example, I could essentially use my free Amazon cloud drive service to create my own mining pool. I may do this just for the experience before investing in my own server.

In fact, it may be the most practical way to go being I would like to make this venture as virtual and easy to access from anywhere, not tying me down at any one place 24/7. A physical server is going to have to remain located somewhere 24/7. Although I will have access to a physical server via the Internet, if it has an issue that I cannot resolve via the Internet, and the server is in MI and I am in CA, that could jeopardize the earning of thousands of dollars for myself and clients.
No. 376     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 5, 2014 at 9:34 PM     
California formally legalized Bitcoin this week.
No. 377     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 6, 2014 at 10:14 PM     
ebay issued me a policy warning this weekend stating that have to remove my acceptance of Bitcoin and Litecoin for payments. They claimed something like they do not allow the acceptance of what is essentially the acceptance of a point to point cash transfer, and that cash payments are not allowed on ebay except for in person payments. Supposedly any form of payment that cannot be electronically tracked to verify whom issued the payment and whom received the payment is no longer acceptable on ebay except for in person payment.
No. 378     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 7, 2014 at 11:30 PM     
LOL. It is getting to were as most every day now I am somewhere installing and configuring miners for others. It has gone crazy. Everybody wants in on the action. But unless the hardware becomes more efficient and affordable, the window of opportunity is quickly closing for the little guy to become directly involved in the mining aspect of Bitcoin.
No. 379     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 8, 2014 at 8:14 PM     
Over 12 million Bitcoins are currently in existence. Financial analysts estimate only 1 million Bitcoins are required for Bitcoin to function successfully as the world’s number one currency.
No. 380     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 8, 2014 at 8:17 PM     
The former Facebook litigants the Winklevoss twins, have amassed more than $11 million in Bitcoin.
No. 381     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 8, 2014 at 8:20 PM     
Bitcoin has been declared as possibly the global economy's last safe haven even more so than precious metals.
No. 382     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 8, 2014 at 8:23 PM     
Many, if not most, of Bitcoin's enthusiasts are self-described libertarians.

How much Bitcoin do you have Storm?
No. 383     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 10, 2014 at 6:21 PM     
The issuance of the world's first Bitcoin Debit Card was announced today.
No. 384     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 10, 2014 at 10:21 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Many, if not most, of Bitcoin's enthusiasts are self-described libertarians.

How much Bitcoin do you have Storm?


None. I think if I put money into crypto, I would go with one of the others.

Mainly I am invested in silver and palladium. Palladium is beginning to move upwords as predicted and I'm thinking of adding to my offshore account.

I rather admire you for going forward so aggressively in bitcoin, Darrell. I am reading of more and more financial groups accepting bitcoin now.
No. 385     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 11, 2014 at 9:47 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

I think if I put money into crypto, I would go with one of the others.




At this time, I personally see digital currency as having some what of an advantage for "crisis economy" purposes more so than holding precious metals as a medium of exchange. But all could be very inconvenient to use depending on the conditions and scenario.

If I had to decide on a digital currency as a "crisis economy" asset at this very moment, I would likely go with "coinaaa". To the best of my knowledge, it is the only crypto-currency that is 100% backed by real assets.

Otherwise, I prefer Bitcoin at this time simply for the return on investment. Seems I recently read that no other investment has provided more return than Bitcoin over the past 5 years, and over the past 2 years Bitcoin has returned just shy of 10,000%. No other crypto at this time garners enough confidence that they can do the same. Many thought Litecoin had potential but it fell out of favor. At this time, all the other cryptos are only seen as an alternative to eventually owning Bitcoin, and/or have very limited and specific markets for real use.

I currently mine several other currencies other than Bitcoin, with eventually most all being exchanged for Bitcoin. I keep experimenting and researching as to if mining an alternative is actually a more economical and more efficient mining process versus directly mining Bitcoin.
No. 386     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 16, 2014 at 12:10 PM     
5 more major online retailers, including Shopify website providers, announce the acceptance of Bitcoin as a payment method on their sites.
No. 387     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 18, 2014 at 12:24 PM     
Michael Dell announced today the acceptance of Bitcoin at Dell.com. This will make Dell the current largest e-commerce retailer to accept Bitcoin as payment.

Many businesses are now starting to seek ways to accumulate Bitcoin without having to directly buy and/or mine it. They are accepting it as payment, but "hording" it.
No. 388     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 18, 2014 at 12:41 PM     
Finally a gold-backed cryptocurrency called "INNcoin" is on the scene. I figured it would not take long with the growing interest in asset backed cryptos.

INNcoin allows you to essentially mine gold for free, of course minus the cost of your hardware and electricity. Many already own the hardware capable of mining this crypto. Simply need to download and install the free software on a Windows based PC and run it.

It is being looked at as a more practical way for the masses to accumulate gold and viably use it as a currency.

Researching at this moment as to if I can convert existing hardware to mine this new crypto. I prefer Coinaaa as an asset backed crypto, but I am not capable of mining it at this time. Appears I may be able to easily mine INNcoin.
No. 389     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 18, 2014 at 12:53 PM     
Well, that was fast. Within what almost seemed as only seconds I had the INNcoin wallet and mining software installed. But it appears they do not yet have the block chain uploaded to allow the network to be connected to allowing mining to begin.

I went back and reread the news release. It is supposed to be uploaded within the week.

I am not sure yet, but it is appears it may take using several PCs with the software installed and/or banking several hi-performance video cards together to mine any appreciable amount of INNcoin. But it also appears most any PC may be able to at least mine some, even if very slowly in the background while you use the PC for other typical daily tasks. Including laptops, I have at least 7 PCs sitting here.
No. 390     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 18, 2014 at 2:10 PM     
Since becoming involved in Bitcoin, I have discovered there are a lot of "scammers" out there in an effort to get your Bitcoin into their hands.

But today I was approached by "one" in an effort to obtain hardware at a huge discount. Someone on ebay contacted me claiming to be working for an organization that finds "new uses" for obsolete and/or outdated crypto mining hardware. Supposedly they have been retained and charged with the project of collecting such hardware.

The message went on to elaborate as to how they have noticed my ads on ebay attempting to sell specific hardware. They then shared about how the prices are about to drastically drop on such hardware rendering it to be of little to no real value. To help me avoid this personal loss, they will take the hardware off my hands for an offer of $20 per miner and will arrange for transit to them. And I will be greatly thanked for my role in assisting such a humanitarian project.

LOL. I am still easily getting $150 to $200 for each of these particular "obsolete" miners. They just hit the market in June as a low cost alternative to introduce Litecoin/Scrypt mining. In fact, it is these miners I hope to convert to mining the new gold crypto.
No. 391     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 18, 2014 at 10:48 PM     
Got a Bitcoin "dividend share" payout today from the mining pool I am a partner of. One of several thus far.

I only mention it because it "jogged" my memory about something that I do not recall if I shared. This same crypto mining organization awarded me a physical Bitcoin made of .9999 silver a couple weeks ago. I participated in and won a mining competition/lottery they hosted to raise Bitcoin donations to support operating costs of the pool.

At any time during a specified 3 day period, if you mined the pool during that period, any bitcoin shares earned were retained by them, but in exchange you received 1 virtual lottery ticket for each of those mined shares. A drawing was held and one winner was drawn from those lottery tickets and I won the silver coin. As well as being recognized as mining the most shares during that 3 day period. Improved my odds of winning the lottery.

In addition to granting me another seat/share of the mining organization which could become priceless someday, the coin is worth about .4 BTC. Which is currently about $252 USD. Otherwise, I do not know or maybe do not understand any other benefit and/or value the actual coin has. They seem pretty proud that the coin has a customized Bitcoin address assigned to only it, but if I send Bitcoin to that address I am not sure how to spend it from the coin or ever get the Bitcoin back. LOL.

I have never bothered to research how any of the physical Bitcoins being issued are utilized.
No. 392     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 20, 2014 at 12:34 AM     
Turns out there is a halogram on the physical Bitcoin that has an encrypted pin behind hit. I can mine to or make Bitcoin deposits to the unique address of the physical coin, and they will accumulate and remain there in "cold storage" until I use the pin to withdraw the funds. But the idea is to leave the funds there allowing the coin increase in value as Bitcoin value increases and/or silver value increases.

If I never ever deposit any more Bitcoin to the physical coin myself, there is Bitcoin being deposited to it weekly via dividends from the Bitcoin organization that the coin represents a seat/share of.

At this time, I plan to leave the halogram intact and allow the value of the coin to increase via the deposited Bitcoin dividends.

I plan to directly purchase more of the coins or the other such offerings available, to provide as gifts to family members and associates. I lean towards buying more of this particular organizations coin simply because of its beauty and it is made of a precious metal, and it is the only one I aware of that has the dividend feature increasing its value without the holder ever having to deposit more Bitcoin to the address ever.

That is a unique attraction designed into the particular coin, were as my associates and myself hope to attract buyers/investors of the coin. I say myself, even though I really did not grasp the function of the coin until this week, I am a multiple seat/share owner of the Bitcoin organization that issues this particular coin. The coin was a project of the group before I recently came on board.
No. 393     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 20, 2014 at 12:50 AM     
Even though I own shares in the above mining organization I mentioned in the previous post, and thus enjoy the benefits associated with "owning" a mining node with a pool that is successfully growing. I am still moving forward with establishing my own Bitcoin and Litecoin mining nodes, thus solely owning my own mining pools. At this time, essentially for no more reason than to do it.

I have it down to four feasible avenues to establish and own a node, still researching which way is best for me. I lean towards one of the two avenues that allows me to be totally mobile with the operation not requiring me to directly maintain and operate a physical "server".

I have peers edging me on and want to mine my pool once up and running, while one or two are "negative" commenting on the difficulty to market the pool. I am really not concerned about marketing the pool. At this time, it is simply a personal goal of mine to just gain the experience if nothing more. If I am the only one that ever mines the pool, I am good with that.
No. 394     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 20, 2014 at 1:23 AM     
Another crypto currency project on my plate at the moment, is I am researching establishing my own crypto currency exchange. It will be like any fiat currency exchange, but available 24/7 for trading cryptos and/or converting them to fiat currency.

The window of opportunity is there now and I see the market doing nothing but growing. It is a snowball rolling down hill. I had always had a backburner dream of involvement with a stock trading and or currency exchange, but a seat on such these days requires being like a billionaire or a company that has those kind of assets. At this time, I can essentially establish such an exchange for cryptos with essentially nothing other than time and effort. But once successfully operating, it will essentially be a turn-key auto-pilot income stream.

I have already settled on the software. It is the same that is currently partnered with the largest existing crypto currency exchange that exists. I am having more difficulty on determining a name for the operation and selecting legal entity more than anything else. Will definitely be either an S-Corp or the least preferred LLC. An LLC is great for passive income ventures, but leaves somewhat to be desired for active income ventures. I am already in contact with a firm in Nevada. Appears to be the only state to even consider incorporating any entity these days. Other states have allowed changes in the laws essentially creating loop holes that make the corporate veil vulnerable to being broken and/or pierced.

I hope to have this venture operating by this coming fall if not sooner. Many irons in the fire at the moment.
No. 395     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 20, 2014 at 11:56 PM     
I started mining INNcoin this evening, the gold backed crypto.

Turns out, at least at this time, my existing ASIC chip based miners cannot process the algorithm required to mine INNcoin. But I was able to install the code on an existing PC and use its existing processor and video card chip to mine. Over the next couple days, I will likely bring all my PCs that are sitting around online to mine some INNcoin until I have the time to pick up some used video cards at a good price and build a custom rig just for INNcoin. I have had on the backburner a project to build such a miner for Darkcoin anyway. Being that both require the same algorithm to mine them, gives me more incentive to pull that project ahead.

BTW - When I initiated my mining of INNcoin this evening, I was one of only 11 people in the entire world currently mining the crypto. About 830,000 coins per month are available to mine until July 2015. No real competition at the moment.
No. 396     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 21, 2014 at 12:05 AM     
BTW - I learned today that INNcoin is not the world's first gold backed digital currency. E-gold was back in 1996. It eventually failed for many of the same reasons that other asset backed currencies/investments do. But backing by a so called precious metal somehow provides many some kind of intrinsic confidence until they first hand learn that no matter what is backing something, it is only as sound as the one providing the backing.

The real value of a crypto currency is based upon the strength of its network, rather than some specific asset. The concept is difficult to understand and hard to explain to newcomers, but it is an important point. People like the idea that a currency is backed by something tangible, however, a quantity of gold that exists in a warehouse somewhere, no matter how well protected and insured, isn’t much more tangible than the “full faith and credit” of such and such government and/or other organization that is operating the fiat printing press.
No. 397     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 21, 2014 at 12:38 AM     
Even though I find the idea of INNcoin being an asset backed currency educational, interesting, and a way to accumulate a little bit of free gold; for the most part, it simply appears to be a promotional effort by the gold dealer to acquire new customers. You earn a little bit of free gold that hopefully you come to them to exchange for USD, and even more hopefully leave the gold on deposit with them, and even more hopefully buy more gold from them.

But they do appear to be gold dealer with a concept I am quite attracted to if and when I am ready to buy more gold and silver. Especially silver at the moment.
No. 398     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 22, 2014 at 4:23 PM     
Either the gold crypto coin thing is not really mining, or it takes way more hashes/second than my PC is able to process to earn any shares in a reasonable amount of time. I have yet to be credited with any shares.

I have read similar comments on some of the mining forums by others. In fact, I have only seen one comment were as someone claims to have been credited with any shares thus far, while most others already appear to be abandoning the coin and putting their mining efforts towards some other coin they already know realizes shares.
No. 399     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Curtis   Gender: M   Age: 51   on  Jul 22, 2014 at 5:58 PM     
Who the heck is Bitcoin??:unsure:
No. 400     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 22, 2014 at 8:51 PM     
Curtis553 wrote:

Who the heck is Bitcoin??:unsure:



Like I told my brother, "I guess I really do not care who or what Bitcoin is as long as it legally keeps providing me a 500+ percent free and clear return per year".
No. 401     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 22, 2014 at 9:13 PM     
I see Bitcoin as one of those feasible and viable opportunities that the little guy rarely has a fair chance to get in on.

But the tide is shifting. As Bitcoin quickly gains credibility, the billionaire investors and large corporations are starting to take large portions of the limited size pie.

Of course the value of Bitcoin is unlimited and expected to "skyrocket" before the end of this year and go even higher in coming years. But there is a fixed number of Bitcoin that will ever be produced.

In a way that is good and bad. Good in the fact that the value of Bitcoin can now most assuredly go no where but up, and good in the fact that other crypto offerings may experience the same with one now having its foot in the door. But bad in the fact that the "big guys" have now taken serious notice of cryptos and likely more ready to pounce on any new opportunities, unlike how many ignored Bitcoin in the beginning. Thus greatly limiting future opportunities for the "little guy" in the crypto arena.

The other bad thing developing in the crypto arena is asset backed cryptos. I at first saw that as maybe a good thing, but not see it as the "card" that may cause the crypto arena to crumble. It may destroy the value of cryptos altogether, rendering them as simply more than a fiat currency with little to no market.

The real value of a crypto currency is based upon the strength of its network, rather than some specific asset. The concept is difficult to understand and hard to explain to newcomers, but it is an important point. People like the idea that a currency is backed by something tangible, however, a quantity of gold that exists in a warehouse somewhere, no matter how well protected and insured, isn’t much more tangible than the “full faith and credit” of such and such government and/or other organization that is operating the fiat printing press.
No. 402     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 25   on  Jul 22, 2014 at 11:23 PM     
Last year, the Winklevoss twins predicted that Bitcoin is set to become Gold 2.0, right now it’s starting to look as if they might well be right. Every day, according to estimates, around £220bn of gold changes hands in London. The gold price has been set since 1919 by the London Gold Fix. But, of late, the gold fix mechanism has been somewhat losing its luster and there plans to remove the fix mechanism and thus expectations there will be drastic drop in the value of gold.
No. 403     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 25, 2014 at 9:16 PM     
As of this evening, the largest and most popular Bitcoin forum that exist is allowing links to my hardware ads to be posted on their forum. In less than 30 minutes I was getting "hits".
No. 404     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 27, 2014 at 6:50 PM     
Has anyone heard about a new, gold-backed crypto-currency called, 'Goldfish'?

Listen from about halfway in (2nd segment, about 12 minutes in) on this interview by Max Keiser, esp. at the end...




No. 405     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 27, 2014 at 8:05 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Has anyone heard about a new, gold-backed crypto-currency called, 'Goldfish'?



No, I have never heard of Goldfish. Interesting video though. Not only the discussion on Bitcoin.

Personally, I do not see an asset backed crypto-currency working any better than any other such typical currency has. Too much "dis-joint" between the currency and the "storehouse.

The value in a currency that will sustain, needs to be the currency itself. Which is what such as Bitcoin provides, despite how difficult it is for many to grasp. Same as a gold coin provides tangible value for itself, versus the gold being stored off somewhere else to back a coin made out of some other material.
No. 406     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 30, 2014 at 12:08 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:



Your BitCoin payment is likely going to have to be transacted via one of the merchant service providers such as PayPal or Anovia.




Is this personal speculation, Darrell? I follow the Bitcoin news fairly closely and have heard absolutely nothing like this at all and due to the reasons behind the creation of Bitcoin, I would find this idea unlikely.



No longer speculation. PayPal is officially planning to start processing Bitcoin transactions.
No. 407     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 30, 2014 at 12:29 AM     
Bitcoin ATM machines are starting to popup all over the place. Thus far, most are not what I expected them to look like. They are simply small little portable boxes/processors that connect to the Internet and allow consumers to convert cash to Bitcoin in 15 seconds.

I am looking at becoming a reseller of one particular model, but there are some "hoops" to jump through to become authorized to sell them. The model I am considering is small and easily portable, connects to Internet by Ethernet or WiFi, geared towards easy onsite location for storefronts, bars, vendors, merchants, conferences, farmers markets, meetups, etc.
No. 408     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jul 31, 2014 at 12:36 AM     
I am finally starting to accumulate shares of INNcoin, the gold backed crypto. Supposedly, I can contact a gold dealer called Anthem Vault, and they will accept the crypto in exchange for gold and/or USD.

I am somewhat starting to think the entire INNcoin thing is quite possibly no more than a marketing gimmick for such gold dealers to possibly acquire new customers. For those that really want to own some gold, at this point, it appears it may be easier and less costly to simply buy it outright versus mining a gold backed crypto. If it were not for the fact my PC has a powerful enough processor to solve the algorithms and I leave it on 24/7 for other reasons, it would likely cost me more to mine the coin than what value in gold I can exchange it for.

In fact, I am somewhat seeing all the asset backed crypto currencies as simply marketing gimmicks with apparent hopes of creating locked-in clientele.

Although, Anthem Vault does appear to be a gold dealer worth checking out a little further for other than the crypto.
No. 409     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 1, 2014 at 12:47 AM     
I have not any idea of their value at this time, but I have accumulated 150 of the new gold backed INNcoins in my PC's "idle" time.

Now that I know that I can successfully mine this particular algorithm, I am more interested in mining a crypto called Dark Coin than I am in mining any asset backed crypto.
No. 410     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 2, 2014 at 1:36 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Has anyone heard about a new, gold-backed crypto-currency called, 'Goldfish'?



INNcoin claims to the world's first gold backed crypto, but it is not true. E-gold was actually the first, and failed back in 1996.

I do not envision any asset backed crypto being successful over time. It is simply not feasible. Nevertheless, I am currently mining INNcoin and accumulating a minimum of 50 coins per day. Hopefully, I will get it exchanged for gold or USD before it plays out.
No. 411     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 3, 2014 at 11:51 AM     
My gold back crypto is now accumulating at the rate of 100 coins per day. That is double what I was producing.

I have not pointed an more hashing power in that direction. Typically that only leaves that the difficulty factor has lessened or many have stopped mining it. I doubt the difficulty has lessened.

I have read in the forum on this coin that many have mined it for only a couple to a few hours and then stopped because they seen no shares accumulated or coins credited. People have become too accustomed to pool mining. You may see shares credited within seconds when pool mining. But with a new crypto were as there are no pools and can only be mined solo such as INNcoin, it may be days before you fill the "pipeline" with shares to your credit and start to see them flow into your wallet. My guess is that the "inexperienced" miners are already baling on the coin due to their lack of patience.
No. 412     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Aug 11, 2014 at 5:29 PM     
Beware of Bitcoin, US consumer agency warns
Grant Gross @GrantGross

Aug 11, 2014 12:21 PM





Bitcoin and other virtual currencies can expose users to a number of risks, including hackers and scammers trying to take advantage of hype surrounding the technology, a U.S. consumer protection agency warned Monday.

Bitcoin and other popular virtual currencies such as XPR and Dogecoin offer fewer consumer protections than traditional banks or credit card providers, the U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB) said in a consumer advisory. The six-page document appears to be aimed largely at new users of virtual currencies, and it includes an explanation of virtual currencies and an advisory on how to buy them.

“Virtual currencies may have potential benefits, but consumers need to be cautious and they need to be asking the right questions,” CFPB Director Richard Cordray said in a statement. “Virtual currencies are not backed by any government or central bank, and at this point consumers are stepping into the Wild West when they engage in the market.”


Virtual currencies offer the potential for innovation, but “a lot of big issues have yet to be addressed,” the CFPB’s advisory said.

The CFPB advisory notes that virtual currencies are targets for “highly sophisticated hackers,” and they can cost consumers more to use than credit cards or cash. It also warns users to be prepared to weather large price fluctuations, with a one-day, 80 percent price drop in the value of bitcoins earlier this year.

The agency also warned users to be on the watch for Ponzi schemes and other scams related to virtual currencies. “Many criminals have seized upon the press and enthusiasm relating to virtual currency to create new versions of old scams,” the advisory said.

The CFPB advisory includes stories of people who’ve lost money using virtual currencies, including a man who mistakenly discarded a hard drive containing his privacy keys for US$5 million worth of bitcoins. Another Bitcoin user had about $10,000 worth of the currency stolen from an account maintained by a Bitcoin company and was not refunded, the advisory said.

Veterans of the Bitcoin industry said they welcome the report, but said it doesn’t give potential users a full picture of the currency.

The bulletin provides a comprehensive list of Bitcoin risks, and people not familiar with the risks should read the publication, said Jaron Lukasiewicz, CEO of Bitcoin exchange Coinsetter. “Not covered in the CFPB’s letter are the many benefits to using bitcoin, including the fact that it is a low cost alternative to banking for underprivileged families,” he added by email.

Barry Silbert, founder of online asset-selling marketplace SecondMarket, said he was happy to see the warnings, but he noted that some other currencies have similar risks.

“I think it is fair to say that a number of the risks highlighted could also be applied to cash,” he said by email. “Investing in bitcoin is indeed risky, but using it is no more risky than using physical U.S. dollars.”
No. 413     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 11, 2014 at 7:04 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Beware of Bitcoin, US consumer agency warns
Grant Gross @GrantGross

Aug 11, 2014 12:21 PM





Bitcoin and other virtual currencies can expose users to a number of risks, including hackers and scammers trying to take advantage of hype surrounding the technology, a U.S. consumer protection agency warned Monday.



The Bitcoin network has never ever been hacked.

Individual wallets and accounts have, but for the very same reasons that individuals make their other online accounts vulnerable to such. Most accounts are hacked into simply due to poor id and password management.

Most reputable digital currency accounts have two and three factor authorization essentially making them impossible to hack into and make a transaction without your authorization unless one is very careless with their private information involving PC use, email, and smartphone.

I cannot make a transaction in my digital currency vault without first logging in with the PC the account was setup on. That takes at a minimum two factor authorization alone and cannot be done on a different PC without further multiple factor authorization yet. The transaction then takes me initiating the transaction from within my account, confirming it there, entering a code then from my smartphone, and confirming from two total separate email accounts that I made the transaction before the transaction will actually execute, and even then there is a 48 period allowing me an opportunity to cancel the transaction. And on top of that, all actual currency is stored offline and not directly accessible from online anyway. Thus the 48 hour delay.

The major digital currency networks are likely the least vulnerable online financial systems in the world.
No. 414     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Aug 12, 2014 at 11:45 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

Beware of Bitcoin, US consumer agency warns
Grant Gross @GrantGross

Aug 11, 2014 12:21 PM





Bitcoin and other virtual currencies can expose users to a number of risks, including hackers and scammers trying to take advantage of hype surrounding the technology, a U.S. consumer protection agency warned Monday.



The Bitcoin network has never ever been hacked.

Individual wallets and accounts have, but for the very same reasons that individuals make their other online accounts vulnerable to such. Most accounts are hacked into simply due to poor id and password management.

Most reputable digital currency accounts have two and three factor authorization essentially making them impossible to hack into and make a transaction without your authorization unless one is very careless with their private information involving PC use, email, and smartphone.

I cannot make a transaction in my digital currency vault without first logging in with the PC the account was setup on. That takes at a minimum two factor authorization alone and cannot be done on a different PC without further multiple factor authorization yet. The transaction then takes me initiating the transaction from within my account, confirming it there, entering a code then from my smartphone, and confirming from two total separate email accounts that I made the transaction before the transaction will actually execute, and even then there is a 48 period allowing me an opportunity to cancel the transaction. And on top of that, all actual currency is stored offline and not directly accessible from online anyway. Thus the 48 hour delay.

The major digital currency networks are likely the least vulnerable online financial systems in the world.


Hey Thanks for you perspective on this because I still want to get into Bitcoin at some point!
No. 415     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 12, 2014 at 5:20 PM     
insular926 wrote:Hey Thanks for you perspective on this because I still want to get into Bitcoin at some point!


You are welcome.

If the value of Bitcoin does not go drastically higher soon, if the cost of efficient hardware does not become less costly at introduction, and/or electricity cost does not becomes much less, the window of opportunity for the little guy mining from home to see a positive ROI is about to close.

Mining will still be able to be reasonably done and possibly worthwhile for those banking on a big run up in the value of Bitcoin. Although I see such a jump in BTC value as very likely, I am not putting all my eggs in that basket. The quickly growing number of those becoming involved in Bitcoin on a large scale is keeping the value down/stable. That leaves becoming more efficient with use of hardware and lowering the costs of operating as the keys to current profit margin. Getting tougher for the little guy to stay ahead of that quickly migrating curve.

I am very close to being totally migrated over to a business model were as my own mining is being done for essentially free using hardware of those that pre-purchase the hardware from me, with my promise to turn the hardware over to them at a later date. It boils down to that electricity, cost of Internet, time and effort are my only real investment that now produce me a steady and reliable daily income.

The following is quoted from Josh Garza, CEO of GAW Miners, of whom I partnered with last week. My agreement contract is currently being processed to become an authorized distributor/reseller of their hardware and services. In fact, I received communication from Josh just today seeking my minimum weekly hardware requirements from them. Partnered with them I am essentially looking to duplicate their current operation here in Michigan, only on a smaller scale. GAW represents the direction digital currency mining is quickly taking.:

"I think so, just not the “easy money.” Now it just takes some planning and math. But, like with most things, with hard work there is a ton of money to be made. But small-time miners hitting positive ROIs are a thing of the past.

Mining will always be profitable (that’s how the network difficulty algorithms adapt) but as more people and investors pour into the space, only the bigger dogs will win. You can still make money at home with the right hardware, but not for long. Soon, you’ll have to buy (or buy into) large hyper-efficient ASIC units run in data centers where electric costs are cheapest.

Mining is following the same path the Internet took. At first the world wide web existed mostly in desktop units people ran in their basements. Now the internet is mainly housed in servers that are run in massive data centers where management, storage, and electricity costs are low. It’s simply uneconomical to run a server at home anymore. The same is happening here."
No. 416     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 12, 2014 at 6:54 PM     
BTW - Josh Garza is the guy that purchased the domain name "BTC.com" for $1 million last week.
No. 417     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Aug 13, 2014 at 11:38 PM     
LOL. Miners that just came on the scene hardly 30-40 days are now the old technology. I just migrated to all new miners over the past month except for a couple old ones that still earn their keep.

Today I reduced my prices on my existing hardware and ran pre-sell ads for the new hardware shipping from the factory in September.
No. 418     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 14, 2014 at 5:19 PM     
The bottom has kind of fell out of BTC value past couple of days. But it was expected to take a summer loll with all the new hardware hitting the network and all the enterprise miners entering the game.

20nm hardware is available now.

May be a very good time to buy some BTC outright, although I just sold most all I had at around $600 just a few days ago. Now down to almost $500.
No. 419     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 14, 2014 at 6:11 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

The bottom has kind of fell out of BTC value past couple of days. But it was expected to take a summer loll with all the new hardware hitting the network and all the enterprise miners entering the game.



The so called BTC value experts have painted a somewhat different picture.

First, they say there was a "glitch" with the BitFinex reporting indicating a false low value.

Secondly, possibly because of the false low value, it is assumed that many miners actually shut down their hardware or moved to mining something more profitable than BTC, until the value of BTC goes back up.

Such makes sense to me, but it also makes sense to me that now would be time to mine as much possible with the potential that the difficulty factor will not rise as quickly with a large mass of miners exiting the activity.

I have more hardware operating at the moment than I ever have. I have more than doubled my local ability to mine and have substantially increased my off-site mining, with migrating to more off-site mining in the coming weeks.
No. 420     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 15, 2014 at 2:31 AM     
This week I started setting up miners with a colocation/data center. Currently they have one of my Bitcoin miners and one of my Litecoin miners. Going to try them for at least 30 days.

They provide the electricity, Internet, and maintain them. They guarantee 99.9% uptime. I have access to them via the Internet 24/7, no matter where I am at as long I can connect to the Internet, allowing me to change my choice of pools to mine. They plan to implement new features soon such as allowing me to even change currency mined and possibly allowing me to switch the miner to mine for a client, which is my ultimate goal. At this time, there is more profit in mining for others than there is in mining for yourself. Therefore, for the time being, I will continue to maintain a farm of miners at my residence leased out to clients.
No. 421     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 15, 2014 at 1:57 PM     
Wow. I have read that BTC price slipped down to about $430. Now back to almost $500.

But I have seen more drastic change. I watched it tumble from about $1200 to less than $300 and then go back to over $900.

Seems that every time it experiences a drastic drop, it then hits a new high for the period within days of the low.
No. 422     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 16, 2014 at 7:31 PM     
BTC value is recovering nicely. The mistake now is that I did not purchase more at under $500 than I did. But I kept my miners operating, were as some supposedly stopped for a couple days with the drop in value.
No. 423     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 19, 2014 at 11:13 AM     
Yesterday I jumped in and purchased BTC directly with its fall down to $460. May buy more today.

The real bargain is that even though the value of BTC has dropped, those that accept BTC as payment have not raised the BTC price. Making it well worth it to exchange USD for BTC prior to making the purchases.

I have purchased several items recently using BTC as payment resulting in at least a 35% discount as to what they would have cost me using USD. Those kind of bargains cannot be passed up.

Yesterday, I purchased items that cost $380USD for the equivalent of less than $250USD each using BTC.
No. 424     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 20, 2014 at 2:28 AM     
I have revisited an old path with crypto mining and it has embarked me upon a new path, strategy, whatever one may want to call it.

I am now approaching having about 1/3 as much Scrypt(Litecoin) mining hardware operating as I have of SHA-256(Bitcoin) hardware operating. I originally did not favor the Scrypt hardware other than it allowed me to speculate with accumulating some Litecoin. I quickly learned that Litecoin mining was almost not worth the time, effort, and expense for the ROI. The bottom fell out of Litecoin quickly.

Several weeks ago, no longer interested in Litecoin, I pulled the Scrypt hardware away from specifically mining Litecon and began Scrypt multi-currency mining with them. They essentially became "out of sight out of mind" so to speak. The multi-pools automatically switch to mining the most profitable Scrypt currency at the moment, and as mined I opted to automatically convert immediately to Bitcoin. After it was all setup, I kind of ignored it and concentrated on other interests.

Over the past few weeks, this strategy has quietly exceeded my ROI of directly mining Bitcoin with SHA-256 hardware. Even though Litecoin is not hardly worth mining, mining the multi-pools with the lower cost more efficient Scrypt miners and converting to Bitcoin, is producing a higher return on investment than directly mining Bitcoin.

Since last week I have sold most the new Bitcoin mining hardware, at a profit of course, that I just accumulated over the past 1-3 weeks. Have taken those funds this week and partnered with Josh over at GAW Miners in procuring Scrypt hardware that is resulting in providing me more Bitcoin than directly mining Bitcoin for less investment.

At this point, there is really no out of pocket investment for me any longer. Bitcoin has essentially paid for and them some for all that is now providing me a regular daily income. If I so desired, it provides enough daily income to buy me 7-8 more efficient virtual Scrypt miners per day free and clear. But I have other more immediate needs to spend such funds on.
No. 425     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 20, 2014 at 5:38 PM     
BTC has rallied back up before I had an op to outright buy more and/or buy anything else with it that low.
No. 426     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 20, 2014 at 6:18 PM     
I was down in Madison Heights/Troy area today. That miner colocation/data center that I was considering locating my miners to is now seeking my help after "shunning" me. I say "shunning" me, I do not know if they were really quite not ready to host miners at the time or what was going on, but they drug their feet on answering my questions saying the guy with tech knowledge that could answer such questions was not in at that moment, did not return my calls, etc., until I finally hosted the miners and partnered with another company in a totally different state. Connecticut to be exact.

Anyway, one of my primary concerns was could miners be hosted with them and provide the owner of the miner access via the Internet for altering and changing mining parameters as desired. They replied "yes", but that the tech guy would have to discuss it with me. But the tech guy was supposedly never available.

I know how to do it with my miners located at home, I simply wanted to be sure I could do it with miners hosted by them. Well as of this past weekend their tech guy has been contacting me asking how to do it. This week I have sold them hardware to be installed at their center, provided them the custom software required, and have provided the "tech guy" the technical assistance required to enable them to offer such access. But I will likely not now place my own miners with them, without them providing me at least 75% discount on the hosting.

BTW - At a local PC store down that way I was buying items to restock my inventory on the items I just sold to the data center. I somehow got to talking with a young guy in the store purchasing expensive internal computer case fans. I informed him that I buy mine directly from the factory in China and get them for 1/4 of what that store sells them for. That led to him asking what I do with them. To make a long story short, that led to talking about Bitcoin and Litecoin, he expressed he has interest in mining himself but does not have the knowledge as to how to do it. Formal introductions followed, contact information exchanged, and we pursued the conversation outside the store. Conversation went from Bitcoin to day trading to real estate investing back to mining Bitcoin.

Turns out he is a young doctor that "hates" his job. He said he has had a burning desire to leave his job and pursue his "own thing" such as I have. He asked about what kind of return/income I am now seeing versus when I had a 9-5 job, etc. He was impressed, and again expressed how he "hates" his job and wished he was doing similar. But I cautioned him that even though that gross amount sounds fantastic, that I am now paying all my own insurances, expenses, setting aside for what little income tax will have to be paid, etc. from that fantastic amount of more than twice what I earned as an employee.

He then says I am not going to need medical insurance any longer. LOL. He offered to hire me as his personal consultant to primarily instruct him in crypto currency mining, but also on any and all other income streams I pursue. Day trading, real estate, ebay, he wants in my MLM, etc. Says he will pay me and also provide whatever medical care, prescriptions, medical devices, etc, in compensation for consultation.

In fact, he performed a quick exam on me today and provided a second opinion on a condition I just went to my own doctor for this morning thinking a previous condition had returned, but was told it was nothing. I left a little confused, still in pain, and not sure why. This doctor concluded same as my doctor. There is really nothing wrong, but added that my fitness routine is likely causing some irritation and inflammation in a muscle in my back, thus the pain I experience.

God works in mysterious ways and in realms were as you may not think He would be. In reality, I know better and am used to such inspiration happening daily. I am often already in discussion with Him on most everything going on in my life, but this incident did kind of catch me by pleasant surprise. If nothing more comes of it, appears I have maybe made a new friend and got free confirmation that my medical concern is really nothing.
No. 427     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 21, 2014 at 11:18 AM     
I knew I should have snagged more BTC when it was down to $430 to $460 only like less than a week ago. If nothing else I should have at least snagged more and purchased more inventory with it essentially increasing ROI dramatically when you take exchange values into account.
No. 428     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 22, 2014 at 10:43 AM     
I now have 9 miners quietly mining away offsite without me having to be concerned with providing the electricity, Internet, uptime, etc..

I do not yet have all the remote options as I would like to have, but Josh says it is the process of being implemented quickly. I have devised a way around the current limitations, but the US government has decreed that manner of transferring crypto currency as questionable, thus possibly illegal without being a licensed "money broker". Ironically, each step the Feds take in this direction becomes a precedence supporting the recognized legality of crypto currencies.

BTW - The investment to become involved in this game have drastically dropped since I actively became involved in February. The same hashing/mining power now cost well less than 10% of what it did.

The technology is evolving quickly. Crypto mining has been the catalyst promoting expedient computer power gains and efficiency as the "race to space" was to quickly advancing technology and new products.
No. 429     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 23, 2014 at 3:50 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I now have 9 miners quietly mining away offsite without me having to be concerned with providing the electricity, Internet, uptime, etc..




As of today, I now have 33 miners operating remotely producing BTC daily either directly or indirectly. All acquired for essentially free.
No. 430     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 61   on  Aug 23, 2014 at 5:46 PM     
Thought you might find this interesting, Darrell...

https://www.amagimetals.com/info/no-dollars-after-2016/
No. 431     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 23, 2014 at 6:58 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Thought you might find this interesting, Darrell...

https://www.amagimetals.com/info/no-dollars-after-2016/



Thanks Storm. Interesting. That is the second precious metals dealer I am aware of doing similar, but not quite the same.

Anthem Vault actually rolled out their own crypto currency backed by gold. At the moment, they are also supposedly the only place to exchange the currency for precious metals or USD.

I have the software that mines the currency installed on one PC. It mines during the PC's "idle time". Currently I have about 1000 of the coins in my wallet, but at this point I think one coin is not worth but a fraction of a cent.

The mining slows the PC down drastically to do anything else at the same time. Therefore I disable mining when using the PC for anything else. If I do not forget to enable mining when I complete whatever else I was doing, it will currently produce about 48-100 coins per day as a solo miner. Some are doing better than that via pooled mining, but I have not really looked into that for this currency. Kind of a low priority project.
No. 432     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 26, 2014 at 1:10 PM     
BTC value edging back up too soon for my liking. I was actually reaping a better ROI on hardware sales with the value of BTC down versus the USD.
No. 433     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 30, 2014 at 7:12 AM     
It is simply amazing at how quickly this crypto currency industry has grown and the technology advancements evolved so quickly. Hardly a day goes by something new and innovative is not introduced.

Having said that, it now takes being very creative for a "little guy" to maintain an ROI. The increasing difficulty factor combined with the number of enterprise players is making it very competitive for a "little guy" to simply only mine as a stand alone operation unless he is just about getting his electricity for free.

There is still some window of opportunity to knock out a very lucrative ROI if one is creative and/or combines efforts with others. Of course if the value of BTC drastically increases from the $400-$600 range per coin it has pretty much held for weeks, an entire new set of dynamics evolve changing the rules of the game again.

Miners have essentially become the core of the Bitcoin network that secure the system. They are rewarded with Bitcoin for doing so. It is like having a factory working for you 24/7. But you have to stay on top of managing the factory to maintain its efficiency for the highest ROI possible.
No. 434     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 61   on  Aug 30, 2014 at 10:22 AM     
You still building ACN, Darrell?
No. 435     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 30, 2014 at 10:36 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

You still building ACN, Darrell?



Yes, although I allowed it to take a backseat to Bitcoin for the summer, my downline is growing and I see income from ACN at least monthly if not every two weeks. Bonus checks are every two weeks of which I do not always earn, but residual income checks are once per month and I will likely see that income the rest of my life and it will then pass on to my daughter and on to her heirs. That is the nice thing about an MLM. You can walk away and or die and it still has a life of its own earning income.

Not only is there the income aspect but the ACN services are free to qualifying reps. Even customers that do not become ACN reps can now obtain their personal ACN services for free with 5 referrals that also sign up for the same service. This is such as cellphone, home phone, etc.

Our next International convention is in Ohio. I am in a dilemma at the moment as to if I can be there all 3-4 days(it is officially 3 days but I am often invited to be there early as part of the "insider" leadership group). I have a wedding conflict that same weekend. I am going to do my best to be there at least one day of the official three.

BTW - ACN is the only MLM opportunity that has ever continued to provide me the same level and more of residual income whether I remain directly involved 24/7 or not.
No. 436     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Aug 31, 2014 at 4:32 PM     
If you didn't do bitcoin, which one would be the runner up?
No. 437     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Aug 31, 2014 at 4:48 PM     
insular926 wrote:

If you didn't do bitcoin, which one would be the runner up?



Bitcoin is still the best to own and transact with, and it will likely remain that way for a longtime. No other crypto is even scratching the surface to get to where Bitcoin is currently at. But Bitcoin is quickly becoming more difficult and costly to mine for the return.

That is not to say that other cryptos do not have value and are being widely traded, but they are doing so in kind of an underworld environment versus the current open acceptance Bitcoin is enjoying.

I would do as I am currently doing. Most my miners are now Scrypt miners setup on multi-pools. They mine the most profitable coin at that moment and automatically convert to Bitcoin as mined. At times I am mining a coin I have never even heard of. Most the time I do not even know what has been mined. I only know my realized gain is now as much as 30% more than when I was dedicated to only mining Bitcoin.
No. 438     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 5, 2014 at 1:59 AM     
Even though many US colleges are cracking down on Bitcoin miners being used on campus in the dorm rooms, some have publically announced they will be accepting Bitcoins for payment of college related bills.
No. 439     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 6, 2014 at 1:41 PM     
I now have a minimum of 42 miners sitting in other states mining for me remotely. Now no matter where I am at, via the Internet, I can access and manipulate most of them as desired without having to physically be at the same location logged into a PC on the same network. Yeah!

I am mining about 50/50 now. Half the power is mining the SHA-256 algorithm while the other half is mining the Scrypt algorithm.

With the value of BTC down under $500 at the moment, I have directly purchased a lot of it, effectively increasing my buying power for USD by at least 30%. Many of the merchants and vendors have not increased the BTC price of the merchandise they accept BTC for.

I do not like to see the value of BTC drop, but ironically it has increased what I am able to obtain for my USD.
No. 440     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 61   on  Sep 10, 2014 at 5:42 PM     
You might be interested in this, Darrell...

http://www.meetup.com/MichiganBitcoiners/
No. 441     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 23, 2014 at 9:24 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

You might be interested in this, Darrell...

http://www.meetup.com/MichiganBitcoiners/



Thanks Storm. I am a big fan of meetup groups. It appears I maybe missed this one.

But as far as the Bitcoin groups I have investigated thus far, they leave much to be desired. I personally do not have the time to commit to them. They are mostly a young ambitious group interested in Bitcoin and currency mining, but way behind the curve. Thus organizing together to increase their knowledge, but still lacking much.

Often a bunch of "kids" hoping to mine with essentially nothing but laptops, desktops, and/or graphics cards. Such low cost hardware does still hold potential for the alt coins, but not for Bitcoin and/or even Litecoin any longer. Would cost them more in electricity than they would ever earn in coin.
No. 442     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 23, 2014 at 9:30 PM     
To my surprise, the tide has changed.

The latest wave of efficient hardware, ironically the drop in Bitcoin value(brought new hardware prices down), favorable exchange rates, etc. have all combined to revive the opportunity for the "home based" miner of Bitcoin. But it is not a "game" for the faint of the heart. The little guy cannot simply just set himself up a dozen or so miners and walk away from them and hope they will continue to provide an effective ROI for weeks to come.
No. 443     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 23, 2014 at 9:49 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

You might be interested in this, Darrell...

http://www.meetup.com/MichiganBitcoiners/



BTW - Although I am no fan of beer, or most alcohol beverages for that matter, the Detroit based meetings of this group are held at the Detroit Beer Company. Known for great burgers. It is also located in a very interesting area of Detroit. An area of revitalization with new business start-ups birthing in rehabbed old buildings and already ranking amongst America's most successful new businesses. I love to regularly check-out the area in search of new "gems" that I may resell online in partnership with these ventures.
No. 444     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 23, 2014 at 10:56 PM     
PayPal has announced a partnership with BitPay, Coinbase, and GoCoin, likely the largest financial processors in the digital currency industry.

I knew PayPal was going to have to do something very soon. ebay Buyers and Sellers have been putting lots of pressure on them to start allowing digital currencies to be used as payment. And PayPal simply does not have the expertise and resources to tackle it on their own starting from "scratch". Not to mention the legal "hurdles" involved with the "co-mingling" of traditional credit/debit card transactions with digital currency transactions.

I am aligned with BitPay and Coinbase. GoCoin is kind of new on the scene. They are all new actually, does not take long to be considered with seniority in this arena.
No. 445     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Sep 24, 2014 at 11:02 AM     
BTC value has jumped almost 10% in the past 24-48 hours. That is good or bad depending on one's perspective.

Good for those speculating and holding BTC, of which for the most part I do not. Bad for those using BTC to buy with, which I do almost daily, for vendors are now considering raising the BTC price of an item to coincide with an equivalent USD value. For many weeks one has been able to purchase and pay for product with BTC at 30-50 percent discount to the USD price. With many such buyers then turning around and reselling the items at a substantial profit.
No. 446     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Oct 14, 2014 at 10:15 AM     
I guess when push comes to shove the innovators do succeed. It is simply amazing as to how almost just yesterday it seemed the little guy was pushed out, and then like just the next morning the world is there for the taking by the little guy.

The Bitcoin mining industry, crypto currency mining in general for that matter, is about to successfully round its most recent precarious curve and emerge with more success potential than ever.

The coming changes and potential features are simply mind boggling.
No. 447     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Oct 14, 2014 at 10:31 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:



The coming changes and potential features are simply mind bobbling.


Wait! "mind bobbling"?

Don't you actually mean "mind boggling"?
No. 448     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Oct 14, 2014 at 10:33 AM     
insular926 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:



The coming changes and potential features are simply mind bobbling.


Wait! "mind bobbling"?

Don't you actually mean "mind boggling"?



LOL. Yes, that is what I meant. My PC often fills in for me what it thinks I am about to type.
No. 449     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Nov 3, 2014 at 10:58 PM     
I am about to play a role/be involved in the launch of brand new crypto currency. Comes online 3 weeks from today. Good or bad, it will be a currency backed by USD. Was about the only option at this time to shield early adopters from risk and increase acceptance by large institutions.

My planned involvement with this is to get my "feet wet" best I can in what such an undertaking involves, and then decide if I really want to proceed with establishing my own pool, and/or my own exchange, and/or even my own currency.
No. 450     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Nov 11, 2014 at 2:32 PM     
What a fascinating story! A Bitcoin Ponzi Scheme and this guy lives right up the road from me in McKinney!..


http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/11/06/us-bitcoin-charges-idINKBN0IQ24V20141106
No. 451     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Nov 12, 2014 at 2:22 PM     
insular926 wrote:

What a fascinating story! A Bitcoin Ponzi Scheme and this guy lives right up the road from me in McKinney!..


http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/11/06/us-bitcoin-charges-idINKBN0IQ24V20141106



Interesting. But the misleading I see being done here by the Feds/SEC is referring to investing in Bitcoin as being dangerous due to being an unsecured currency. Actually, Bitcoin is no more unsecured than USDs. Quite possibly even more secure, although maybe less stable at this time. But a digital currency is by far no more unsecured than any other fiat currency as it stands. Now if they are referring to FDIC backing, etc., that is a different matter.
No. 452     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 26   on  Nov 12, 2014 at 2:41 PM     
As much as I would like to not be burdened with a physical "brick and mortar" store, hardly a day goes by now that I do not get one or two contacts from potential mining hardware buyers asking if I have a place of business they can visit. Most are within a 2 hour drive from me, but some have been as far away as NC.

I have recently relented and started meeting Buyers in public places to pick up their goods from me, if and only if they have already paid me online. But the requests are growing and the practice inconvenient. Although more profitable per transaction than selling online and then shipping. Buyers are paying me a premium to get the hardware in their hands ASAP.

I just met a guy in Fenton who drove from over an hour away, twice now, to pick up hardware, and now have another driving about 45 minutes to meet me in Grand Blanc to pick his new miner.

Data I have been collecting leads me to believe I could open a storefront most anywhere locally and have it support itself. There is really no competition other than Internet vendors, and ironically as the interest in crypto mining grows, there appears to be need for those interested to physically see the hardware operate and get some hands on experience before actually buying hardware.

I am also getting contacts asking if I can provide space to operate miners for those that do not have the facilities to do so or simply do not want to bother with that part of mining but still desire to own their own hardware. The closest competition for that is a datacenter in Troy, and they have quickly gained a poor reputation.
No. 453     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Jan 17, 2015 at 10:19 PM     
With BTC values down like they are at the moment, and the mining difficulty factor as high as it is, it is almost not cost effective to mine Bitcoin unless speculating on a run up in value. For most home operated miners, the electricity now cost more than the value of the currency you mine.

But I encountered a guy this past week that claims with solar panels and wind turbines, he is generating enough electricity to keep his miners operating and sell power to the utility company. Thus paying for his alternative energy generators.

I find such hard to believe for a homeowner setup, but he is the second guy to tell me such in recent months.
No. 454     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  crayons   Gender: M   Age: 59   on  Jan 17, 2015 at 10:26 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

With BTC values down like they are at the moment, and the mining difficulty factor as high as it is, it is almost not cost effective to mine Bitcoin unless speculating on a run up in value. For most home operated miners, the electricity now cost more than the value of the currency you mine.

But I encountered a guy this past week that claims with solar panels and wind turbines, he is generating enough electricity to keep his miners operating and sell power to the utility company. Thus paying for his alternative energy generators.

I find such hard to believe for a homeowner setup, but he is the second guy to tell me such in recent months.


I remember a song money for nothing get your checks for free...
No. 455     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Jan 18, 2015 at 7:04 PM     
Fortunately I saw the writing on the wall weeks to months ago and have migrated most all my mining to cloud mining. No matter what the value of BTC is doing, it does not cost me any more or any less to keep miners going. In fact, I just expanded to mining a new digital currency.

I still have a couple miners operating from "home", but primarily for research purposes and hardware/software testing and development.
No. 456     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Feb 12, 2015 at 11:33 AM     
Utah Legislator Introduces Bill To Promote Bitcoin -

Utah State Rep. Mark K. Roberts has introduced a bill to create a Council on Payment Options for State Services with the intention of promoting Bitcoin-related industries and the use of Bitcoin for state business. The resolution, H.C.R. 6, encourages the use of Bitcoin for state business and notes that Utah could become a key player in promoting Bitcoin.
No. 457     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Feb 15, 2015 at 12:05 AM     
www.simplewifi.com now accepts Bitcoin Payments.
No. 458     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Feb 15, 2015 at 6:59 PM     
insular926 wrote:

www.simplewifi.com now accepts Bitcoin Payments.


In the past week, I have made 3 purchases at Overstock.com. They have been accepting BTC as payment for some time now.
No. 459     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Feb 17, 2015 at 7:12 PM     
I have read that Obama has signed some kind of Bill to implement a “dollar upgrade” by October 2015. Not a lot of info yet, but some kind of digital currency/transaction system using NFC technology that will supposedly improve the current dollar to begin with, but eventually eliminate cash, checks, credit cards, and supposedly all digital currencies such as Bitcoin. Within 3 years you will supposedly only be able to pay for anything in the US via a smartphone.
No. 460     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Mar 17, 2015 at 11:35 PM     
I was down Detroit way yesterday and picked up and put 5 new BTC miners online last night. These babies produce more than twice the amount of Bitcoin for the same electricity used.

Over recent months I had kind of migrated away from directly operating my own hardware, and moved more heavily to utilizing cloud mining.

I continue to get many requests to provide feedback and reviews on numerous hardware and what direction the industry is going. Without some hands on experience with the new technology it is difficult to provide an accurate assessment. These new miners could be the answer and the game changer for the "little guy" still desiring to directly mine cryptos.

I already packaged one and shipped off to someone else in CA. I have requests for the others, but desire to use them a little first. At the moment, these are not available to purchase until April, unless you can find someone with a previous release batch willing to sell them.
No. 461     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Mar 18, 2015 at 12:46 AM     
Yeah, these babies are cranking out some coin.
No. 462     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 32   on  Mar 18, 2015 at 9:56 AM     
I have decided to sell them quickly after testing. I do not desire to "babysit" miners this summer.
No. 463     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 19, 2015 at 12:29 PM     
For good or bad, I have resumed operating miners locally. I have acquired 10-20 28nm chip based machines. Supposedly the most efficient on the market for SHA-256 currency mining. They are pretty much stand alone with a self contained controller, power supply, and Wireless connectivity to the Internet. Not very high GH/s capacity per machine though. Over-clocked I may be able to get 200 GH/s each out of them.

My primary goal is to test them for at least 24-48 hours, deem them stable and reliable, and then resell them.

If nothing else, they provide enough heat that my furnace runs way less in the winter. For that reason alone, I am putting my local 1+ TH/s machines back online soon.

Otherwise, for the past several months 99% of my digital currency mining has been done via cloud mining setups.
No. 464     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 19, 2015 at 1:24 PM     
That was fast. I had 6 machines online wirelessly and mining the Bitcoin pool I am part owner of in less than 20 minutes. No machine to date has been this fast for me to get it online and efficiently operating.

4 machines to be delivered later today, with an unknown delivery date at this time on the remaining 10.

There was a time I would have questioned operating several small capacity miners versus one or two larger ones, but experience has revealed some advantages with the small machine route.

For one thing, I can operate 10 of these smaller machines for less electricity than one of my large machines (1000 watts versus 1300 watts) and achieve a higher GH/s throughput (1.5+ TH/s versus .8-1.2 TH/s).

Another advantage is, if the large one goes "down", all mining is stopped for that capacity for that period of downtime. If one of the little ones goes "down", I am only losing 10% capacity for the period of downtime.
No. 465     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 21, 2015 at 12:13 AM     
I am exploring attending a class at NYU in November titled "Digital Currency: Revolution in Money and Payments?". A costly course though. Hopefully I can redeem the expense from current mining and/or hardware sales. I may possibly find something similar for less cost from such as Great Courses.
No. 466     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 21, 2015 at 12:26 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I am exploring attending a class at NYU in November titled "Digital Currency: Revolution in Money and Payments?". A costly course though. Hopefully I can redeem the expense from current mining and/or hardware sales. I may possibly find something similar for less cost from such as Great Courses.


Wow! Not specifically related to digital currency, but Great Courses has well over 22 courses related to the economy, finances, and/or investing. Credible courses, but it does not appear they may be applied as education credits towards any kind certification or license. When I can "kill two birds with one stone" I often do with such, thus in addition to some education and maybe experience, also have the credentials to fall back on for my time and effort invested.
No. 467     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 21, 2015 at 9:26 AM     
4 more miners arrived today. I do not think I am going to put them online yet. Still too warm here in MI to generate that much more heat indoors. Being I have electricity out there and the miners do have wireless connectivity, I have pondered putting them online out on the deck. May do that later today. Too much else on the agenda right now.
No. 468     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 21, 2015 at 9:30 AM     
I did move one miner to mining for a cause. All Bitcoin proceeds generated go directly to the digital wallet of an organization involved in development and research of digital currencies.
No. 469     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Sep 24, 2015 at 9:42 PM     
Picked up those other 10 miners from FedEx today. Turns out they had been detained in Oakland CA by customs. The agent had no idea what a Bitcoin miner was, thus would not release them until she could speak with me personally with me informing her as to what a Bitcoin miner is. LOL.

I explained it is simply a computer designed for the specific task of mining digital currencies such as Bitcoin. Did not seem to help much. She then did not know what Bitcoin was. After some further explanation from me, she then replied "Yeah, that is what I read on the Internet. I will go ahead and release these." It appeared as if she was simply checking to see if I provided the same explanation as she had already read.
No. 470     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Sep 24, 2015 at 9:55 PM     
Bitcoin is, of course, becoming more and more mainstream.

There appears to be an interesting government reaction going on currently.

As the government has also become accustomed to Bitcoin, it is considering using crypto-currencies itself, but not Bitcoin, which it does not control, but rather creating its own, and mandating its use if it can, through the use of block exchanges (if I got that right).

Here's how they figure it will work for them. It's been obvious that Western governments have been moving more and more away from cash and into digital money, as they can monitor & control (government's favorite activity...beside war).

So if we are forced to use their crypto-money, and using an initial thousand dollars as an example, you will be required to spend that $1,000 within a certain amount of time - a year, for example. If you don't, and save it instead, after that certain amount of time the $1,000, by government edict, becomes $900, and you have then just lost $100.

Maybe a little later, the government, through a flick of an electronic switch, steals another $100 from you and now you only have $800.

This is not a joke, people. These are evil and corrupted pirates that we have allowed to rule over us, to their own gain and not to ours.

So watch for this. It may or may not happen, but if it does, do not use government crypto-currencies, unless you like going broke. Use non-government ones.
No. 471     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Nov 8, 2015 at 5:38 PM     
Bitcoin is still doing me quite well. In addition to continuing to cloud mine, I have also returned to operating my own miners.

First:
Operating them produces enough heat from the miners that it reduces my winter heating bill considerably.

Second:
The essentially free accumulation of Bitcoin is allowing me to acquire gold and silver in exchange for essentially no out of pocket investment.
No. 472     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Nov 14, 2015 at 8:37 PM     
I received an offer for the purchase of several miners today by one Buyer. They are also offering to pay in full with Bitcoin.

I have not accepted the offer as of yet, but it may be worth my while despite their offer of less than the USD value I desire. Because eBay does not allow BTC as payment, thus I am allowed to complete the transaction outside of eBay and save 13.5% in fees. Plus BTC value has slowly been on the rise, and the amount of BTC they are offering me, if mined myself would erode almost 90% of current value in electricity cost alone. Thus I am essentially more than doubling my money by accepting their offer of a BTC payment.

Perhaps why so many online merchants these day are quickly implementing the acceptance of BTC. Maybe I should keep my BTC and stop paying with it myself. Many merchants offer me up to a 20% discount to pay with BTC, but it appears they are still getting paid a premium when I crunch the numbers and compare to what I clear by accepting BTC as payment.
No. 473     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Dec 12, 2015 at 7:26 AM     
Bitcoin value has more than doubled over the past few days. From hanging around $200 per BTC to now almost $450 per BTC. In fact, a huge part of that surge just happened over the past 24 hours.
No. 474     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 101   on  Dec 18, 2015 at 6:22 PM     
With Bitcoin well more than doubled over the past 2-3 weeks, I sold some off this week. Could not bring myself to sell it all.

With some merchants providing as much as a 30% discount if you pay with Bitcoin, I like to keep some on hand and thus avoid the costs and time of converting from USD to BTC every time I need some BTC to buy with.
No. 475     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  May 20, 2016 at 7:33 PM     
With Bitcoin value back up to were as it can more than pay for itself, I have fired a couple miners up before the hot summer months. I typically take the BTC return and purchase silver with it, getting a discount for paying with BTC.
No. 476     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  May 20, 2016 at 8:44 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

With Bitcoin value back up to were as it can more than pay for itself, I have fired a couple miners up before the hot summer months. I typically take the BTC return and purchase silver with it, getting a discount for paying with BTC.


Currently mining at CEX.io. One of the few still successfully operating open mining pools.

I am actually part owner of P2P BTC mining pool. Of course I mine that pool when up and running, but we have been down a couple days now with a server upgrade issue.
No. 477     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  May 20, 2016 at 8:48 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:
I am actually part owner of P2P BTC mining pool.


I should actually reword that. I own more than one seat on the "exchange". Same as if you may own a seat on a stock market exchange, but you do not actually own the exchange.
No. 478     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 5, 2016 at 9:21 AM     
I just found out the current shopping cart I am developing has a plugin for Bitpay. So I installed it. Configured it and it seems to work well but their "test server" does not seem to be working and says try again later so don't know for sure.

I see the invoice generated has a link that says, "Open is Wallet".

What is the digital thumbnail for that shows up? Is that so a laser scanner can scan it or something? :unsure:

Or so someone can use their cellphone with an app installed and scan it using their camera? :unsure:
No. 479     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 5, 2016 at 10:25 AM     
Ah I found the instructions. https://bitpay.com/pay-with-bitcoin
No. 480     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 56   on  Jun 5, 2016 at 6:25 PM     
So are you telling me that one can MAKE MONEY with an ANT MINER system with Bitcoin?
No. 481     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 5, 2016 at 6:51 PM     
insular926 wrote:

So are you telling me that one can MAKE MONEY with an ANT MINER system with Bitcoin?


I have been from day 1 of becoming involved with it.
No. 482     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 56   on  Jun 5, 2016 at 9:29 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

So are you telling me that one can MAKE MONEY with an ANT MINER system with Bitcoin?


I have been from day 1 of becoming involved with it.



Do you sell The Ant Miner System and if so, how much would it cost me?
No. 483     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 6, 2016 at 6:25 AM     
insular926 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

So are you telling me that one can MAKE MONEY with an ANT MINER system with Bitcoin?


I have been from day 1 of becoming involved with it.



Do you sell The Ant Miner System and if so, how much would it cost me?


Bitmain has produced a variety of Antminer miners/processors. The "system" that would be profitable for you will depend on your cost of electricity, the environment you have available to operate them in, and how many can you operate at once.

For example, if what you are calling an Antminer system is simply those little early ones that you plug into a USB port, they are simply "novelty" miners that allow you say you are mining. One of those by itself will likely never produce enough Bitcoin to pay for itself in your lifetime even if someone gives it to you free. The same can be said for even many of the later models unless you can support an environment of "many" GH/s and your cost of electricity is very low.

Low cost used 28nm miners if operated appropriately, with low cost electricity, cool environment, and operated timed with Bitcoin's drops in value, can still be cost effective.

The name of the game these days is using the latest model 16nm chip miners achieving TH/s speeds in one array of chips. One of the most recent cost over $2100 not including a required at least 1375 watt at the wall APW3 93% efficiency power supply.

The demand is so high for these new miners, the manufacturer is often sold out quickly of each planned "batch" build before produced. Thus when finally available, possibly costing much more than the $2100 I stated. My cost is currently $2100 or less buying directly from Bitmain depending on how many I purchase in one order. They are bringing as much as $4000 each even when sold as "being used until shipped". Therefore, even if I never mine with them, there is a considerable profit margin potential for the effort. But that window of opportunity is often small. Although, thus far, my efforts at mining and/or marketing have more than paid for the hardware and operating expenses involved even with very "outdated" hardware. But overall, I would recommend attempting to stay within two to three generations of releases.

Depending on the electricity in your trailer, you will probably be lucky if you can operate one of these without regularly "kicking" your breakers. Definitely not more than one. And if you are, you will likely not be able to tolerate the "noise" of the miner's fans running 24/7, nor the heat dissipated by just one miner.

These days, unless your electricity is free and you can operate several miners, it pretty much takes the latest model miners to effectively produce Bitcoin as a stand alone operator only able to operate one to a couple miners.

It is a dynamic always changing "environment". For me to effectively produce income from my miners they are often already for sale before I even receive my shipment. The units operate until sold if not sold before I receive them. I may effectively operate several of that same model for a short period, but within 60-90 days likely sold them all and upgrading to whatever is the latest more efficient model. If the used models sit around very long, the cost of electricity becomes an obstacle to effectively operating as well as the increasing difficulty of the mining factor. Although the individual impact of that mining factor is no where near increasing as quickly as it once was if operating with the improved efficiency and power of more recent miners. The more recent generation of miners are allowing me to somewhat abandoned that 60-90 day window. They can be operated effectively for much longer, often only requiring a firmware upgrade to do so.

With some innovation, you can make yourself an exception with "outdated" hardware. But otherwise, if you do not have essentially free electricity and enough of it even if free, and a suitable environment to operate miners, it can easily be a game that takes diligence and staying on top of to not quickly find yourself sitting with "inefficient" equipment that you can possibly only afford to operate when the value of Bitcoin dips. Many are operating in that manner. I have been forced to do so when I do not have the latest models on hand.

There are times when I can effectively operate, but I still shut down due to the heat dissipated from the units requiring expensive AC to be running all the time, thus erasing away the profit. Without the AC going, in the summer the temps are too high to operate except for maybe at night. At least from within a home environment.

I currently have 5 miners at home, and not able to "comfortably" operate them all at once. They are all for sale as I await a shipment of the latest generation models.
No. 484     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 9, 2016 at 11:47 AM     
My understanding is that the price of a bitcoin is approaching $600.

Though I have been very cautious of purchasing bitcoins, it appears that a marketing strategy that I am considering implementing uses bitcoins as a fast-return pay server. I think the server is called "coinbase," though I'd have to review it to be sure.

At any rate, looks like I may be getting more involved with it not too far down the road.
No. 485     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 9, 2016 at 8:16 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

My understanding is that the price of a bitcoin is approaching $600.

Though I have been very cautious of purchasing bitcoins, it appears that a marketing strategy that I am considering implementing uses bitcoins as a fast-return pay server. I think the server is called "coinbase," though I'd have to review it to be sure.

At any rate, looks like I may be getting more involved with it not too far down the road.


I have been involved with Coinbase from their beginnings. They are now the primary "broker" I buy and sell Bitcoin through.

The recent value run up has ignited a new interest in mining BTC, even with old hardware. I sold 3 miners this week. Only have two left in hand.
No. 486     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 10, 2016 at 11:31 AM     
Packaged and shipped the last current operating miner I had operating from home today. Plan to fire up two others over the weekend. Attempting to get my hands on one of Bitmain's latest generation Antminers, but they sell out before Bitmain releases them to the market. Their manufacturing is essentially funded with paid pre-orders. Such is becoming common in many of the latest digital and electronic advancements. I pre-paid months ago for several new products other than miners that have yet to hit the market. Two of my recent hottest sellers on eBay have been such items.
No. 487     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 10, 2016 at 11:51 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:
Their manufacturing is essentially funded with paid pre-orders. Such is becoming common in many of the latest digital and electronic advancements. I pre-paid months ago for several new products other than miners that have yet to hit the market. Two of my recent hottest sellers on eBay have been such items.


LOL. Coincidentally, I just received an invite to attend Summer NAMM in Nashville TN and participate in the introduction of a next generation electric guitar to the Nashville scene. I am what is referred to as an "early funder" of the project. Worst case scenario is I get at least two of the guitars and invites to attend such events for free. Well, I guess there could be a situation were as I never get the guitars.
No. 488     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 11, 2016 at 8:18 AM     
BTC value is pushing $600. I made my last purchases of Bitcoin not all that long ago at around $250.
No. 489     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 25, 2016 at 10:22 AM     
An International company I was purchasing digital products from for business purposes, quietly went away a few weeks ago as well as the lifetime support and free updates for products purchased from them. No explanation or anything provided.

A couple of weeks ago, I was contacted by former software engineers of the company and informed they were now starting their own company, and will offer their versions of the same digital products.

This past week I opted to purchase one from them, being my version from the previous company is outdated on features I require for DVD/Blu-ray editing and production.

Anyway, being they are an International company, they offered me as much as a 40% discount to pay in Euros. The savings in the past with other such International purchases have been well worth the fees and inconvenience of converting some USD to another currency just to make the purchase. But being I was only purchasing one product and it was going to cost me fees to exchange USD for EUR anyway, I passed on the offer and simply paid more with USD.

Now they have extended me the same substantial 40% discount plus 10% more on future purchases if I simply pay them with Bitcoin. That I will do.
No. 490     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 7:32 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

My understanding is that the price of a bitcoin is approaching $600.

Though I have been very cautious of purchasing bitcoins, it appears that a marketing strategy that I am considering implementing uses bitcoins as a fast-return pay server. I think the server is called "coinbase," though I'd have to review it to be sure.

At any rate, looks like I may be getting more involved with it not too far down the road.


I have been involved with Coinbase from their beginnings. They are now the primary "broker" I buy and sell Bitcoin through.

The recent value run up has ignited a new interest in mining BTC, even with old hardware. I sold 3 miners this week. Only have two left in hand.


It appears that you are saying you are making more money in marketing miners than actually mining bitcoins. Do I have that right? You're no longer mining bitcoins?
No. 491     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  crayons   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 7:55 PM     
same principle holds digitally
as did during the gold rush.
No. 492     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:12 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

My understanding is that the price of a bitcoin is approaching $600.

Though I have been very cautious of purchasing bitcoins, it appears that a marketing strategy that I am considering implementing uses bitcoins as a fast-return pay server. I think the server is called "coinbase," though I'd have to review it to be sure.

At any rate, looks like I may be getting more involved with it not too far down the road.


I have been involved with Coinbase from their beginnings. They are now the primary "broker" I buy and sell Bitcoin through.

The recent value run up has ignited a new interest in mining BTC, even with old hardware. I sold 3 miners this week. Only have two left in hand.


It appears that you are saying you are making more money in marketing miners than actually mining bitcoins. Do I have that right? You're no longer mining bitcoins?


Depends on the situation. With BTC now over $600 and climbing, direct mining can now be profitable if you own the latest tech miners available. When BTC was down around $250, as it was just a few short weeks ago, marketing miners was more profitable. At this time, getting your hands on a latest tech miner is difficult. The demand for them has orders back logged.

I directly mine as I have miners sitting here. Currently I have only two on hand. But it is too hot to mine here in the summer, first reasonable offer and these miners will be gone. Once they are gone, other than for development and research, I will likely not regularly mine at home until winter other than for testing. I regularly configure software and hardware that operate miners and an order for such every couple of days. I have an order to get out the door the tomorrow simple for some software for controlling miners.

I also regularly mine year round with miners hosted other than at my home. This depends on the price at the time. Sometimes I lease hardware and the service that operates them, other times I own the hardware, they operate it for me in their various facilities. If it earns more than it cost me, I mine.

I also own part of digital mining exchange. I am credited a percentage of Bitcoin as they earn it from the operation of the exchange, based on the number of seats I own.

Recently, most all BTC mined I convert to physical silver as soon as I have enough mined to make the transaction worthwhile. In effect, my mining activity funds itself, and the silver acquired is essentially cost free.

Therefore, I am most always mining, but it may not be that I am always directly operating the miners. For the most part, marketing miners simply allows me the ability to mine for "free", whether it be by use of the hardware before I resell it or profit from marketing a miner paying for me to host miners elsewhere.
No. 493     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:27 PM     
In less than the past 30 minutes, BTC has went from $630 to over $641.
No. 494     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:28 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

In less than the past 30 minutes, BTC has went from $630 to over $641.


Actually, it has only been 15 minutes.
No. 495     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:48 PM     
BTC now at $642.10 and rising.
No. 496     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:52 PM     
What I somehow missed, was that BTC was pushing $800 on 06/19/2016. Thus has actually dropped considerably overall in the past week.
No. 497     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 8:56 PM     
Now $645.

Lets see it if it makes it back over $700.
No. 498     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 9:03 PM     
$647
No. 499     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 9:06 PM     
$650
No. 500     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 9:08 PM     
$652

She's on the roll.
No. 501     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 10:34 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:


I also own part of digital mining exchange. I am credited a percentage of Bitcoin as they earn it from the operation of the exchange, based on the number of seats I own.



Just started looking into something that sounds like this.
No. 502     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  crayons   Gender: M   Age: 60   on  Jun 26, 2016 at 11:46 PM     
uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?
No. 503     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 3:54 AM     
crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I would feel very leery about investing in too much digital currency.

Just a few short years ago I remember, "Liberty Reserve" based in Costa Rica was being touted as the ultimate alternative digital currency system.

Here is their website now: http://www.libertyreserve.com/index.html

And here is a Wikipedia article about it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve
No. 504     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 9:19 AM     
crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I have them.
No. 505     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 9:21 AM     
Appears the rally backed off once the US markets got underway this AM.
No. 506     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 9:26 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I have them.


And not only do they contain the encryption code that represents the digital currency assigned to them, each respective coin has additional value based on the value of the precious metal it was produced of. Mine are of gold and silver.
No. 507     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 9:47 AM     
crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I accept Bitcoin on my website. I just installed a plugin for it as a payment option to supplement credit/debit card or PayPal payments.

And that reminds me, I have to get busy and list my business among the many website directories to include it as a Business that accepts Bitcoin.

Here are just a few of the many directories out there.

http://spendbitcoins.com/places/

Here is a list of Food Businesses that accept Bitcoin:

http://spendbitcoins.com/places/c/food/serving/All

460 of them in this directory. Firehouse Subs, Emergency Survival Food Supplies, Survival Food.com, Emergency Seed Bank, Art Of Tacos, Sipacoff's Premium Meats, Freshfully Grocery Store, Dodge's Pizza, quite a few Farmer's Markets,


Here is another list of Companies that accept Bitcoin as payment. Notice the many "Big Store Names" in there for many of them:

http://www.bitcoinvalues.net/who-accepts-bitcoins-payment-companies-stores-take-bitcoins.html

List of Companies Who Accepts Bitcoins as Payment!
Many companies are accepting bitcoins, many are not. Here is a list of the biggest names who accepts bitcoins as a currency.
WordPress.com – An online company that allows user to create free blogs
Overstock.com – A company that sells big ticket items at lower prices due to overstocking
Amazon – An online company that sells almost anything.
Target – An American retailing company
CVS – A pharmacy shop
Subway – Eat fresh
Victoria’s Secret – A lingerie outlet
Namecheap - Domain name registrar
Bitcoin.Travel – a travel site that provides accommodation, apartments, attractions, bars, and beauty salons around the world
Pembury Tavern – A pub in London, England
Old Fitzroy – A pub in Sydney, Australia
The Pink Cow – A diner in Tokyo, Japan
Virgin Galactic - Richard Branson company that includes Virgin Mobile and Virgin Airline
The Pirate Bay - BitTorrent directories
Reddit – You can buy premium features there with bitcoins
Zynga – Mobile gaming
PayPal / Ebay - Credit card / payment processor / Auction
Tesla – The car company
OkCupid – Online dating site
4Chan.org – For premium services
EZTV – Torrents TV shows provider
Mega.co.nz – The new venture started by the former owner of MegaUpload Kim Dotcom
Lumfile – Free cloud base file server – pay for premium services
Etsy Vendors – 93 of them
PizzaForCoins.com - Domino’s Pizza signed up – pay for their pizza with bitcons
Tigerdirect – Major electronic online retailer
CheapAir.com – Travel booking site for airline tickets, car rentals, hotels
Expedia.com – Online travel booking agency
Zappos – Online retailer
Whole Foods – Organic food store (by purchasing gift card from Gyft)
Bitcoincoffee.com – Buy your favorite coffee online
Grass Hill Alpacas – A local farm in Haydenville, MA
Jeffersons Store - A street wear clothing store in Bergenfield, N.J
Helen’s Pizza - Jersey City, N.J., you can get a slice of pizza for 0.00339 bitcoin by pointing your phone at a sign next to the cash register
A Class Limousine - Pick you up and drop you off at Newark (N.J.) Airport
Fiverr.com – Get almost anything done for $5
Seoclerks.com – Get SEO work done on your site cheap
Namecheap – Cheap domain registration company
CoinMama: Buy Bitcoins with Credit Card

Sacramento Kings – Professional Basketball team out in Sacramental California (NBA)
Mint.com - Mint pulls all your financial accounts into one place. Set a budget, track your goals and do more
with your money, for free! (Source: mint.com)
TechCrunch.com – IT blog
Fancy.com - Discover amazing stuff, collect the things you love, buy it all in one place (Source: Fancy)
Bing by Microsoft – 2nd search engine to Google
Bloomberg.com – Online newspaper
Humblebundle.com – Indie game site
BigFishGames.com – Games for PC, Mac and Smartphones (iPhone, Android, Windows)
Suntimes.com – Chicago based online newspaper
San Jose Earthquakes – San Jose California Professional Soccer Team (MLS)
Square – Payment processor that help small businesses accept credit cards using iPhone, Android or iPad
Crowdtilt.com - The fastest and easiest way to pool funds with family and friends (Source: crowdtilt)
Lumfile – Server company that offers free cloud-based servers
Museum of the Coastal Bend - 2200 East Red River Street, Victoria, Texas 77901, USA
Home Depot - Office supplies store
Kmart - Retail products store
Sears - Clothing and household products, electronic store
Gap, GameStop and JC Penney – have to use eGifter.com
Etsy Vendors – Original art and Jewelry creations
Fight for the Future – Leading organization finding for Internet freedom
i-Pmart (ipmart.com.my) – A Malaysian online mobile phone and electronic parts retailer
curryupnow.com - A total of 12 restaurants on the list of restaurants accept bitcoins in San Francisco Bay Area
Dish Network - An American direct-broadcast satellite service provider
Apple’s App Store - Buy music and any app on the Apple AppStore with bitcoins
The Libertarian Party – United States political party
Yacht-base.com – Croatian yacht charter company
Euro Pacific – A major precious metal dealer
CEX – The trade-in chain has a shop in Glasgow, Scotland that accepts bitcoin
Straub Auto Repairs - 477 Warburton Ave, Hastings-on-Hudson, NY 10706 - (914) 478-1177
PSP Mollie – Dutch Payment Service
Intuit - an American software company that develops financial and tax preparation software and related services for small businesses, accountants and individuals.
Newegg.com – Online electronics retailer now uses bitpay to accept bitcoin as payment
ShopJoy – An Australian online retailer that sells novelty and unique gifts
Wikipedia - The Free Encyclopedia with 4 570 000+ article
Lv.net - Las Vegas high speed internet services
ExpressVPN.com – High speed, ultra secure VPN network
Grooveshark – Online music streaming service based in the United States
Dell - American privately owned multinational computer technology company
Braintree – Well known payments processor
MIT Coop Store - Massachusetts Institute of Technology student bookstore
SimplePay - Nigeria’s most popular web and mobile-based wallet service
SFU bookstore - Simon Fraser University in Vancouver, Canada
State Republican Party – First State Republican Party to accept bitcoin donations (http://www.lagop.com/bitcoin-donate)
mspinc.com – Respiratory medical equipment supplies store
1-800-FLOWERS.COM – United States based online floral and gift retailer and distributor
Shopify.com – An online store that allows anyone to sell their products
Famsa – Mexico’s biggest retailer
Naughty America - Adult entertainment provider
Mexico’s Universidad de las Américas Puebla – A major university in Mexico
LOT Polish Airlines – A worldwide airline based in Poland
MovieTickets.com – Online movie ticket exchange/retailer
Dream Lover – Online relationship service
Lionsgate Films - The production studio behind titles such as The Hunger Games and The Day After Tomorrow
Rakutan – A Japanese e-commerce giant
Badoo – Online dating network
RE/MAX London - UK-based franchisee of the global real estate network
T-Mobile Poland – T-Mobile’s Poland-based mobile phone top-up company
Stripe - San Francisco-based payments company
WebJet – Online travel agency
Microsoft – Software company
Braintree – Research firm
Green Man Gaming - Popular digital game reseller
Save the Children - Global charity organization
NCR Silver – Point of sales systems
One Shot Hotels – Spanish hotel chain
- See more at: http://www.bitcoinvalues.net/who-accepts-bitcoins-payment-companies-stores-take-bitcoins.html#sthash.R2rUtChh.dpuf
No. 508     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 10:09 AM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I accept Bitcoin on my website. I just installed a plugin for it as a payment option to supplement credit/debit card or PayPal payments.

And that reminds me, I have to get busy and list my business among the many website directories to include it as a Business that accepts Bitcoin.



BTC and couple of the other digital currencies appear to be of wider spread circulation Internationally than here in the USA. But here in the USA more and folks now have an app on their phone allowing them to pay with and/or accept Bitcoin, have their own link allowing them to pay with and/or accept digital currencies(which is what I have), ATM machines are starting to be seen for digital currencies, and many eateries, pubs, stores have had transaction devices/portals in their place of business for a couple years now allowing customers to pay with BTC. Supposedly one of the first historical BTC transactions in the USA was paying for a pizza with Bitcoin.
No. 509     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 11:19 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:


I also own part of digital mining exchange. I am credited a percentage of Bitcoin as they earn it from the operation of the exchange, based on the number of seats I own.



Just started looking into something that sounds like this.


Whoops, turns out they don't allow Americans to participate, even though ran by one. Wonder why?
No. 510     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 12:14 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:


I also own part of digital mining exchange. I am credited a percentage of Bitcoin as they earn it from the operation of the exchange, based on the number of seats I own.



Just started looking into something that sounds like this.


Whoops, turns out they don't allow Americans to participate, even though ran by one. Wonder why?


I own 4 seats of Nasty Pool ~ nastyfans.org

The originating founder's last name is "Nasty".

Even though I have earned BTC from them regularly since day one, at this time I might caution anyone from becoming involved. For a couple of weeks now mining activity has been down with the cause being blamed on technical issues. I am not so sure.

I have had short-term mining contracts with other pools, and they sometimes curtail activity when the earnings from mining might be less than the cost to mine, such as I do with my own direct mining, but I am not sure exactly what is happening at Nasty at this time.

They are a P2P mining pool, and were quickly gaining in popularity. Although the pool is open to anyone for mining purposes, I opted for the option to own "seats" of the pool, thus earned BTC from directly mining the pool and was also paid BTC, referred to as contributions, from operations of the pool whether I was mining or not.

They have always been upfront and transparent, but I question what is really going on behind the scenes at this moment. Mining has been down for a couple weeks now and little being shared in communications other than working on "technical" issues.
No. 511     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 12:22 PM     
Not being able to mine at Nasty at this time, I point my miners at cex.io or ghash.io, both are essentially the same operation. CEX operates as the currency exchange with ghash being the actual mining pool.
No. 512     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 12:25 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Not being able to mine at Nasty at this time, I point my miners at cex.io or ghash.io, both are essentially the same operation. CEX operates as the currency exchange with ghash being the actual mining pool.


I actually belong to several pools. But when I only have a couple miners operating, I lean towards nasty or ghash. When operating several miners, I have been mining at as many as 6 or more pools at once.
No. 513     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 2:05 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:


Even though I have earned BTC from them regularly since day one, at this time I might caution anyone from becoming involved. For a couple of weeks now mining activity has been down with the cause being blamed on technical issues. I am not so sure.



Maybe the best time to buy -

Doug Casey Warns Of Crisis This Year: “We’re Going Back Into The Hurricane… Gold Will Go Higher Than Most People Can Imagine”

http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/doug-casey-warns-of-crisis-this-year-were-going-back-into-the-hurricane-gold-will-go-higher-than-most-people-can-imagine_06262016
No. 514     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 2:08 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:


Even though I have earned BTC from them regularly since day one, at this time I might caution anyone from becoming involved. For a couple of weeks now mining activity has been down with the cause being blamed on technical issues. I am not so sure.



Maybe the best time to buy -


It has crossed my mind that now is maybe an opportunity to acquire more "seats" at a bargain, but I would like to be more comfortable with their long-term status first.
No. 515     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 27, 2016 at 11:43 PM     
BTC up to $656 and on the rise this evening.
No. 516     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 28, 2016 at 9:02 AM     
Investment advisors suggest a strategy of holding Bitcoin as a long term asset similar to as to one may hold gold and/or other precious metals:

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/investment-advisors-suggest-small-holding-in-bitcoin-for-long-term/
No. 517     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 28, 2016 at 9:25 AM     
I would have to check it out to be convinced, but I read this AM that there are mining hosts with low enough electricity costs allowing individuals to currently mine and double their money bimonthly.
No. 518     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 28, 2016 at 9:31 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I would have to check it out to be convinced, but I read this AM that there are mining hosts with low enough electricity costs allowing individuals to currently mine and double their money bimonthly.


Actually, I read that wrong. It appears that those doubling their money bimonthly is not through hosted mining efforts, but via investments with a broker providing low cost electricity to mining hosts. The broker shares the profits with the investors, with some of the packages currently earning 3% per day.
No. 519     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 54   on  Jun 28, 2016 at 12:07 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I accept Bitcoin on my website. I just installed a plugin for it as a payment option to supplement credit/debit card or PayPal payments.

And that reminds me, I have to get busy and list my business among the many website directories to include it as a Business that accepts Bitcoin.



BTC and couple of the other digital currencies appear to be of wider spread circulation Internationally than here in the USA. But here in the USA more and folks now have an app on their phone allowing them to pay with and/or accept Bitcoin, have their own link allowing them to pay with and/or accept digital currencies(which is what I have), ATM machines are starting to be seen for digital currencies, and many eateries, pubs, stores have had transaction devices/portals in their place of business for a couple years now allowing customers to pay with BTC. Supposedly one of the first historical BTC transactions in the USA was paying for a pizza with Bitcoin.


There is a huge Bitcoin machine in one of the Currency Exchanges I do business in. I have no idea what it does though lol.

Dominos Pizza accepts Bitcoin I noticed on the list I posted earlier.
No. 520     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jun 29, 2016 at 9:48 PM     
One bitcoin = $639.38

Started my bitcoin process today with coinbase. Kind of exciting.
No. 521     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 30, 2016 at 10:00 AM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:


I also own part of digital mining exchange. I am credited a percentage of Bitcoin as they earn it from the operation of the exchange, based on the number of seats I own.



Just started looking into something that sounds like this.


Whoops, turns out they don't allow Americans to participate, even though ran by one. Wonder why?


I do not know about this particular situation, but it is US banking and financial laws and regulations preventing Americans from being able to participate in many of the digital currency "activities", particularly those based in other countries. They cannot legally offer all their opportunities to Americans.

Even some of those not based in other countries, due to US regulations cannot be offered to Americans.
No. 522     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jun 30, 2016 at 11:11 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I would have to check it out to be convinced, but I read this AM that there are mining hosts with low enough electricity costs allowing individuals to currently mine and double their money bimonthly.


Actually, since April, most every sold item on eBay doubles my money instantly with no realized financial risk whatsoever. Being most the items are drop shipped, I have no realized financial investment in the items.
No. 523     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 2, 2016 at 1:04 PM     
It seems the process for getting to the point of actually using bitcoins via coinbase is rather drawn out initially. Once you do the initial security forms fill-out, then you wait a few days for CB to do 2 deposits to your bank account. Ok, that's standard.

That done, and apparently for your first real transaction, you have to wait 10 days for your bought bitcoins to show up. That's annoying, as I am rather eager to move forward on my goals and have to wait for this process to work itself out.

I certainly hope that will be it, for my understanding is that normally there is a 3 day wait for transactions - not bad for the eWallet world.
No. 524     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jul 2, 2016 at 4:24 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

It seems the process for getting to the point of actually using bitcoins via coinbase is rather drawn out initially. Once you do the initial security forms fill-out, then you wait a few days for CB to do 2 deposits to your bank account. Ok, that's standard.

That done, and apparently for your first real transaction, you have to wait 10 days for your bought bitcoins to show up. That's annoying, as I am rather eager to move forward on my goals and have to wait for this process to work itself out.

I certainly hope that will be it, for my understanding is that normally there is a 3 day wait for transactions - not bad for the eWallet world.


I am not sure of any of the exchanges that do not make you jump through about 10 days of "hoops" before being able to make immediate transactions. Even afterwards, many limit the number of transactions and/or the dollar amount of transactions within so many days.

I was often maxing out my ability to exchange USD for BTC. Thus I had 3-4 different accounts to get around the limitations. My limits have since been raised, and I can pretty much make all my transactions via only Coinbase.

US legal authorities have been making efforts to shutdown some digital currency exchanges. Coin.mx was a very popular one, and I used them often paired with Coinbase. Coin.mx has been shutdown by authorities deeming them an illegal Bitcoin exchange operating without a money transmission license.
No. 525     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 2, 2016 at 5:38 PM     
Coinbase is also US-only, plus it doesn't give you your bitcoin license keys. No big deal, but when I re-locate to the DR and other far off places, I'll have to find a credible world exchange, I guess.
No. 526     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 11, 2016 at 8:42 PM     
Yea! My bitcoins finally became available, and immediately invested most of them in a rev-share.

Now that I know that everything worked smoothly, I've already put another order in for more bitcoin. This time instead of taking 9 days for the bitcoin to be deposited in Coinbase, they tell me it will only take 4 days.
No. 527     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 56   on  Jul 11, 2016 at 9:43 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Yea! My bitcoins finally became available, and immediately invested most of them in a rev-share.

Now that I know that everything worked smoothly, I've already put another order in for more bitcoin. This time instead of taking 9 days for the bitcoin to be deposited in Coinbase, they tell me it will only take 4 days.


OK now wait, are you seeing Bitcoin as an investment as what you're getting now will increase in value over time?
No. 528     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 11, 2016 at 9:55 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

Yea! My bitcoins finally became available, and immediately invested most of them in a rev-share.

Now that I know that everything worked smoothly, I've already put another order in for more bitcoin. This time instead of taking 9 days for the bitcoin to be deposited in Coinbase, they tell me it will only take 4 days.


OK now wait, are you seeing Bitcoin as an investment as what you're getting now will increase in value over time?


No. As stated, I already have begun to use it as a pay-server, an intermediary to hasten the flow of cash.

That's not to say I might not eventually use Bitcoin that way, but for the nonce my interest in it is for the way it was designed (which was not for investment). Otherwise, I regard it as too chancy for such uses as you mentioned. Precious metals are much more credible for such, IMHO.

I should add, that if I HAD followed that strategy, I've already lost money since the price of Bitcoin dropped in the 9 days I waited for my initial purchase to clear. But since I'm following a different strategy, I'm not all that concerned.

No. 529     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jul 12, 2016 at 1:18 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Stormchaser wrote:

Yea! My bitcoins finally became available, and immediately invested most of them in a rev-share.

Now that I know that everything worked smoothly, I've already put another order in for more bitcoin. This time instead of taking 9 days for the bitcoin to be deposited in Coinbase, they tell me it will only take 4 days.


OK now wait, are you seeing Bitcoin as an investment as what you're getting now will increase in value over time?


That is not necessarily the primary goal, but my BTC holdings acquired just this year alone have tripled in value. BTC is pushing $700. Current holdings that I purchased this year were acquired at average of around $225.

BTC has a track record of increasing quickly, falls back, and then rallies ahead again.
No. 530     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 12, 2016 at 4:15 PM     
There was another crypto-currency (Ethereum) that had a hacker break in, and the resultant bad press caused the price of Bitcoin to go down. That happened while I was waiting my required 9 days for my first Bitcoin order to populate, and so I lost a little bit of 'money'.

It happens.

No. 531     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 56   on  Jul 19, 2016 at 7:21 PM     
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Bitcoin-Shipped-Directly-To-Your-Wallet-Half-BTC-/142018431825?hash=item2110f54b51:g:zbAAAOSwll1Wz00e
No. 532     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jul 19, 2016 at 9:03 PM     
insular926 wrote:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Bitcoin-Shipped-Directly-To-Your-Wallet-Half-BTC-/142018431825?hash=item2110f54b51:g:zbAAAOSwll1Wz00e


I am amazed that people still fall for such ads. You can simply setup such as a Coinbase account for free, and buy .5 BTC for just a little more than half what that guy on eBay is charging.

Those are also the kind of transactions were as the Seller can get easily rip-offed. Being it is a digital transaction only and not a transfer of anything physical, eBay nor PayPal will back the Seller if a Buyer complains. The Buyer gets away with the .5 BTC and gets their money back. Such is why when I make such a BTC transaction, I sell a physical coin representing the digital BTC. About 1-2 out of ten Buyers are dishonest enough to claim you did not sell them anything and want their money back and/or claim it was not them that made the transaction.
No. 533     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 21, 2016 at 3:40 PM     
Coinbase adopts the latest in blockchain: Ethereum
http://finance.yahoo.com/video/coinbase-adopts-latest-blockchain-ethereum-172013647.html
No. 534     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jul 21, 2016 at 5:22 PM     
BTC value keeps making a run at $700, but cannot seem to stay over $675 or so. I may sell some where she is at.
No. 535     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 56   on  Jul 21, 2016 at 6:11 PM     
Where does one go to get the cheapest price on bitcoin?
No. 536     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jul 21, 2016 at 6:42 PM     
insular926 wrote:

Where does one go to get the cheapest price on bitcoin?


Not sure if there is one. Its not like buying precious metals, where you have a 'spot' price and then pay the premium (profit).

Coinbase is the easiest purchase arrangement to get into (see my last link posted).

On the other hand, since coinbase is a payment-server, you do have to pay for each individual service, perhaps 1-3% per transaction (Darrel will be more on top of this, I'm sure), so in a way you do pay a premium, I guess.
No. 537     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 102   on  Jul 21, 2016 at 8:29 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

insular926 wrote:

Where does one go to get the cheapest price on bitcoin?


Not sure if there is one. Its not like buying precious metals, where you have a 'spot' price and then pay the premium (profit).

Coinbase is the easiest purchase arrangement to get into (see my last link posted).

On the other hand, since coinbase is a payment-server, you do have to pay for each individual service, perhaps 1-3% per transaction (Darrel will be more on top of this, I'm sure), so in a way you do pay a premium, I guess.


There are several sources, but Coinbase is likely the best all around direct exchange.

Virwox would be next on my list simply because they accept PayPal. You have to be a little creative with the exchange, USD exchange for a currency and then exchange that currency for BTC.

CEX.io is good and reputable.

Coin.mx was very good and allowed me the largest USD value exchange for BTC of any, I was able to exchange like $10000 USD for BTC in one transaction, but the Feds are "hampering" them at the moment.

They are all going to charge you some kind of transaction fee and/or premium on top of the going value.

Most direct way to obtain some BTC is to mine it. But you then have expenses to mine no matter which method you mine by.

Easiest way is to sell something and accept BTC as payment into your wallet. Which is still going to require some kind of wallet such as Coinbase. You could accept an encrypted physical coin that represents the BTC value transferred to you.
No. 538     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 55   on  Jun 13, 2017 at 9:30 AM     
Dear WND Reader,

"Bitcoin The Trojan Horse"

"Governments around the world have a desire to drive all citizen assets and personal savings into digital form at one of only a few primary financial institutions. With these financial institutions themselves being lumped into only a few clearing houses -- making it easier to tax at will.

Bitcoin's rise in value is the symptom of the global war on cash, which is quickly becoming a war on tangible assets, including Gold and Silver. 2016 regulations including "CUSIP" digitally tracking precious metals values and SEC's "Money Market Reform" were just the first phase.

Although Bitcoin has been applauded by the anti-banker crowds for years, the recent media-driven mania around its profitability is suspicious. Why are the banks allowing this to be covered in such wide array? The answer is found in the technology bitcoin is built on "Blockchain". Some of the world's biggest have been testing and using Blockchain quietly including JP Morgan Chase, The LBMA and recently Dubai to create the first currency backed by gold in accordance with Sharia Law.

As the first phase of digitizing assets nears completion your investments such as CD's, Money Market Funds, Annuities, IRA/401(k)'s, Savings Accounts and even common Gold and Silver Bullion all risk punishing losses. Download our Investor's Power Guide to learn more - - > > >
Request our 100% Free Precious Metals IRA Guide

Call 800-474-9159

and Receive Our "Bank Failure Survival Guide" Free!

Currently Blockchain is a ledger that is outside of the traditional banking system that locks online transactions. However banks realize its ability to to turn physical assets like "Real Estate" and "Bullion" into digital form with "good title" being reserved for members of blockchain registries at approved banks.

This allows tracking to the penny of all wealth including cash, stocks, bonds, etc. allowing member banks to freeze and lock down your holdings should the need arise under the "Adequacy of loss-absorbing capacity of globally systemically important banks in resolution".

And the need WILL arise!

Here is a list of 5 of the Top 25 US banks holding over-leveraged positions in risky derivatives

Citigroup

Total Assets: $1.79 trillion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $47 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 26 to 1 (meaning they are responsible for 26 X their total assets!)

JPMorgan Chase

Total Assets: $2.49 trillion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $46.99 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 19 to 1

Goldman Sachs

Total Assets: $860 billion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $41.23 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 48 to 1

Bank Of America

Total Assets: $2.18 trillions
Total Derivatives Exposure: $33.13 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 15 to 1

Morgan Stanley

Total Assets: $814.94 billion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $28.56 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 35 to 1

You get the picture. Beyond this point, there’s no need to either bore or scare you with the rest of the details. The Banks Need Your Holdings! Protect them while you still can before Blockchain, CUSIP and Money Market Reform become household topics. Download our Free Investor's Power Guide Now > > "
No. 539     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jun 13, 2017 at 10:18 AM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Dear WND Reader,

"Bitcoin The Trojan Horse"

"Governments around the world have a desire to drive all citizen assets and personal savings into digital form at one of only a few primary financial institutions. With these financial institutions themselves being lumped into only a few clearing houses -- making it easier to tax at will.

Bitcoin's rise in value is the symptom of the global war on cash, which is quickly becoming a war on tangible assets, including Gold and Silver. 2016 regulations including "CUSIP" digitally tracking precious metals values and SEC's "Money Market Reform" were just the first phase.

Although Bitcoin has been applauded by the anti-banker crowds for years, the recent media-driven mania around its profitability is suspicious. Why are the banks allowing this to be covered in such wide array? The answer is found in the technology bitcoin is built on "Blockchain". Some of the world's biggest have been testing and using Blockchain quietly including JP Morgan Chase, The LBMA and recently Dubai to create the first currency backed by gold in accordance with Sharia Law.

As the first phase of digitizing assets nears completion your investments such as CD's, Money Market Funds, Annuities, IRA/401(k)'s, Savings Accounts and even common Gold and Silver Bullion all risk punishing losses. Download our Investor's Power Guide to learn more - - > > >
Request our 100% Free Precious Metals IRA Guide

Call 800-474-9159

and Receive Our "Bank Failure Survival Guide" Free!

Currently Blockchain is a ledger that is outside of the traditional banking system that locks online transactions. However banks realize its ability to to turn physical assets like "Real Estate" and "Bullion" into digital form with "good title" being reserved for members of blockchain registries at approved banks.

This allows tracking to the penny of all wealth including cash, stocks, bonds, etc. allowing member banks to freeze and lock down your holdings should the need arise under the "Adequacy of loss-absorbing capacity of globally systemically important banks in resolution".

And the need WILL arise!

Here is a list of 5 of the Top 25 US banks holding over-leveraged positions in risky derivatives

Citigroup

Total Assets: $1.79 trillion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $47 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 26 to 1 (meaning they are responsible for 26 X their total assets!)

JPMorgan Chase

Total Assets: $2.49 trillion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $46.99 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 19 to 1

Goldman Sachs

Total Assets: $860 billion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $41.23 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 48 to 1

Bank Of America

Total Assets: $2.18 trillions
Total Derivatives Exposure: $33.13 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 15 to 1

Morgan Stanley

Total Assets: $814.94 billion
Total Derivatives Exposure: $28.56 trillion
Leverage Ratio: 35 to 1

You get the picture. Beyond this point, there’s no need to either bore or scare you with the rest of the details. The Banks Need Your Holdings! Protect them while you still can before Blockchain, CUSIP and Money Market Reform become household topics. Download our Free Investor's Power Guide Now > > "


The author titles the article with Bitcoin as the Trojan horse, but then describes a threat altogether different from Bitcoin. Although what he describes is true as to what the banking industry is doing to fight back, he then details a strong argument as to why one should seek out such as Bitcoin as an alternative option. Lots of industries other than banking are currently adopting Blockchain technology to protect the privacy of transactions. It has yet to be ever be hacked. Walmart, Amazon, etc. are all making moves to implement the technology.

Personally, I too do not buy into Bitcoin or any digital currency as being the ideal only alternative. But that does not steer me away from trading Bitcoin and quickly converting those gains to some other asset, but at the same time hanging on to some BTC as one alternative.

Digital currencies are here to stay regardless of what we personally desire. Kind of like taxes and death.
No. 540     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 55   on  Jun 13, 2017 at 2:05 PM     


Survivor wrote: "...Digital currencies are here to stay regardless of what we personally desire. Kind of like taxes and death.


Until they are busted by the Feds or the whole scheme comes crashing down for whatever reason....

You mean like Liberty Reserve? predecessor to Bitcoin and at one time the world's most popular digital currency.

Look at where they are today: http://www.libertyreserve.com/index.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve

"Liberty Reserve: was a Costa Rica-based centralized digital currency service that billed itself as the "oldest, safest and most popular payment processor, serving millions all around a world".[1] The site had over one million users when it was shut down by the United States government. Prosecutors argued that due to lax security, alleged criminal activity largely went undetected, which ultimately led to them seizing the service.[2]

In May 2013, Liberty Reserve was shut down by United States federal prosecutors under the Patriot Act after an investigation by authorities across 17 countries. The United States charged founder Arthur Budovsky and six others with money laundering and operating an unlicensed financial transaction company. Liberty Reserve is alleged to have been used to launder more than $6 billion in criminal proceeds during its history.[3]...more"
No. 541     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Stormchaser   Gender: M   Age: 63   on  Jun 13, 2017 at 3:50 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:



Survivor wrote: "...Digital currencies are here to stay regardless of what we personally desire. Kind of like taxes and death.


Until they are busted by the Feds or the whole scheme comes crashing down for whatever reason....

You mean like Liberty Reserve? predecessor to Bitcoin and at one time the world's most popular digital currency.

Look at where they are today: http://www.libertyreserve.com/index.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve

"Liberty Reserve: was a Costa Rica-based centralized digital currency service that billed itself as the "oldest, safest and most popular payment processor, serving millions all around a world".[1] The site had over one million users when it was shut down by the United States government. Prosecutors argued that due to lax security, alleged criminal activity largely went undetected, which ultimately led to them seizing the service.[2]

In May 2013, Liberty Reserve was shut down by United States federal prosecutors under the Patriot Act after an investigation by authorities across 17 countries. The United States charged founder Arthur Budovsky and six others with money laundering and operating an unlicensed financial transaction company. Liberty Reserve is alleged to have been used to launder more than $6 billion in criminal proceeds during its history.[3]...more"


Just going out the door to visit daughter & granddaughter, so can only give a short response.

There is an obvious rebuttal to this post. The Liberty dollar, though it should NOT have been made illegal, was a SOLID DOLLAR COIN. It was NOT digital, so therefore not relevant to this conversation, other than in a general way that could be applied to many other things, not just Bitcoin.
No. 542     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jun 13, 2017 at 6:27 PM     
Stormchaser wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:



Survivor wrote: "...Digital currencies are here to stay regardless of what we personally desire. Kind of like taxes and death.


Until they are busted by the Feds or the whole scheme comes crashing down for whatever reason....

You mean like Liberty Reserve? predecessor to Bitcoin and at one time the world's most popular digital currency.

Look at where they are today: http://www.libertyreserve.com/index.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve

"Liberty Reserve: was a Costa Rica-based centralized digital currency service that billed itself as the "oldest, safest and most popular payment processor, serving millions all around a world".[1] The site had over one million users when it was shut down by the United States government. Prosecutors argued that due to lax security, alleged criminal activity largely went undetected, which ultimately led to them seizing the service.[2]

In May 2013, Liberty Reserve was shut down by United States federal prosecutors under the Patriot Act after an investigation by authorities across 17 countries. The United States charged founder Arthur Budovsky and six others with money laundering and operating an unlicensed financial transaction company. Liberty Reserve is alleged to have been used to launder more than $6 billion in criminal proceeds during its history.[3]...more"


Just going out the door to visit daughter & granddaughter, so can only give a short response.

There is an obvious rebuttal to this post. The Liberty dollar, though it should NOT have been made illegal, was a SOLID DOLLAR COIN. It was NOT digital, so therefore not relevant to this conversation, other than in a general way that could be applied to many other things, not just Bitcoin.



I was about to post of the same inaccuracy and irrelevancy, but was on the road and opted to wait until getting home and in front of PC versus phone.
No. 543     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jun 19, 2017 at 9:37 AM     
Nobody, no individual, no central power or government can control, manipulate, ban, hack or kill a worldwide distributed open-source peer-to-peer cryptographically secured decentralized system.

Bitcoins will continue to increase in value. There will only be 21 million bitcoins ever. They are cryptographically and mathematically secured. Are decentralized. Therefore cannot be banned, co-opted or confiscated/stolen by any central group or government, you hold your own private keys.

The future economy is digital and decentralized. Even China cannot kill Bitcoin.

Although governments, groups, and individuals can opt to not accept digital currencies, you cannot be prevented from having your own private bank account based on a decentralized system.
No. 544     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jul 1, 2017 at 1:03 PM     
Copy and Paste from article in The Guardian today:

"On 19 June, the International Monetary Fund issued a staff discussion note stating that banks should consider investing in cryptocurrencies, saying: “Rapid advances in digital technology are transforming the financial services landscape, creating opportunities and challenges for consumers, service providers and regulators alike.”

At the same time, IBM announced it had made a deal with the Digital Trade Chain Consortium – a group of seven European banks that includes Deutsche Bank, HSBC, KBC, Natixis, Rabobank, Societe Generale and Unicredit – to build a digital trade platform that will run on IBM’s cloud."

Complete article:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jul/01/cryptocurrencies-mainstream-finance-bitcoin-ethereum
No. 545     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jul 2, 2017 at 7:25 PM     
I am reading that in the collapsed economies such as in Venezuela, Bitcoin has become their lifesaver as far as being able to pay for and obtain necessities. Those with Bitcoin have become the "haves" while those that do not have digital currencies are the "have nots".
No. 546     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jul 2, 2017 at 8:53 PM     
At least for a limited time, I can provide a link to an opportunity that is totally free, and provides you a small reward every day of 11 different digital currencies for essentially doing nothing but registering for free.
No. 547     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jul 2, 2017 at 9:09 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

At least for a limited time, I can provide a link to an opportunity that is totally free, and provides you a small reward every day of 11 different digital currencies for essentially doing nothing but registering for free.


I am just going to go ahead and share the link. If not interested do not click on it.

https://qoinpro.com/2062e5e443ed54fb7fa7d6f76c9f9ef2

Free Bitcoins Every 24 Hours!
No. 548     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 9, 2017 at 6:22 PM     
I heard Bitcoin was way up in price.
No. 549     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 9, 2017 at 6:28 PM     
insular926 wrote:

I heard Bitcoin was way up in price.


She hit as high as around $18500 this week. Has backed off due to profiting taking today. Hanging around $15000 at the moment. Many got in at under $800 earlier this year. Have received essentially free money.
No. 550     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 10, 2017 at 9:10 AM     
Bitcoin has been on a real roller coaster ride this year. Nevertheless, currently up $14700 from what she started the year at.

She took a tumble yesterday only to gain it all back and then some being back close to $16000 at midday, only to be back at $13500 by end of day. But at early AM today she was back up over $15700. In fact, in the past hour she has been down $1000 to recover it back and more.

The current volatility plays right into the hands of the active digital currency traders. But I have somewhat moved out of that realm. Been more of a "holder" recently. Have not even been converting BTC to silver holdings as soon as earned, as I once was.

Bitcoin provides me a daily income, but I have been allowing it to accumulate as BTC since like June. Gonna do something with it here soon though. Either going to reinvest into providing more daily BTC income, let her ride as BTC in an account, or simply cash most of it out.

I am leaning towards the more daily income option. I can easily move enough BTC to more than double my current daily income return. And have no real concerns as to what the actual value of BTC is doing. I will daily earn 1% or more BTC on the balance regardless. At least a 140% return over 140 days.

The name of the game for many is to keep accumulating BTC regardless of its current value. Projections are it is going to $100000 per BTC.
No. 551     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 11, 2017 at 10:23 AM     
I sold some BTC today at almost $17000. She rallied up $1800 in less than an hour. I opted to cash in a little and walk with some Christmas money.
No. 552     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 12:49 PM     
I think this is foolish. They could lose everything.

Americans Are Taking Out Mortgages to Buy Bitcoin

https://news.bitcoin.com/americans-taking-mortgages-buy-bitcoin/
No. 553     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 12:59 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

I think this is foolish. They could lose everything.

Americans Are Taking Out Mortgages to Buy Bitcoin

https://news.bitcoin.com/americans-taking-mortgages-buy-bitcoin/


Possibly, some discretion needs to be used depending on personal situation. They may lose their home if they did nothing. Risking everything you own is not the end of the world. Been there more than once.

It is people like these willing to take such risks that make a difference in the world and change their family legacy.
No. 554     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 1:02 PM     
To me Bitcoin appears to be nothing more than one big pyramid scheme that will eventually come crashing down.
No. 555     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 1:05 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

To me Bitcoin appears to be nothing more than one big pyramid scheme that will eventually come crashing down.


Does not even come close to the definition of a pyramid scheme.
No. 556     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 2:23 PM     
BTC back to $18000 today.
No. 557     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 2:35 PM     
I have personal acquaintances that Bitcoin has made them very wealthy in a short period. One such acquaintance in the past couple of weeks has accumulated over $1 Million in BTC starting with like $180000 just this past June. Will he cash out? Who knows. He is the type of guy I have seen lose most all, like $50000-$100000 in one day and simply pick up and make it back shortly starting again with little to nothing.
No. 558     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 6:40 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

To me Bitcoin appears to be nothing more than one big pyramid scheme that will eventually come crashing down.


Does not even come close to the definition of a pyramid scheme.


What Material asset is Bitcoin backed by?
No. 559     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 12, 2017 at 6:57 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

To me Bitcoin appears to be nothing more than one big pyramid scheme that will eventually come crashing down.


Does not even come close to the definition of a pyramid scheme.


What Material asset is Bitcoin backed by?


Whether there is a material asset or not has nothing to do with whether an activity or entity is a pyramid scheme or not. Lots of activities providing a physical asset have been ruled a pyramid scheme. Lots of activities or entities never providing a physical asset are legal business models and not pyramid schemes.
No. 560     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 13, 2017 at 10:44 AM     
Sold some ETH. It is up 3X what I purchased at earlier in the year.
No. 561     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 14, 2017 at 8:09 PM     
This is the same exact kind of thing that got Liberty Reserve in hot water and eventually shut down. It had become a haven for criminals to launder $$$.

Long Island woman laundered money to ISIS through Bitcoin, prosecutors say

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/14/long-island-woman-laundered-money-to-isis-through-bitcoin-prosecutors-say.html
No. 562     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 14, 2017 at 9:00 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

This is the same exact kind of thing that got Liberty Reserve in hot water and eventually shut down. It had become a haven for criminals to launder $$$.

Long Island woman laundered money to ISIS through Bitcoin, prosecutors say

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/14/long-island-woman-laundered-money-to-isis-through-bitcoin-prosecutors-say.html


Not the exact same thing. There is a huge difference. Back in 2013 the US Treasury classified Bitcoin as a convertible decentralized virtual currency. Under the US virtual currency law the only limitation of Bitcoin is that it is limited to those places that accept it as currency. It can also be exchanged for conventional currencies, such as the US dollar, Euro, Yen, and Yuan. Some government agencies/entities are even accepting Bitcoin as payment for taxes, etc..

Liberty Reserve had no such classification.
No. 563     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 15, 2017 at 6:33 PM     
Fidelity Investors has partnered with Coinbase, a Bitcoin exchange and wallet provider service, to allow convenience in trading crypto currencies alongside traditional investments.

I have accounts with both brokerages.
No. 564     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 10:07 AM     
Bitcoin just shy of $19000 this AM. Expected trudge on up to $20000.
No. 565     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 1:57 PM     
How can Bitcoin go up so much?
No. 566     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 2:21 PM     
insular926 wrote:

How can Bitcoin go up so much?


Simple worldwide supply and demand. There are countries currently in economic collapse were as the only convenient means to buy emergency needs are to use Bitcoin and other digital currencies.
No. 567     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 2:22 PM     
BTC has blown on through $19000 and is quickly approaching $19500.
No. 568     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 2:38 PM     
Just minutes ago I just walked an acquaintance through setting up a Bitcoin wallet and exchanging some USD for BTC. If he had done this when I first shared this with him back at the start of the year. He could now be cashing out an investment that would have only required about $750 at that time for one BTC, for $19479 per BTC as of just a couple minutes ago.

I have acquaintances, family and friends that I gifted Bitcoin to back early on that I essentially mined for free. The value then was under $50/BTC. They are now trying to figure out their wallet ID and passwords to access that BTC.

Thus far, I have managed to get access to my daughter's account and have moved the couple Bitcoins I gifted her to another account that can be more easily managed.

Not to pat myself on the back, but it can make one feel kind of good to know they freely gave such to individuals that they now cash out for multiple times the original value. In some cases potentially $20000+.

I have friends that I helped setup miners that eventually abandoned the activity, had me sell all the hardware for them, but they still have the BTC accumulated.
No. 569     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 2:43 PM     
For the past two days, people I encountered wherever weeks and months ago and we somehow got into a discussion about Bitcoin, have been attempting to contact me and inquiring about how to get involved with Bitcoin as well as other cryptos.
No. 570     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 9:31 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

BTC has blown on through $19000 and is quickly approaching $19500.


In the past hour she broke $19500 and is almost at $19600. Which means those I assisted with getting in earlier today are already in the money if they actually pulled the trigger.

I went into my cloud mining account this evening and set it to pay me out all accumulated BTC and ETH. I had not made any withdrawals of anything from that account all year and she has been steadily mining BTC from day one. But for some reason every day along with the BTC credit they also credit me some ETH and Dash. Some mining operations do generate more than one currency with the same expended effort. Some keep it while others provide it as a bonus. Apparently my cloud mining provider gives it as a bonus that I overlooked when I initiated the account. I have some Dash accumulated there also, but actually do not even have my wallet setup for Dash. My Kraven account handles Dash. I just have not went into the account and generated a wallet address. Been too busy most all day providing assistance to others jumping in and/or jumping out.
No. 571     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 9:40 PM     
BTW - I have been somewhat chastised on MC for mentioning this before as if I was not being truthful, but I have shared I was on the Harvard campus the summer The Facebook, as it was called then, was born. Coincidentally, the two brothers that claim they actually started Facebook and not Zuckerberg, founded and are still part of the cloud mining operation I bought into. Cameron and Tyler Winklevoss.
No. 572     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 16, 2017 at 9:56 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

BTW - I have been somewhat chastised on MC for mentioning this before as if I was not being truthful, but I have shared I was on the Harvard campus the summer The Facebook, as it was called then, was born. Coincidentally, the two brothers that claim they actually started Facebook and not Zuckerberg, founded and are still part of the cloud mining operation I bought into. Cameron and Tyler Winklevoss.


Probably needless to share, but unlike other such entities, they have opted to not have a Facebook presence. They have a page over on Twitter.
No. 573     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 12:02 PM     
Recent Forbes article:

Why I Would Bet Against Bitcoin

https://www.forbes.com/sites/modeledbehavior/2017/12/16/why-i-would-bet-against-bitcoin/#682237eb7fe8
No. 574     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 12:04 PM     
Bitcoin CRASH imminent? Investor warns bitcoin bubble is ‘bloodiest DANGER of the century’

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/893104/bitcoin-price-crash-bubble-eric-schiffer-cryptocurrency-investment-risk

BITCOIN is growing to become the biggest financial danger of the 21st century, a veteran investor has gravely warned.

By SEBASTIAN KETTLEY
PUBLISHED: 16:30, Sat, Dec 16, 2017 | UPDATED: 16:30, Sat, Dec 16, 2017

Bitcoin prices are riding an all-time high but the hyper-inflated exchanges are the tell-tale signs of a major crash about to happen, said the CEO of Patriarch Equity investment group.

Eric Schiffer, who has taken upon himself to warn potential investors against jumping the bitcoin bandwagon, is certain the tokenfs days are numbered.

He told Express.co.uk: gI donft want people to walk through what is going to be the bloodiest financial danger of the 21st century."

Bitcoin prices have witnessed a meteoric rise over the past months, skyrocketing from less than £750 ($1,000) per token in January to £13,211 ($17,599.16) as of 6.03pm GMT on Wednesday December 15, according to CoinDesk.

The cryptocurrencyfs prices saw another boost at the start of the week when the token entered the Chicago Board Options Exchange (CBOE) regulated futurefs market. And this has only served to fuel the imminent investor gslaughterh, Mr Schiffer argued.

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The financial expert has now called on potential buyers to avoid bitcoin like wildfire for the risk of endangering their families and savings.

He said: gI think bitcoin is a etower of deathf. It is going to result in the imminent death of your investment – a thermonuclear death.

gRight now we are looking at a financial bubble that is bigger than the tulip craze and I believe that we are headed for a bitcoin crash that will supersede any financial worries of the 21st century.

gPeople are going to be shocked when they try to liquify their bitcoins.h

The crypto token is an extremely vulnerable instrument because it has no intrinsic value, he added. It is a gVegas-style gambleh and gmoney monsterh which people have failed to recognise.

Bitcoin prices: crypto tokenGETTY

Bitcoin prices: Eric Schiffer has warned of a massive bubble crash about to happen
But the investor did not think that bitcoinfs underlying crypto technology itself is something to be wary off. In fact he insisted we are headed for a crypto revolution.

I donft want people to walk through what is going to be the bloodiest financial danger of the 21st century

Eric Schiffer, CEO Patriarch Equity

With increased regulation and some sort of tangible value to fall back on, digital currencies are a viable future. However bitcoin will not be part of this future because it lacks these crucial factors.

He said: gBitcoin is going to go through an extinction level event. What will happen is that a new competitor will emerge to one day take over.

gWhen this thing crashes, it will be the pilots jumping the Hindenburg – and when it does, it will be a financial nuke going off.h

Yet far from the doom and gloom of the bubble bursting, some analysts and investors see the potential in bitcoin to become a gsuccess storyh.

Economic experts share Bitcoin opinions
Mon, December 11, 2017

Is Bitcoin's bubble is about to burst?

JPMorgan Chase head Jamie Dimon is one of Bitcoin's harshest critics

Ultimo co-founder Michelle Mone launched a Dubai development with prices in Bitcoin

Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates is known to be a Bitcoin enthusiast

Warren Buffett termed Bicoin as a mirage in 2014
US investment guru Warren Buffett is one of Bitcoin's biggest critics

Google's head Eric Schmidt said in 2014 that Bitcoin is a remarkable cryptographic achievement

Eric Schmidt sees enormous value in the currency
Jordan Hiscott, chief trader at Ayondo Markets, agreed the appetite for bitcoin is not waning but did not see a financial crash looming on he horizon.

He told Express.co.uk that in order for bitcoin to break the mould, it needs to find its place in the mainstream of finances.

He said: gThe demand for the asset remains highly elevated and the fact that you can now trade it on an exchange means itfs open to a wider audience.

gIfm pretty sure Bitcoin will be $20,000 by the end of the year, but for it to be truly successful, it will need to decide whether itfs a genuine means of exchange or just a digital store of value.h

But Mr Schiffer insisted this is still nothing more than a speculative price tag perpetuated by the crypto community itself.

BItcoin price: Investment risksGETTY

Bitcoin prices skyrocketed this year to all-time record highs

The investor urged people not to further fuel the bitcoin bubble and tempt fate by buying into it.

He said: gIf youfre interested in investing your hard-earned money into bitcoin, you just need to ask yourself if youfre willing to see your savings vaporise?

gFor good investment options find trusted companies that would do that for you or look for a commodity with actual underlying value.

gBut if youfre going to just burn away your money then at least do it with your own lighter and a glass of wine in hand.h
No. 575     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 12:14 PM     
Bitcoin bubble: Cryptocurrency hits new $20,000 record high as experts warn of CRASH

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/893471/Bitcoin-20000-bubble-crash-value-price-latest-cryptocurrency-finance
No. 576     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 12:18 PM     
Is the Bitcoin Bubble About to Burst? (Some Say a Crash Is Just Around the Corner)
Bitcoin is now officially the biggest financial bubble in world history, surpassing the infamous episode of tulip mania in Holland in the early 1600s.

https://www.inc.com/peter-economy/is-bitcoin-bubble-about-to-burst-some-say-a-bitcoin-crash-is-just-around-corner.html
No. 577     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 12:23 PM     
PAUL KRUGMAN: Bitcoin is a more obvious bubble than housing was

http://www.businessinsider.com/paul-krugman-says-bitcoin-is-a-bubble-2017-12
No. 578     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 6:07 PM     
Many have been saying since at least 2012 that Bitcoin is done. The real exerts in the know disagree.

Even if it is eventually done, who cares? You pick up and move on to the next attractive investment. The trick is getting in, earning your investment back quickly, pull that out and then some, and then ride the wave as long as possible.

Many, the biggest players in the industry, also said such as a PC would never be needed or even desired in a home.
No. 579     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 6:10 PM     
Not worth debating. One either knows what they know or they do not.
No. 580     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 17, 2017 at 7:29 PM     
There are numerous financial experts who are saying bitcoin is merely in a bubble which will eventually burst and come crashing down.

There are all kinds of articles out there stating such.

And this is not coming from people who are armchair experts either, but lifelong people who work in the financial industry.

And when it comes crashing down, there are a lot of people out there who have not pulled out of it in time who are going to be in for a very rude awakening.
No. 581     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 18, 2017 at 8:19 AM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

There are all kinds of articles out there stating such.

And this is not coming from people who are armchair experts either, but lifelong people who work in the financial industry



There are also all kinds of articles out there saying Bitcoin is going to $100000, also coming from lifelong people who work in the financial industry.

It may crash, it may not. From those in the know and experienced with digital currencies there is no valid logical reason for Bitcoin to experience an immediate crash. And if there was, in my opinion too many of the world's largest governments have too much at stake in Bitcoin to allow Bitcoin to crash, unless of course their intentions for accumulating BTC themselves are to induce a crash.

One should use investment risk discernment same as with any other investment and do your due diligence. You continue to "play" an investment vehicle until logic and/or personal risk tolerance indicate to do otherwise. Actually, Bitcoin and other digital currencies are much more transparent and predictable than many other more traditional investments.

I am one with direct digital currency experience since at least 2012. And from that time forward one currency and/or another has provided me a daily income far exceeding what I have ever invested. In fact, digital currencies have returned me a far greater ROI than any other investment in my life. Despite that and my credibility amongst peers in the industry, I lay no claims to being a so called expert. I simply have enough experience with traditional investments and now digital currencies to grasp the financial indicators and apply them to what backs and drives digital currencies. Bitcoin has remained at the forefront with nothing credible or logical, per those that really know digital currencies and technology, indicating an immediate looming crash.
No. 582     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 18, 2017 at 9:35 AM     
Over the past week I have been in communication several times with a gentleman whom is recognized and respected as one of this area's most astute and successful investors. As far as in businesses, precious metals, real estate, stocks and bonds.

Although living in this area I knew the family name for years having seen it on signs and aware of businesses related to the name, I had never personally met him until just before Christmas last year. He personally contacted me as a result of a network marketing business I am involved in. Turns out in addition to all the more visible businesses and investments he is locally known for, he is recognized as the local leader in this particular network marketing business. Which by the way is part of the health and fitness industry. Anyway, he contacted me to present me an award as being the leading revenue producer for the business locally in the last quarter of 2016. Of which I did not get involved until end of October 2016.

I did not hear from again until like January this year, when he invited me to attend a meeting indicating that corporate had directed him to interview me and pick my brain on how being a newbie in the business, I immediately became their local group's revenue leader week after week and continued to do so being a one man show. I had brought no one but my daughter into my network below me as a distributor. We both have many customers. I only share this to provide the history of how I became acquainted with such a local investor.

Seems as of that meeting, I have been inducted into kind of his inner circle of a group of business owners and investors. Since then I have been invited to and sat in more than one of his presentations, asked my opinion, but most always declining to become involved in anything he may have been representing other than related to the business we were already both involved in. As far as other opportunities, I politely mentioned I am already experiencing far greater returns with much less to no risk or at least risk were as can I either accept or control the definable risk. At one of the last group presentations back in like March he queried as to how am I doing that. I simply replied digital currencies. He simply replied he knows little about them but would someday like to. There was no mention of digital currencies again.

Until recently. Last week he contacted me expressing he and others have decided they can no longer sit on the sidelines ignoring digital currencies and not considering them a worthwhile investment vehicle. He stated he recalled me mentioning digital currencies and asked if I would share of my experiences and returns realized. This was last Friday. I responded I would pull some information together. Saturday evening I forwarded him a short written history of how I got started. Methods I have been involved with over the years. What worked then and why it does not work now. To what I am currently doing and realizing the best results being exposed to essentially no risk that is not controllable.

I heard back from him 3 times before I got to church Sunday morning. He now wants me to prepare a presentation for an interested group. I have actually been sharing of digital currencies as requested for a long time now via one on one presentations and websites I have operating. Just not regularly with this large of a group face to face, representing those either in business already and/or being experienced investors that derive their living from such activities. It had been a while since the last somewhat large group presentation, thus caught me off guard with a presentation not exactly current with what I do now with digital currencies. It is a dynamic industry that is constantly changing and evolving.

Having shared that, this is actually now the third group that has contacted me to provide some such presentation. When I express that there are likely those much more expert in the arena than I that could provide them a better presentation, the response is like but we personally know you and/or there are those within the group that personally know you and have seen your personal success with digital currencies, indicating you have a keen insight of when to switch gears between mining, trading, investing, etc. and/or doing one or all.

What they do not seem to realize, the nature of the beast clearly dictates the mode of investment at the time.
No. 583     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 18, 2017 at 4:14 PM     
I wish I would have gotten in a long time ago.
No. 584     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 18, 2017 at 5:03 PM     
insular926 wrote:

I wish I would have gotten in a long time ago.


I personally know people that just recently got in and earned their “seed money” back in 9-11 days. Pulled the initial investment out and now working with essentially free money. I have one direct acquaintance that is just shy of Bitcoin having made him a millionaire just this year. But he continued to let all returns ride sitting in BTC until recently. He too has all his “seed money” out. Thus nothing to really lose at this point if it does crash.

I would venture to say few to no prudent Bitcoin enthusiast any longer has anything at risk other than paper gains. I have been avidly involved since 2012. Involved in at least 12 digital currency forums/groups. In other words I know many digital currency enthusiasts. If Bitcoin went bust today I doubt any of them have anything to lose other than a “paper loss”.

Even the very conservative digital currency investment programs are fully earning the investment back in about 90-100 days. Icing on the cake after that.
No. 585     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 18, 2017 at 7:23 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

There are numerous financial experts who are saying bitcoin is merely in a bubble which will eventually burst and come crashing down.

There are all kinds of articles out there stating such.

And this is not coming from people who are armchair experts either, but lifelong people who work in the financial industry.

And when it comes crashing down, there are a lot of people out there who have not pulled out of it in time who are going to be in for a very rude awakening.


Many publications, writers, etc. like to lead with negative headlines versus positive headlines. It attracts views, clicks, readers, new subscribers, an opportunity to push you to something else. Were as positive headlines do not attract as many "gawkers".

It is a known fact that such headlines easily mislead the unaware/uneducated/those not in the know from the truth. Even when the actual story within the body of the article below the headline does not necessarily or fully reflect what the headline implies, if a little further reading was done.
No. 586     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 9:21 AM     
I sold the Bitcoin this AM that I pulled out of mining accumulations. Needed a little more Christmas money.

I still have a couple miners sitting around. May put them back online. They are not very efficient miners compared to the latest generation, but with BTC as high as she is the earnings should well more than cover the cost of operation.

In reality, the primary key is not about the current USD value of Bitcoin, but rather more about the accumulation of Bitcoin. Even though the USD value is what most of us appear to focus on, those that grasp the concept of digital currencies understand the real value is in much more than USD value.
No. 587     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:09 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

To me Bitcoin appears to be nothing more than one big pyramid scheme that will eventually come crashing down.


Does not even come close to the definition of a pyramid scheme.


My bad, I should have clarified.

Bitcoin is nothing more than one big, "Pyramid Ponzi Scheme".

And that is the truth.

After conducting research on it it is obvious that is exactly what it is.

Numerous well known financial experts are stating so.

Bitcoin isn’t the future of money — it’s either a Ponzi scheme or a pyramid scheme

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/06/08/bitcoin-isnt-the-future-of-money-its-either-a-ponzi-scheme-or-a-pyramid-scheme/?utm_term=.318dd4a03c11

No. 588     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:10 AM     
"Fool's Gold"...

Bitcoin Is a Ponzi Scheme: The Internet Currency Will Collapse

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/view_from_chicago/2013/04/bitcoin_is_a_ponzi_scheme_the_internet_currency_will_collapse.html
No. 589     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:11 AM     

The Rise of Cryptocurrency Ponzi Schemes
Scammers are making big money off people who want in on the latest digital gold rush but don’t understand how the technology works.

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/05/cryptocurrency-ponzi-schemes/528624/
No. 590     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:14 AM     
Brazilian Central Bank President Says Bitcoin is Pyramid Scheme

https://cointelegraph.com/news/brazilian-central-bank-president-says-bitcoin-is-pyramid-scheme
No. 591     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:17 AM     
JPMorgan's top quant strategist, echoing CEO, compares bitcoin to 'pyramid scheme'

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/15/jpmorgans-top-quant-strategist-echoing-ceo-compares-bitcoin-to-pyramid-scheme.html
No. 592     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:25 AM     
JPMorgan CEO Jamie Dimon says bitcoin is a 'fraud' that will eventually blow up

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/12/jpmorgan-ceo-jamie-dimon-raises-flag-on-trading-revenue-sees-20-percent-fall-for-the-third-quarter.html
No. 593     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:29 AM     
This Billionaire Just Called Bitcoin a 'Pyramid Scheme'
Marks is co-chairman of the investment firm Oaktree Capital. According to CNBC, his past investment memos predicted the financial crisis and the dotcom bubble implosion. Now, he’s warning his clients to steer clear of the digital currency.


http://fortune.com/2017/07/27/howard-marks-bitcoin-pyramid-scheme/
No. 594     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:36 AM     
Is Bitcoin a Ponzi Scheme?

https://www.enterpriseirregulars.com/120811/bitcoin-ponzi-scheme/



"I have been against crypto-currencies since I first heard of them simply because they are Ponzi schemes pure and simple. They are the financial equivalent of the perpetual motion machines of the middle ages, not that there were any. Inventors were just trying to invent them before real science entered the picture.

At any rate a Ponzi scheme uses current inflows to pay “profits” to the earliest “investors” and the earlier you get in the more you make while the last one into the scheme finds he has no chair when the music stops."
No. 595     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:40 AM     
A Cautionary Bitcoin Tale: Feds Take Aim at Cryptocurrency 'Ponzi Scheme'

https://www.thestreet.com/story/14369170/1/a-cautionary-bitcoin-tale-feds-take-aim-at-cryptocurrency-ponzi-scheme-.html
No. 596     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 11:44 AM     
UCLA faculty voice: Bitcoin is an energy-wasting ponzi scheme
vo Welch is a distinguished professor of finance in the UCLA Anderson School of Management. Welch holds the J. Fred Weston Chair in Finance. This column appeared in Zócalo Public Square.

http://newsroom.ucla.edu/stories/ucla-faculty-voice:-bitcoin-is-an-energy-wasting-ponzi-scheme
No. 597     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 12:01 PM     
One of Asia’s largest banks says bitcoin is ‘a ponzi scheme’
David Gledhill, group chief information officer at DBS, one of Asia’s largest banks, said he believes bitcoin is a ponzi scheme

http://www.scmp.com/business/banking-finance/article/2119983/one-asias-largest-banks-says-bitcoin-ponzi-scheme
No. 598     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 12:14 PM     
Bitcoin’s place in the long history of pyramid schemes

https://www.ft.com/content/1877c388-8797-11e5-90de-f44762bf9896
No. 599     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 12:18 PM     
Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme, and it will collapse like one

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/364306-bitcoin-is-a-ponzi-scheme-and-it-will-collapse-like-one
No. 600     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 12:26 PM     
Why Bitcoin Is A Ponzi Scheme

http://kernelmag.dailydot.com/issue-sections/staff-editorials/11338/bitcoin-ponzi-scheme/
No. 601     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 12:42 PM     
Many foolishly fear what they do not understand.

There may Ponzi schemes or pyramid schemes using Bitcoin as the vehicle, same as there is with other things. People need to know the definition of Ponzi scheme and pyramid scheme before they make such accusations about Bitcoin itself. To make such accusations indicates how “foolish” they are.
No. 602     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 1:40 PM     
I also doubt our nation's and the world's largest banking, brokerages, financial, investment and securities institutions would be aligning with and partnering with Bitcoin if it could be defined as a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme. You can bet they done their research before entering such partnerships.

Fidelity Investments partnered with Coinbase earlier this year, which is the world's most popular Bitcoin, Ethereum, and Litecoin exchange.

MasterCard and VISA have partnered with various digital currency exchanges issuing debit cards allowing customers to use the cards same as other credit and/or debit cards are used to pay from their digital currency account. I have a VISA card that does such. I can use it to pay with Bitcoin at any merchant that accepts VISA.

Some of the largest precious metals brokers take digital currency as payment for precious metals and even provide a substantial discount when you pay them with a digital currency. I myself have been acquiring silver in this manner at a 15% discount below spot price.

The Chase Bank down around the corner from me processes exchanges and wires for me of $10000 and more at time for Bitcoin transactions.

If a digital currency meets the definition of a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme, then so does our USD and any other currency for that matter.
No. 603     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 1:46 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

At any rate a Ponzi scheme uses current inflows to pay “profits” to the earliest “investors” and the earlier you get in the more you make while the last one into the scheme finds he has no chair when the music stops."


But a digital currency does not do this. It has already been proven they do not.

A digital currency may collapse, have a bubble burst, whatever, same as any other investment. But that does no make any of them a Ponzi or pyramid scheme.
No. 604     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 2:38 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

I also doubt our nation's and the world's largest banking, brokerages, financial, investment and securities institutions would be aligning with and partnering with Bitcoin if it could be defined as a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme. You can bet they done their research before entering such partnerships.

Fidelity Investments partnered with Coinbase earlier this year, which is the world's most popular Bitcoin, Ethereum, and Litecoin exchange.

MasterCard and VISA have partnered with various digital currency exchanges issuing debit cards allowing customers to use the cards same as other credit and/or debit cards are used to pay from their digital currency account. I have a VISA card that does such. I can use it to pay with Bitcoin at any merchant that accepts VISA.

Some of the largest precious metals brokers take digital currency as payment for precious metals and even provide a substantial discount when you pay them with a digital currency. I myself have been acquiring silver in this manner at a 15% discount below spot price.

The Chase Bank down around the corner from me processes exchanges and wires for me of $10000 and more at time for Bitcoin transactions.

If a digital currency meets the definition of a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme, then so does our USD and any other currency for that matter.


More and more Finanical regulators and Taxing authorities are getting involved with cryptocurrency transactions.

Mark my words you will see more and more regulation and criminal busts by authorities. One reason being cryptocurrencies have become a haven for money laundering.

Coinbase Ordered to Hand Over Details of 14,355 Users to the IRS

http://kernelmag.dailydot.com/issue-sections/staff-editorials/11338/bitcoin-ponzi-scheme/

"I hereby make a prediction: Bitcoins will go down in history as the most spectacular private Ponzi scheme in history. It will dwarf anything dreamed of by Bernard Madoff. (It will never rival Social Security, however.)

To explain my position, I must do two things. First, I will describe the economics of every Ponzi scheme. Second, I will explain the Austrian school of economics’ theory of the origin of money. My analysis is strictly economic. As far as I know, it is a legal scheme—and should be.

Ponzi economics
First, someone who no one has ever heard of before announces that he has discovered a way to make money. In the case of Bitcoin, the claim is literal. The creator literally made what he says is money, or will be money. He made this money out of digits. He made it out of nothing. Think “Federal Reserve wanna-be.”

Second, the individual claims that a particular market provides unexploited arbitrage opportunities. Something is selling too low. If you buy into the program now, the person running the scheme will be able to sell it high on your behalf. So, you will take advantage of the arbitrage opportunity.

Today, with high-speed trading, arbitrage opportunities last only for a few milliseconds seconds in widely traded markets. Arbitrage opportunities in the commodity futures market last for very short periods. But in the most leveraged and sophisticated of all the futures markets, namely, the currency futures markets, arbitrage opportunities last for so brief a period of time that only high-speed computer programs can take advantage of them.

The individual who sells the Ponzi scheme makes money by siphoning off a large share of the money coming in. In other words, he does not make the investment. But bitcoins are unique. The money was siphoned off from the beginning. Somebody owned a good percentage of the original digits. Then, by telling his story, this individual created demand for all of the digits. The dollar-value of his share of the bitcoins appreciates with the other digits.

This strategy was described a generation ago by George Goodman, who wrote under the pseudonym of Adam Smith. You can find it in his book, Supermoney. This is done with financial corporations when individuals create a new business, retain a large share of the shares, and then sell the stock to the public. In this sense, Bitcoin is not a Ponzi scheme. It is simply a supermoney scheme.

The coins will never be the money of the future.

The Ponzi aspect of it comes when we look at the justification for bitcoins. They were sold on the basis that bitcoins will be an alternative currency. In other words, this will be the money of the future.

The coins will never be the money of the future.

The Austrian school’s theory of money’s origins
The best definition of money was first offered by Austrian economist Carl Menger in 1892. He said that money is the most marketable commodity. This definition was picked up by his disciple, Ludwig von Mises, who presented it in his book, The Theory of Money and Credit, published in 1912.

In that book, Mises argued, as Menger had before him, that money arises out of market transactions. That which did not function as money before, now functions as money. Something that was valuable for its own sake, most likely gold or silver, becomes valuable for another purpose, namely, the facilitation of exchange. People move from barter to a monetary economy. This increases the division of labor. As more and more people use the money commodity in order to facilitate exchanges, the division of labor extends, and as a result, people’s productivity increases. They can specialize. This specialization produces increased output per person, and therefore increased income per person.

In this scenario, something that had independent value becomes the focus of traders, who find that their ability to buy and sell increases as a result of the use of this commodity. Money develops out of market exchanges. Money was not used for its own sake initially, but it becomes widely used as money as a result of innumerable transactions within the economy. (I discuss this in my chapter in Theory of Money and Fiduciary Media, published by the Mises Institute in 2012.)

Here is the central fact of money. Money is the product of the market process. It arises out of an unplanned, decentralized process. This takes time. It takes a lot of time. It spreads slowly, as new people discover it as a tool of production, because it increases the size of the market for all goods and services. No one says, “I think I’ll invent a new form of money.”

Note: any time you see a proposal of a new form of money, hold on to your old form of money.

The central benefit of money is its predictable purchasing power. A monetary commodity is not easy to produce. The cost of mining is high. Money is slowly adopted by a large number of participants. These participants use money as a means of exchange. Why? Because it was valuable the day before. They therefore expect it to be valuable the next day. Money has continuity of value. This is not intrinsic value. It is historic value. So, a person can buy money by the sale of goods or services, set this money aside, and re-enter the markets in a different location or in a different time, in the confidence that he will probably be able to buy a similar quantity of goods and services.

The money was siphoned off from the beginning.

Money is not accumulated for its own sake. It is accumulated to buy future goods and services. It is useful in the facilitation of exchange precisely because its market value varies little over time. It is the predictability of money’s market exchange rate that makes it money.

Bitcoins are not money
Now let us look at bitcoins. The market value of one bitcoin has gone from about $2 to $1,000 in a year. This is not money. This commodity is not being bought for its services as money. It is unpredictable to a fault.

Admittedly, those who got in early on this Ponzi scheme are doing very well. They will probably continue to do well for a time. As more people hear about this investment, which is justified in terms of its future potential as money, more people will buy it. Late-comers are not buying it because they understand its potential as future money, any more than the late investors in Charles Ponzi’s scheme thought they were buying into the arbitrage potential of foreign postage stamps. They are buying bitcoins because we are in the midst of a Ponzi scheme mania. They will continue to buy because they think this time it’s different.

This digital so-called money will not be used to facilitate exchange. Nobody is going to be getting rid of an asset that has moved from $2 to $1,000 in one year in order to buy pizzas. People want to hang onto it, refusing to sell, in the hopes that it will go to $2,000. This is the classic mark of Ponzi scheme psychology. People do not buy the investment for the benefits that the investment provides as an investment, in other words, because it is a capital asset. They buy it only because it has gone up in price. They expect this to continue.

Here is the Austrian school’s theory of money. People buy money because it has not fallen in price. But it has also not gone up in price much, either. It is predictable. Why? Because it is held in reserve by a large number of people over a large geographical area. It has become money through tradition, through experience, and through endless numbers of exchanges on a voluntary basis. It has proven itself in the marketplace as a means of facilitating exchange, and thereby as a means of preserving value over time. This is not the characteristic feature of a Bitcoin. People are not buying it to serve as money; they are buying it because they are in the midst of a mania, and they are gambling that the number of buyers will continue upward forever.

Here is an economic fact: The number of fools is limited. They are a scarce economic resource. As the price of bitcoins rises, more fools will be lured into the market. But this is a finite market.

In other words, bitcoins cannot possibly fulfill their supposed purpose: to serve as an unregulated currency unit. Bitcoins are not an alternative currency. They are something you buy in the midst of a mania, and you will sell at some point in order to get back your money. You are thinking of buying bitcoins, not because bitcoins will serve as a means of exchange, as originally argued, but because you want to get back lots more money than you paid for them. In other words, bitcoins are not money; dollars are money. There has been no challenge from bitcoins to the reign of the dollar.

Money is the product of the market process. It arises out of an unplanned, decentralized process. This takes time.

Just say no
When you see an offer of an investment which inherently cannot possibly exist on its own merit, and yet lots of people are coming into the market to buy the item, you know, without any question, that this is a Ponzi scheme. People are buying into the program, not because of an arbitrage opportunity, and not because of a capital breakthrough in terms of technology, but because somebody else bought it cheaper yesterday. You buy it today, not because you think it is going to offer a stable value, but because you think you’re going to make a bundle of money when more people come into the market. Again, this is the classic mark of a Ponzi scheme.

In order for bitcoins to become an alternative currency, there will have to be millions of users of the currency. There will have to be tens of millions of users of the currency. They will have to develop in a market on their merit as money, not as an investment of dollars in order to get more dollars back. It would have to develop through exchange, not bought as an investment. In other words, the free market will have to adopt bitcoins as a means of increasing the division of labor.

Bitcoins are not increasing the division of labor. They are bought on the basis that somebody can get into a game of musical chairs. Instead of running out of chairs, leaving one person the great winter, the promoters started with a given number of chairs, and then they hoped that lots would come and bid on the chairs. “If we issue it, they will come.” This took place. The promoters creators are now very rich, as measured in dollars.

The fact of the matter is this: Bitcoins will not increase the division of labor by serving as an alternative currency. Inherently, bitcoins have made their mark, not on the basis of their stable value in exchange, that is, their value in increasing the division of labor in alternative markets that do not use the dollar. On the contrary, bitcoins are being purchased for one reason only: to get in on the deal. Buy low; sell high. Buy with what? Dollars. Sell for what? Dollars.

The mania has destroyed bitcoins’ use as money. Bitcoins are too volatile in price ever to serve as a currency.

Which is money: dollars or bitcoins? The answer is obvious: dollars.

This is a Ponzi scheme.

What goes up comes down
This will lead to the ruination of more people than any private Ponzi scheme in history. There will be the poor schnooks to get in at the end, paying perhaps thousands of dollars per bitcoin. Then the market will unravel. It will unravel for the same reason that all Ponzi schemes have unraveled: not enough new buyers. When the new buyers do not show up in great numbers, the holders will start to dump them. What went up in price, as measured in dollars, the real money, will come down in price.

This mania is going to be the stuff of best-selling books. This is going to be this stuff of Ph.D. dissertations in economics and psychology. This is going to be the equivalent of Mackay’s book, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds.

Here is an economic fact: The number of fools is limited.

The interesting thing is the mania started among the most technologically sophisticated people on earth: computer techies. The techies who got in early are going to be fabulously wealthy… if they sell. But the poor schnooks who come in at the and are going to lose money. Collectively, this will be the greatest single scheme for lots of people losing money that we have ever seen. This Ponzi scheme is not illegal… yet. It will spread. It has gone viral.

Any time you buy an investment, you had better have an exit strategy. There is no exit strategy for bitcoins.

You must get out at the top, or you lose your shirt.

Conclusion
Anytime that anybody tries to sell you an investment, you have to look at it on this basis: “What are the future benefits that this investment will give final consumers?” In other words, how does it serve the final consumer? If it does not serve the final consumer, then it is a Ponzi scheme.

Bitcoins cannot serve the consumer. There is nothing to consume. The only way that bitcoins can work to the advantage of the consumer is that they provides the consumer with increased opportunities, based on bitcoins’ function as money. But the fundamental characteristic of money is its relatively stable purchasing power.

Bitcoins will never achieve this. It is a mania going up. It will be a mania coming down. It will not increase the division of labor, because people will recognize it as having been a Ponzi scheme, and they will not again buy it. They will not use it in exchange. Companies will not sell goods and services based on bitcoins. Bitcoins have to have stable purchasing power if they are to serve as money, and they will never, ever achieve stable purchasing power.

Whenever somebody tries to sell you an investment that is based on the economic analysis of a market—an analysis that cannot possibly be true—do not buy the investment. This is a simple rule. I adhere to this rule.

There has to be an economic justification for a capital investment, and there is no economic justification of buying bitcoins as an alternative currency. That was how bitcoins were initially sold, and it was impossible as an economic concept from the beginning. The Austrian theory of money shows why.

I do not invest in capital that has no economic justification other than the greater fool theory. There are too few fools to keep the scheme going.

Bitcoins are not illegal. They should not be made illegal. They should merely be avoided.

Gary North is an American economic historian. You can follow his writing on current economic affairs and investment markets on his site. This article was republished with permission. You can read his followup article here."
No. 605     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 2:43 PM     
Coinbase to suspend all accounts on August 1st as “civil war” hard fork hammers Bitcoin… massive fraud now the norm at Coinbase

https://www.naturalnews.com/2017-07-19-coinbase-to-suspend-all-accounts-on-august-1st-as-civil-war-hard-fork-hammers-bitcoin-massive-fraud-now-the-norm-at-coinbase.html
No. 606     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 2:54 PM     
Bitcoin is the Biggest Ponzi Scheme In History

https://youtu.be/kOw15zYwmfM
No. 607     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 2:57 PM     
Bitcoin Is A Trojan horse

https://youtu.be/vtO_-3M0_wc
No. 608     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:00 PM     
Rickards: ‘Bitcoin is a Ponzi Scheme’

https://youtu.be/rotzgnrnfnY
No. 609     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:03 PM     
Bankers Explain Plan to Stop Bitcoin

https://youtu.be/W8TyZgJWUkA
No. 610     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:07 PM     
How the Bitcoin Bubble Will Pop

https://youtu.be/uyoABcfdyAA
No. 611     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:09 PM     
How Bitcoin Works in 5 Minutes (Technical)

https://youtu.be/l9jOJk30eQs
No. 612     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:11 PM     
Biggest bubble in history: What you need to know about bitcoin

https://youtu.be/9N2Izi7rpvg
No. 613     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:16 PM     
Don't Trust Bitcoin!
Ave Ramsey, a Multimillionaire says he wouldn't put one dime into Bitcoin.

https://youtu.be/EMUOh1YdKQI
No. 614     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:21 PM     
BITCOIN MANIA! - Dave Ramsey Rant

https://youtu.be/6ES9wzGyYMU
No. 615     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:22 PM     
He that hasteth to be rich [hath] an evil eye, and considereth not that poverty shall come upon him. ~ Proverbs 28:22
No. 616     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:25 PM     
A faithful man will abound with blessings, But he who makes haste to be rich will not go unpunished. ~ Proverbs 28:20
No. 617     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:31 PM     
Bitcoin: What You're Not Being Told

https://youtu.be/PfeA94BedQI
No. 618     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 3:35 PM     
Buffett: bitcoin is not a currency

https://youtu.be/qTxPfxmkLIY
No. 619     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:09 PM     
PAUL KRUGMAN: Bitcoin is a More Obvious Bubble than Housing Was

https://youtu.be/TnJn405yZN4

"Nobel prize-winning economist Paul Krugman talks to Business Insider senior political editor Josh Barro about bitcoin. Krugman says the price of bitcoin is helped by the fact that no one understands it and people are caught up in the mystique of this new technology. Following is a transcript of the video.
No. 620     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:10 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

I also doubt our nation's and the world's largest banking, brokerages, financial, investment and securities institutions would be aligning with and partnering with Bitcoin if it could be defined as a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme. You can bet they done their research before entering such partnerships.

Fidelity Investments partnered with Coinbase earlier this year, which is the world's most popular Bitcoin, Ethereum, and Litecoin exchange.

MasterCard and VISA have partnered with various digital currency exchanges issuing debit cards allowing customers to use the cards same as other credit and/or debit cards are used to pay from their digital currency account. I have a VISA card that does such. I can use it to pay with Bitcoin at any merchant that accepts VISA.

Some of the largest precious metals brokers take digital currency as payment for precious metals and even provide a substantial discount when you pay them with a digital currency. I myself have been acquiring silver in this manner at a 15% discount below spot price.

The Chase Bank down around the corner from me processes exchanges and wires for me of $10000 and more at time for Bitcoin transactions.

If a digital currency meets the definition of a Ponzi and/or pyramid scheme, then so does our USD and any other currency for that matter.


More and more Finanical regulators and Taxing authorities are getting involved with cryptocurrency transactions.

Mark my words you will see more and more regulation and criminal busts by authorities. One reason being cryptocurrencies have become a haven for money laundering.

Coinbase Ordered to Hand Over Details of 14,355 Users to the IRS

http://kernelmag.dailydot.com/issue-sections/staff-editorials/11338/bitcoin-ponzi-scheme/


This is old news from a couple years ago. Coinbase won this battle and had to turn over nothing. Was a ruled a violation of privacy rights.

But I am sure it will come up again.
No. 621     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:12 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:
More and more Finanical regulators and Taxing authorities are getting involved with cryptocurrency transactions.

Mark my words you will see more and more regulation and criminal busts by authorities. One reason being cryptocurrencies have become a haven for money laundering.


As they should.

And anybody should be busted that utilizes anything in an illegal manner.

Obvious common sense.
No. 622     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:17 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Coinbase to suspend all accounts on August 1st as “civil war” hard fork hammers Bitcoin… massive fraud now the norm at Coinbase

https://www.naturalnews.com/2017-07-19-coinbase-to-suspend-all-accounts-on-august-1st-as-civil-war-hard-fork-hammers-bitcoin-massive-fraud-now-the-norm-at-coinbase.html


More old news, and this article is false. No more credible and just as irrelevant as most all you have posted.

I have two Coinbase accounts. Trading was temporarily suspended to protect account holders. The fork was something new and it was not sure what ramifications there would be. Turned out to be a non-issue, but better safe than sorry. Coinbase took excessive measures to protect their account holders.

And if something were to happen with a Coinbase account, your balances with Coinbase are insured.
No. 623     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:19 PM     
Why Bitcoin Checks All the Boxes of a Bubble

https://youtu.be/943YVUTkO3o


"Business Insider CEO Henry Blodget discusses the meteoric rise of bitcoin. He references a recent research note published by former Merrill Lynch chief investment strategist Richard Bernstein, who refers to the cryptocurrency as "bitcon." Blodget walks through Bernstein's assertion the bitcoin meets all five characteristics of a bubble: available liquidity, leverage, democratization, new issues and turnover. The good news for bitcoin speculators is that Bernstein thinks the rally will continue until the Fed siphons off liquidity.

Business Insider editor-at-large Sara Silverstein, who is generally a bitcoin enthusiast, recognizes that it could be a bubble, but nothing like past catastrophic ones like the tulip bubble. She says it could end up drawing some parallels to the tech bubble, however, because after that market blowup, tech remained a large asset class and a big part of the market. Blodget then points out that there's no real way to value bitcoin, and that efforts to do so are absurd. In the near to medium term, Silverstein still sees lots of money flowing into bitcoin and the cryptocurrency space at large."
No. 624     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:22 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Buffett: bitcoin is not a currency

https://youtu.be/qTxPfxmkLIY


I respect Warren Buffett.

But the Federal government has ruled, twice now, that Bitcoin is a currency per the US virtual currency laws and will not be restricted as a medium of exchange between mutually agreeing parties. This ruling dates backs to like 2012/2013.
No. 625     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:28 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

A faithful man will abound with blessings, But he who makes haste to be rich will not go unpunished. ~ Proverbs 28:20


Yes, some may be getting involved in digital currencies for selfish and incorrect reasons, but that does not make digital currencies evil any more than it makes anything else evil that man abuses.

Money is not the root of evil, the love of money is the root of evil.

1 Timothy 6:10 King James Version (KJV)
10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
No. 626     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:29 PM     
No one knows who created Bitcoin back in 2009. It remains a mystery to this day.

That should tell you something and raise some red flags right there.

There has been speculation over the years as to who it was and is but so far the creator has not revealed himself.

He must be one rich puppy by now, a Billionaire the below article speculates.

The person who created Bitcoin remains a mystery

https://nypost.com/2017/12/16/the-person-who-created-bitcoin-remains-a-mystery/
No. 627     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:30 PM     
You are barking up the wrong tree BF.

Most all you have posted in relation to Bitcoin is not credible and is irrelevant and misleading to what is the truth.
No. 628     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:32 PM     
And that is what it was originally designed to do when created, to make the creator immensely wealthy.

Whoever created Bitcoin is now among the world’s 50 richest people

https://thenextweb.com/hardfork/2017/12/18/whoever-created-bitcoin-is-now-among-the-worlds-50-richest-people/
No. 629     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:37 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

No one knows who created Bitcoin back in 2009. It remains a mystery to this day.

That should tell you something and raise some red flags right there.

There has been speculation over the years as to who it was and is but so far the creator has not revealed himself.

He must be one rich puppy by now, a Billionaire the below article speculates.

The person who created Bitcoin remains a mystery

https://nypost.com/2017/12/16/the-person-who-created-bitcoin-remains-a-mystery/


For all practical purposes, why should anyone care?

I am sure most carrying USDs around do not really care how they came about. They are legal tender per the Federal government.

The Federal government has ruled Bitcoin a virtual currency per the US virtual currency laws. They do not seem to care whom created it.
No. 630     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:39 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

crayons wrote:

uh huh, and where would one git a physical "hold in yer hand bit coin" that
one could even buy a steak with?


I accept Bitcoin on my website. I just installed a plugin for it as a payment option to supplement credit/debit card or PayPal payments.

And that reminds me, I have to get busy and list my business among the many website directories to include it as a Business that accepts Bitcoin.

Here are just a few of the many directories out there.

http://spendbitcoins.com/places/

Here is a list of Food Businesses that accept Bitcoin:

http://spendbitcoins.com/places/c/food/serving/All

460 of them in this directory. Firehouse Subs, Emergency Survival Food Supplies, Survival Food.com, Emergency Seed Bank, Art Of Tacos, Sipacoff's Premium Meats, Freshfully Grocery Store, Dodge's Pizza, quite a few Farmer's Markets,


Here is another list of Companies that accept Bitcoin as payment. Notice the many "Big Store Names" in there for many of them:

http://www.bitcoinvalues.net/who-accepts-bitcoins-payment-companies-stores-take-bitcoins.html

List of Companies Who Accepts Bitcoins as Payment!
Many companies are accepting bitcoins, many are not. Here is a list of the biggest names who accepts bitcoins as a currency.
WordPress.com – An online company that allows user to create free blogs
Overstock.com – A company that sells big ticket items at lower prices due to overstocking
Amazon – An online company that sells almost anything.
Target – An American retailing company
CVS – A pharmacy shop
Subway – Eat fresh
Victoria’s Secret – A lingerie outlet
Namecheap - Domain name registrar
Bitcoin.Travel – a travel site that provides accommodation, apartments, attractions, bars, and beauty salons around the world
Pembury Tavern – A pub in London, England
Old Fitzroy – A pub in Sydney, Australia
The Pink Cow – A diner in Tokyo, Japan
Virgin Galactic - Richard Branson company that includes Virgin Mobile and Virgin Airline
The Pirate Bay - BitTorrent directories
Reddit – You can buy premium features there with bitcoins
Zynga – Mobile gaming
PayPal / Ebay - Credit card / payment processor / Auction
Tesla – The car company
OkCupid – Online dating site
4Chan.org – For premium services
EZTV – Torrents TV shows provider
Mega.co.nz – The new venture started by the former owner of MegaUpload Kim Dotcom
Lumfile – Free cloud base file server – pay for premium services
Etsy Vendors – 93 of them
PizzaForCoins.com - Domino’s Pizza signed up – pay for their pizza with bitcons
Tigerdirect – Major electronic online retailer
CheapAir.com – Travel booking site for airline tickets, car rentals, hotels
Expedia.com – Online travel booking agency
Zappos – Online retailer
Whole Foods – Organic food store (by purchasing gift card from Gyft)
Bitcoincoffee.com – Buy your favorite coffee online
Grass Hill Alpacas – A local farm in Haydenville, MA
Jeffersons Store - A street wear clothing store in Bergenfield, N.J
Helen’s Pizza - Jersey City, N.J., you can get a slice of pizza for 0.00339 bitcoin by pointing your phone at a sign next to the cash register
A Class Limousine - Pick you up and drop you off at Newark (N.J.) Airport
Fiverr.com – Get almost anything done for $5
Seoclerks.com – Get SEO work done on your site cheap
Namecheap – Cheap domain registration company
CoinMama: Buy Bitcoins with Credit Card

Sacramento Kings – Professional Basketball team out in Sacramental California (NBA)
Mint.com - Mint pulls all your financial accounts into one place. Set a budget, track your goals and do more
with your money, for free! (Source: mint.com)
TechCrunch.com – IT blog
Fancy.com - Discover amazing stuff, collect the things you love, buy it all in one place (Source: Fancy)
Bing by Microsoft – 2nd search engine to Google
Bloomberg.com – Online newspaper
Humblebundle.com – Indie game site
BigFishGames.com – Games for PC, Mac and Smartphones (iPhone, Android, Windows)
Suntimes.com – Chicago based online newspaper
San Jose Earthquakes – San Jose California Professional Soccer Team (MLS)
Square – Payment processor that help small businesses accept credit cards using iPhone, Android or iPad
Crowdtilt.com - The fastest and easiest way to pool funds with family and friends (Source: crowdtilt)
Lumfile – Server company that offers free cloud-based servers
Museum of the Coastal Bend - 2200 East Red River Street, Victoria, Texas 77901, USA
Home Depot - Office supplies store
Kmart - Retail products store
Sears - Clothing and household products, electronic store
Gap, GameStop and JC Penney – have to use eGifter.com
Etsy Vendors – Original art and Jewelry creations
Fight for the Future – Leading organization finding for Internet freedom
i-Pmart (ipmart.com.my) – A Malaysian online mobile phone and electronic parts retailer
curryupnow.com - A total of 12 restaurants on the list of restaurants accept bitcoins in San Francisco Bay Area
Dish Network - An American direct-broadcast satellite service provider
Apple’s App Store - Buy music and any app on the Apple AppStore with bitcoins
The Libertarian Party – United States political party
Yacht-base.com – Croatian yacht charter company
Euro Pacific – A major precious metal dealer
CEX – The trade-in chain has a shop in Glasgow, Scotland that accepts bitcoin
Straub Auto Repairs - 477 Warburton Ave, Hastings-on-Hudson, NY 10706 - (914) 478-1177
PSP Mollie – Dutch Payment Service
Intuit - an American software company that develops financial and tax preparation software and related services for small businesses, accountants and individuals.
Newegg.com – Online electronics retailer now uses bitpay to accept bitcoin as payment
ShopJoy – An Australian online retailer that sells novelty and unique gifts
Wikipedia - The Free Encyclopedia with 4 570 000+ article
Lv.net - Las Vegas high speed internet services
ExpressVPN.com – High speed, ultra secure VPN network
Grooveshark – Online music streaming service based in the United States
Dell - American privately owned multinational computer technology company
Braintree – Well known payments processor
MIT Coop Store - Massachusetts Institute of Technology student bookstore
SimplePay - Nigeria’s most popular web and mobile-based wallet service
SFU bookstore - Simon Fraser University in Vancouver, Canada
State Republican Party – First State Republican Party to accept bitcoin donations (http://www.lagop.com/bitcoin-donate)
mspinc.com – Respiratory medical equipment supplies store
1-800-FLOWERS.COM – United States based online floral and gift retailer and distributor
Shopify.com – An online store that allows anyone to sell their products
Famsa – Mexico’s biggest retailer
Naughty America - Adult entertainment provider
Mexico’s Universidad de las Américas Puebla – A major university in Mexico
LOT Polish Airlines – A worldwide airline based in Poland
MovieTickets.com – Online movie ticket exchange/retailer
Dream Lover – Online relationship service
Lionsgate Films - The production studio behind titles such as The Hunger Games and The Day After Tomorrow
Rakutan – A Japanese e-commerce giant
Badoo – Online dating network
RE/MAX London - UK-based franchisee of the global real estate network
T-Mobile Poland – T-Mobile’s Poland-based mobile phone top-up company
Stripe - San Francisco-based payments company
WebJet – Online travel agency
Microsoft – Software company
Braintree – Research firm
Green Man Gaming - Popular digital game reseller
Save the Children - Global charity organization
NCR Silver – Point of sales systems
One Shot Hotels – Spanish hotel chain
- See more at: http://www.bitcoinvalues.net/who-accepts-bitcoins-payment-companies-stores-take-bitcoins.html#sthash.R2rUtChh.dpuf


Has there been a change of heart?
No. 631     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:39 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

You are barking up the wrong tree BF.

Most all you have posted in relation to Bitcoin is not credible and is irrelevant and misleading to what is the truth.


Oh please most of these articles are from the world's top financial experts. I have named many of them.

Stop trying to dodge that fact.
No. 632     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:42 PM     
Has there been a change of heart?

As an investment vehicle, yes.

Way to volatile and risky for me.

And everything I have been reading lately as I do more research on it says it will have a bad end in the end.

Time will tell.
No. 633     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:48 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

You are barking up the wrong tree BF.

Most all you have posted in relation to Bitcoin is not credible and is irrelevant and misleading to what is the truth.


Oh please most of these articles are from the world's top financial experts. I have named many of them.

Stop trying to dodge that fact.



And there are just as many of the world's top financial experts saying the opposite. And many of the articles you share do not really 100% support in the body of the article what the title implies.

What fact am I dodging?

Might be nice to know what your agenda or point even is with your "foolish" postings.

Appears you are attempting declare Bitcoin evil because some people may use it in an evil manner. That is illogical.
No. 634     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:53 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

A faithful man will abound with blessings, But he who makes haste to be rich will not go unpunished. ~ Proverbs 28:20


Yes, some may be getting involved in digital currencies for selfish and incorrect reasons, but that does not make digital currencies evil any more than it makes anything else evil that man abuses.

Money is not the root of evil, the love of money is the root of evil.

1 Timothy 6:10 King James Version (KJV)
10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.


You are reading something into the Biblical Verse I posted that is not even there.

Did it or I state that money is evil???

No.

Did it or I state that digital currency is evil???

No.
No. 635     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:54 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Has there been a change of heart?

As an investment vehicle, yes.

Way to volatile and risky for me.

And everything I have been reading lately as I do more research on it says it will have a bad end in the end.

Time will tell.


I cannot disagree with you on the volatility. But I see way more research in support of investing in Bitcoin than I see against it. And from the world's top financial advisers familiar with those industries.

If one opts to invest in digital currencies, that is their choice and they should use the same prudence as they would with any other investment.
No. 636     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 5:56 PM     
Bullfighter279 wrote:

Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

A faithful man will abound with blessings, But he who makes haste to be rich will not go unpunished. ~ Proverbs 28:20


Yes, some may be getting involved in digital currencies for selfish and incorrect reasons, but that does not make digital currencies evil any more than it makes anything else evil that man abuses.

Money is not the root of evil, the love of money is the root of evil.

1 Timothy 6:10 King James Version (KJV)
10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.


You are reading something into the Biblical Verse I posted that is not even there.

Did it or I state that money is evil???

No.

Did it or I state that digital currency is evil???

No.


Whatever BF. You have a good night.
No. 637     Reply: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 6:05 PM     
Survivor wrote:


And there are just as many of the world's top financial experts saying the opposite. And many of the articles you share do not really 100% support in the body of the article what the title implies.

What fact am I dodging?

Might be nice to know what your agenda or point even is with your "foolish" postings.

Appears you are attempting declare Bitcoin evil because some people may use
it in an evil manner. That is illogical.


LOL. A lie, what do I have to do post the entire articles here as well as the title and links so you cannot mislead others about what they say?

Foolish postings eh?

You are still dodging the fact that it is those financial experts who are saying these things and not me.

It is them you are calling foolish, lol.

And it is them that are calling Bitcoin one big ponzi pyramid scheme that is currently in a bubble.
No. 638     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 6:12 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

Coinbase to suspend all accounts on August 1st as “civil war” hard fork hammers Bitcoin… massive fraud now the norm at Coinbase

https://www.naturalnews.com/2017-07-19-coinbase-to-suspend-all-accounts-on-august-1st-as-civil-war-hard-fork-hammers-bitcoin-massive-fraud-now-the-norm-at-coinbase.html


More old news, and this article is false. No more credible and just as irrelevant as most all you have posted.


Nice try, but you are arguing with many of the world's top financial experts opinions not mine.

Very well then, have it your way, I will post the articles in their entirety so you cannot mislead anyone here with your false comments.

No. 639     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 6:33 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Bullfighter279 wrote:

No one knows who created Bitcoin back in 2009. It remains a mystery to this day.

That should tell you something and raise some red flags right there.

There has been speculation over the years as to who it was and is but so far the creator has not revealed himself.

He must be one rich puppy by now, a Billionaire the below article speculates.

The person who created Bitcoin remains a mystery

https://nypost.com/2017/12/16/the-person-who-created-bitcoin-remains-a-mystery/


For all practical purposes, why should anyone care?

I am sure most carrying USDs around do not really care how they came about. They are legal tender per the Federal government.

The Federal government has ruled Bitcoin a virtual currency per the US virtual currency laws. They do not seem to care whom created it.


The reason the founder of Bitcoin remains unknown and anonymous is likely because he knows at some point Governmental authorities will be after him.

In some Countries Bitcoin mining is actually illegal and can land you in prison.

The One Big Reason Why It Matters Who Invented Bitcoin

http://time.com/4142523/bitcoin-inventor-satoshi-nakamoto-craig-wright/

By ALEX FITZPATRICK Updated: May 2, 2016 8:20 AM ET | Originally published: December 9, 2015

"Australian police raided the home of one Craig Wright Wednesday, mere hours after two publications alleged that he is the secretive inventor of Bitcoin, a decentralized digital currency that’s become a darling of tech-savvy libertarians seeking an alternative to dollars, euros and so on.

Update: Wright is now claiming to be Bitcoin’s creator.

So far, Australian authorities say the raid against Wright has nothing to do with reports in Wired and Gizmodo suggesting he is Satoshi Nakamoto, Bitcoin’s pseudonymous creator. Those publications provided ample evidence tying Wright to Nakamoto. But they also stressed that Wright could be trying to trick journalists and the legions of other Bitcoin-watchers who have made a hobby of seeking Nakamoto’s true identity.

We’ve been down this road before. Newsweek reported last year that Bitcoin’s Nakamoto was Dorian Nakamoto, a California-based engineer. That Nakamoto refuted the claims and raised money to fund a lawsuit against the publication in response.

But beyond simple curiosity about the man behind the curtain, does it actually matter who invented Bitcoin? Only if you care about the future of a currency with a total value of about $6.3 billion as of this writing.

First, a quick primer on how Bitcoin works. Bitcoins are brought into existence — “mined,” in the parlance — by computers plugging away at very hard math problems. The system is designed so those problems get harder over time.

That means it takes more processing power to mine one Bitcoin today than it did yesterday, and so on. The total number of Bitcoins that could ever be mined has a hard limit, which should theoretically bring some degree of price stability to the system.

Oh, and this is important for later: One of Bitcoin’s most important features is a public ledger of transactions.

Back to Bitcoin’s creator. Because it was easier to mine large amounts of Bitcoin in the currency’s early days, whoever invented Bitcoin would reasonably have a large stash of them.

The early bird gets the worm, after all.

Indeed, there’s a mysterious cache of 1.1 million Bitcoin, worth about half a billion American dollars as of this writing, visible on Bitcoin’s public ledger. The stockpile is widely believed to be controlled by Bitcoin’s inventor, though it never moves.

There could be a good reason the stash stays put. Wired reports the 1.1 million Bitcoin hoard could be tied up in a kind of digital trust fund that Wright only can fully access in 2020.

When and if that happens, and Wright sells his stash, it will introduce a glut of supply to the Bitcoin market, likely wreaking havoc with the price of a currency that’s no stranger to wild swings in value.

Assuming Wright is indeed Bitcoin’s creator, that leaves him with an interesting conundrum. Bitcoin is beloved by free-market types because it has no central bank, no Fed, no Janet Yellen controlling the money supply.

But if Bitcoin’s alleged creator really is sitting on a half-billion dollar stockpile of the stuff, he will have become the kind of central banker archetype that Bitcoin’s die-hard fans consider their personal boogeyman.

Should Wright cash out and make off with a more widely-accepted currency like dollars, Bitcoin may never recover from the price shock triggered by the sudden glut in supply. Thus, the destiny of a supposedly decentralized currency may rest in the hands of one person — exactly the fate it was created to avoid."
No. 640     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 19, 2017 at 6:51 PM     
How Five States Are Approaching Bitcoin Regulation

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/how-five-states-are-approaching-bitcoin-regulation/

Cryptocurrency should be regulated. Cryptocurrency should not be regulated. Cryptocurrency can’t be regulated. How 5 states are approaching regulation.

Cryptocurrency should be regulated. Cryptocurrency should not be regulated. Cryptocurrency can’t be regulated. These are all common refrains emanating from the media these days. Now lawmakers across the United States and around the world are at a crossroads as to what is next in terms of this regulatory space.

Bitcoin and other forms of cryptocurrency present a monumental challenge for legislators, requiring a broad understanding of blockchain technology, especially in terms of its impact on tech innovation. Amid assertions that the U.S. is falling behind in terms of Bitcoin regulation, it could be argued that the regulatory picture is becoming clearer in 2017.

Bitcoin Magazine asked Pawel Kuskowski, CEO and co-founder of Coinfirm, and Joe Ciccolo, president of the Illinois-based Bitcoin compliance firm BitAML, to offer some commentary about the regulatory activity taking place in five U.S. states — Washington, Illinois, Hawaii, California and Florida — and what the regulatory landscape may look like in the days ahead.

Washington

Legislators in Washington state are building momentum around new rules for businesses offering digital currency services. Senate Bill 5013 provides a definition of virtual currency along with disclosure requirements of certain information to consumers. It also would require online currency exchanges within that state to maintain a surety bond. Finally, it offers definitional and clarifying changes for how money transmitters and currency exchangers are regulated under the Uniform Money Services Act.

At the time of this writing, this bill, which was introduced in January, had passed both chambers of the state’s legislature, clearing it to be sent to Governor Jay Inslee for signature. While there is no clear indication as to Governor Inslee’s intentions, broad support of the bill seems to suggest that it may pass.

There has already been a bit of fallout, however, as some cryptocurrency-centric startups are now thinking twice about operating in the state, with several firms having pulled out in the past year, noting the increasingly challenging regulatory environment. These include digital currency exchanges Bitfinex, Bitstamp and Poloniex, the latter of which has exited Washington.

“The State of Washington also appears to have applied a relatively heavy cybersecurity component, including broad and sweeping audits of data and other systems,” says Ciccolo. “Cybersecurity is a hot-button issue that continues to remain in the headlines. Bitcoin companies are wary of a regulatory interpretation of cybersecurity fitness, especially given the nascent stage of Bitcoin and the ongoing knowledge gap as it pertains to the crypto space. For some national players, it seemed the obvious and safe choice was to simply exit the state altogether.”

Illinois

In November of 2016, Secretary Bryan A. Schneider of the Illinois Department of Financial and Professional Regulation (IDFPR) announced a new initiative with implications for cryptocurrencies in that state. This “Digital Currency Regulatory Guidance” is Illinois’s attempt to provide regulatory clarity on digital currencies, such as Bitcoin, Dogecoin, Litecoin, Ethereum and Zcash. The proposed guidance provides IDFPR’s interpretation of Illinois’s Transmitters of Money Act (TOMA) related to various activities tied to digital currencies.

Says Ciccolo: “The IDFPR and Secretary Schneider continue to deliver on the state’s promise of encouraging and supporting innovation in FinTech, Bitcoin and blockchain [technology]. What we’re doing in Illinois is quite possibly unprecedented in the area of financial regulation. Our state regulators are listening and thoughtfully engaging with industry while considering the impact of any laws and regulations. I’m very optimistic about the continued growth of financial innovation in the Land of Lincoln, and Chicago as a center for the new era of financial services.”

Hawaii

In a highly publicized move, prominent Bitcoin and Ethereum exchange Coinbase announced that it was forced to cease supporting customers in the State of Hawaii due to what it called “impractical” and “untenable” regulatory policies surrounding Bitcoin in that state. In September of 2016, Coinbase was first notified of a policy that demanded that they and any other other cryptocurrency operators hold case reserves equivalent to the values being held for customers.

This development came as Hawaii was exploring a bill that would establish a working group for examining the potential role of digital currencies and blockchain technology in advancing tourism in that state. According to the bill’s text contained in House Bill 1481: “Digital currencies such as bitcoin have broad benefits for Hawaii. A large portion of Hawaii’s tourism market comes from Asia where the use of bitcoin as a virtual currency is expanding.”

Leaders at Coinbase said they were “heartened” that the bill had been introduced and that they would look forward to working with regulators. In the meantime, Ciccolo remarked: “Given its commitment to compliance and strong resources, the exit of Coinbase suggests few if any stand a chance in the Aloha State. Indeed, the case reserve requirement is overly burdensome and quite frankly utterly impractical. Since Coinbase holds a BitLicense, could it be said that Hawaii is more inhospitable to Bitcoin than New York? Let’s hope not.”

California

California’s Assembly Bill 1123, a version of New York’s infamous BitLicense, has been proposed. It reads:

“This bill would enact the Virtual Currency Act. The bill would prohibit a person from engaging in any virtual currency business, as defined, in this state unless the person is licensed by the Commissioner of Business Oversight or is exempt from the licensure requirement, as provided.”

Says Kuskowski, CEO and co-founder of Coinfirm:

“In relation to this particular proposed bill in California, any bill with strong similarities to New York’s BitLicense is obviously not the direction to go in, as we saw the effects of that particular regulation result in New York’s loss of prominence as a crypto hub. But with California’s unique position as the technology innovation and startup capital of the world, this would have an even more catastrophic effect than the N.Y. version.”

Kuskowski goes on to say that the costly fees and bureaucratic administration associated with this legislation would likely hinder innovators and startups from applying or even operating in the state. Moreover, he says it would provide another segmented regulatory structure that limits the national and global growth of companies operating in the space.

If there is any place in the world where this could have the largest negative effect it would be California.

Florida

Florida House Bill 1379 recently passed, clarifying what virtual currency is and prohibiting its use in laundering criminal proceeds. The term “virtual currency” was added to the definition of “monetary instruments” under Florida’s Money Laundering Act. The legislation is currently with Florida’s governor and is expected to be signed soon. Ever since a Miami judge dismissed a criminal case involving Bitcoin, policymakers have been intent on establishing guidelines to curb cryptocurrency use.

Says Kuskowski: “In relation to what’s been going on in Florida, a lot of regulators, especially local ones, tend to be more in the crowd profiled earlier that catches headlines, and they go a bit far. But there needs to be a balanced approach from the other side as well. People need to realize that a clear regulatory environment allows companies and creators in the space to make concrete strategic decisions that they [otherwise] can’t when the regulatory environment isn’t clear; it just has to be done properly. Once there is a clear regulation in place, businesses have the confidence to make certain strategic decisions and further grow.”
No. 641     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 20, 2017 at 1:59 AM     
Jordan Belfort: Real-life 'Wolf of Wall Street' says Bitcoin is a 'huge scam'
Former stockbroker compares cryptocurrency 'bubble' to tulip mania and claims market will collapse

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/jordan-belfort-bitcoin-scam-cryptocurrency-market-wolf-of-wall-street-us-a8112161.html


Jordan Belfort has predicted the value of Bitcoin will soon collapse Getty
The real-life Wolf of Wall Street has warned investors over Bitcoin, labelling it a “huge scam”.

"Jordan Belfort believes the cryptocurrency is in a bubble and could be set to plummet in value soon.

The former stockbroker, whose market manipulation and fraud crimes in the 1990s were subject of the 2013 film starring Leonardo Di Caprio, claims Bitcoin is a scam.

A third of millenials will be invested in bitcoin in 2018
He told the Financial Times: “Promoters are perpetuating a massive scam of the highest order on everyone.

“Probably 85 per cent of people out there don’t have bad intentions but the problem is, if 5 or 10 per cent are trying to scam you.”

The cryptocurrency has exploded value since the beginning of the year, with one Bitcoin now worth more than £13,000 at the current exchange rate.

Mr Belfort said he expected the price of Bitcoin to rise further in the short term before an eventual collapse in the market.

He likened it to Holland’s “tulip mania”, where the value of tulip bulbs grew exponentially in the 17th Century before a rapid fall in prices.

In an interview with CNN, he said: “I think it’s a huge danger right now that people are looking at this as the next great thing, it’s a bubble for sure.

“The next stage, you will see it really skyrocket, there will be a short squeeze, it will go even higher and then eventually it will come caving in, it’s almost a guarantee.

“If you were the most disciplined person and get in and get out there is probably a short window to make some money.

“But that’s not human nature, people will get in and make some money and they want to make more money.

“In the tulip bubble the beginning of the end was when they started trading futures on tulips, that was another move up and then all of a sudden it collapses and it’s over.”
No. 642     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 20, 2017 at 2:17 AM     
From Forbes...

5 Questions Bitcoin Traders Can't Answer

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnwasik/2017/10/30/5-questions-bitcoin-traders-cant-answer/#648a79c63529

OCT 30, 2017 @ 09:11 AM

John Wasik , CONTRIBUTOR

Opinions expressed by Forbes Contributors are their own.

"As a bona fide cryptocurrency skeptic, I'm of two minds on Bitcoin and other cryptos. One, I don't think we know enough about them to invest in them as if they were stocks and bonds. The transparency isn't there.

But I also think that the tide of technology and investors isn't going to be stopped any time soon.

Regulators, of course, are concerned about cryptos. Vehicles are started up every day to invest and speculate in them. According to the Financial Times, the U.K.'s Financial Conduct Authority is eyeing new trading platforms that allow you to bet on crypto movements with as much as 30:1 leverage on derivative contracts linked to Bitcoin.

Where is this all going? As Bitcoin prices blow past $6,000 a share, millions of investors want a piece of the action. Yet there are far too many questions to answer before cryptos become mainstream investments.

In an insightful piece by Karen Webster of pymnts.com, she poses the kinds of questions all investors should be asking:

-- Will Bitcoin Actually Replace Traditional Currencies?
"No one believes in the merits of a global cryptocurrency, except bitcoin zealots.

The notion that central banks will give up monetary control of their fiat currencies for a global cryptocurrency, especially bitcoin, is just not happening, so we should stop talking about it. Even economists who never agree on anything, agree on that.

Besides, a currency that swings between $1,000 and $5,000 over the course of two years, and between $3,000 and $5,000 in the course of a few weeks, isn’t exactly a good basis for operating a strong and stable foundation for a global financial system."

— Is Bitcoin A Legitimate Exchange Of Value? "Bitcoin has only two proven use cases after eight years: criminal activity and speculation.

I honestly don’t understand why this continues to be dismissed in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary. In the eight years since bitcoin has been a currency, transaction volume in the support of legitimate commerce is virtually nil."

-- Is Bitcoin Really Free? "Bitcoin is anything but free. Miners now expect a fee for their work and won’t process transactions for which they are not paid.

That means that those costs are passed down the ecosystem to end users. There’s no such thing as a free lunch, even in the land of bitcoin."

-- Is Bitcoin Immune From Hacking And Fraud? "The rising value of bitcoin has made exchanges prime targets for hacking, and thus has made hacks there quite lucrative.

The Mt. Gox hack netted $500 million, Bitfinex $72 million, Bitcoinica $460,000, Bitfloor $250,000 and Bitstamp $5.2 million. South Korea’s Bithumb hack last summer — the exchange that serves 75 percent of the South Korean market for bitcoin — resulted in tens of millions of dollars lost for the 30,000 customers affected. Even the wallets that store bitcoin are vulnerable.

The FBI reports that some $28 million in losses were reported to them in 2016, triple what they saw in 2015. But that’s only what’s reported.

It’s hard to imagine a money launderer or terrorist emailing the FBI to let them know they were hacked and lost money. That means that no one actually knows how much money has been lost to hacking, but the anonymity and irrevocability associated with bitcoin transactions means that the money lost is also irrecoverable."

-- Is It Too Soon For Crypto Derivatives And Margin Trading? With futures contracts on T-bills and corn, you know exactly what you're buying. The markets are backed up by regulated exchanges that have been around for 100 years or more.

But with Bitcoin, are you buying bits of computer code or somebody's wildly irrational idea of what those bits and bytes are worth?

“There’s a lot of interest from active traders and investors,” Claus Nielsen, head of markets at Denmark’s Saxo Bank, which has no immediate plans to offer crypto-CFDs, told The Financial Times.

“But this is not a liquid trading product yet. It’s premature, and not professional, to offer margin trading on cryptocurrencies to the retail segment yet.”

John F. Wasik is the author of "Lightning Strikes," "Keynes's Way to Wealth"and 15 other books on innovation, money and life. Follow him on Twitter and Facebook.
No. 643     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 20, 2017 at 9:29 PM     
They had the CEO of Bitcoin on Fast money today, he looked young but gave some good advice.
No. 644     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 64   on  Dec 21, 2017 at 4:58 PM     
insular926 wrote:

They had the CEO of Bitcoin on Fast money today, he looked young but gave some good advice.


I caught the replay later. Roger Ver is not really the CEO of Bitcoin. He is CEO of Bitcoin.com. Which is actually a separate entity from what Bitcoin is. His talk was interesting.

Roger and Fast Money were essentially discussing the results of the fork/"civil war", whatever one may want to call it. I posted of this a long time ago either in this thread or over in Storm's thread. I posted then that Bitcoin is likely its own worst enemy with the positions taken on not making changes, thus leading up to part of the Bitcoin community opting to fork. I posted back then, if anything can be, the forking could possibly be the demise of Bitcoin as we have known it. At least the original currency. If Bitcoin does not opt to adopt changes now, the core community will likely "undermine" themselves in due time.

Anyway, this is related to the drop in BTC value seen this week. Many finally received their Bitcoin Cash payouts, including me, middle of this week. The result of the windfall dropped the value of BTC relevantly. Which makes sense for Bitcoin Cash is the result of the forks that initiated back in August. For those familiar with traditional dividend payouts, it had a similar effect on Bitcoin. The initial value of Bitcoin Cash resulted in an equivalent value drop in Bitcoin.

There was a lot of excitement as to why was Bitcoin suddenly dropping in price this week? But those eligible for Bitcoin, holders of Bitcoin as of August 1st this year, did not really see an overall drop. Per the amount in value that BTC dropped as a result of the Bitcoin Cash payouts, eligible holders of BTC received an equivalent value in Bitcoin Cash. Bitcoin Cash was created by the forking of Bitcoin. In fact, some became instant millionaires within minutes of their payouts. Bitcoin Cash was up over 500% of its initial value within minutes. It has backed off since the initial "excitement".

It will be interesting to see how quickly the new currency is accepted. Bitcoin has made significant in roads that took years to do. But being the pioneer, I think they have provided a much easier trail for new digital currencies. In some form or another, digital currencies are obviously here to stay.

Anyway, I have held my Bitcoin Cash rather than sell, and also took advantage of the drop in BTC value. I caught her down close to $15000 thus then moving a considerable amount of my holdings into one of the daily payout investment programs. When the value of BTC drops, you actually enter these programs at a discount. And M-F they pay you out 1% daily in BTC regardless of what the value of BTC later does.

BTW - I like the Fast Money program. Often pretty informative and presenting a lot more credible financial experts than the novice author's of the articles recently provided in this thread. 3 of the last 4 articles are such a joke that even someone not familiar with digital currencies are probably laughing at the comments shared in the articles as being illogical and ridiculous. It is clearly obvious those authors, and most the previously posted ones, do not have a grasp on what Bitcoin is or is not.
No. 645     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 21, 2017 at 9:24 PM     
I think we are now seeing a greater drop in BTC value than was influenced by the Bitcoin Cash “spin-off”. The infighting amongst the Bitcoin community has grown much greater than I would have anticipated. They may be a victim of their own demise. Both sides, not just one of them.
No. 646     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 21, 2017 at 9:26 PM     
We have seen a history of these kind of drops and they come charging back. But the reasons for the drop this time are of their own doing.
No. 647     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 21, 2017 at 9:47 PM     
LOL. I opted to move more to daily income with BTC under $14000. That one account will now provide me pushing $200 per day on an investment that started with only around $700 about 5 months ago.
No. 648     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  crayons   Gender: M   Age: 61   on  Dec 21, 2017 at 11:35 PM     
was on the phone trying to reset an AT&T password
for a customer, There was endless looped advertisement
pushing bitcoin, so after hearing over 10 minutes of that
nonsense i told my customer it was crap and gave them leads
for a better phone service, No doubt it sounded like At&T
is in on bitcoin Mining for their own last ditch effort
to benefit/profit their bottom line.

I hold silver and gold but IMO Bitcoin is a fantasy.
Don't know anyone who has ever seen a bitcoin
edited for typos n' update to post.
No. 649     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 6:00 AM     
In the past 24 hours I made 4 new moves into Bitcoin investments within two different accounts with BTC value down as it has been this week. A wait and see now.

In reality, the primary manner in which I "play" Bitcoin, the current value does not matter. These investments operate and report in fractions/units of BTC. Regardless of current value. It can be difficult to ignore the USD value when pretty much everything is geared towards such. The only time this particular investment provides any kind of currency value is at initial purchase of a "package". The equivalent value other than BTC is provided in EUR.
No. 650     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 7:26 AM     
I see BTC slipped under $13000 over night/early this AM. Nasty week for Bitcoin. But I agree the near $20000 value was a lot of hype and/hope.

Looking as if the only bright spot this week is the receiving of Bitcoin Cash. Not sure what I am going to do with that. Almost sold it immediately upon receipt but did not. At the moment, I am simply not enlightened on the investment opportunities with that one. I actually was beginning to think I would never receive it. The “spin-off” happened like August 1st and just received my proceeds this week. But I understand with it being new, proper protocols had to be established for the exchanges to handle its impact.
No. 651     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 7:47 AM     
Well, there is brighter news today for Bitcoin than I thought. At least two traditional global exchanges have added Bitcoin futures to their investment offerings, as well as our own Nasdaq indicated they are doing the same.

Such moves are expected to greatly add to Bitcoin’s credibility as bring a legitimate investment option.
No. 652     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 11:33 AM     
Credible investment news sources are stating what is happening with Bitcoin is simply what is happening with most all digital currencies in the past 24 hours. All are down but 3. After such a successful year for most, investors are simply taking profits to not have to be concerned with such investments during the Holidays.

Some sources are reporting that for Bitcoin specifically, being down is reaction to what CEO Roger Ver of Bitcoin.com shared earlier this week related to the Bitcoin Cash "spin-off" and the "civil war" in the Bitcoin community. That Bitcoin is being abandoned to invest in Bitcoin Cash. But others say that is not likely because Bitcoin Cash is not on the rise today, and has also lost considerable value in the past 24 hours. Investors are simply taking year end profits regardless.

BTC was down to under $12000 for a while there this AM. If I had been near a PC I would have moved more to daily payout investing. But I was at the gym and only had my phone. Even with two factor authorization, if convenient I avoid making such transactions wirelessly. By time I got to a PC, BTC was back up.
No. 653     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 11:53 AM     
Wow. I have learned that BTC fell to as low as $10400 this AM, but has "rallied" back to $13300. Guess I did miss a good low to become more involved. Maybe later.
No. 654     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 12:18 PM     
I read today, on both Bloomberg Businessweek and Forbes by the way, that 1000 investors or blockchain addresses hold 40% of Bitcoin. These are not necessarily those that got in early. They are mostly late arrivers to Bitcoin being large individual holders and/or large institutional holders. With some of that 1000 possibly becoming involved as recently as this past November 2017. Somewhat dispels the myths that only those that got involved early have most all the Bitcoin and the wealth related to it. And this can be verified by simply looking at the blockchain addresses, of which anybody can easily do online.

It would not take very many of these 1000 to decided to cash out some BTC to send the price plummeting. One of them, at least one address in the blockchain, moved 25000 Bitcoin or $159 million USD to an exchange on November 12, 2017, as if preparing to unload. That would send some real "ripples" through the Bitcoin community. And that is just one such holder of BTC.
No. 655     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 3:30 PM     
Well, I arrived back home with expectations of maybe moving more to daily income with BTC under $11000, but she has now rallied back to over $14400 and on a pace back up 5% faster than Bitcoin Cash. Which as of Wednesday was promoted to be Bitcoin's demise.

Personally, I will "play" both if I can figure out an angle on Bitcoin Cash. Yes, I can buy low and sell high, but we may see both BTC and BCH not so volatile until after the Holidays. It is assumed the big players have already cashed out what they intend to for this year.

One of the most prominent digital currency investment gurus, he ranks amongst the highest of respect in the investment realm, says we should be buying BTC today on the dip. I am not inclined to do so with her back over $14000. I will still do the daily payout plans for they return in BTC without putting any new $$$ at risk, but to buy more BTC at the moment would require me to put new funds at risk. Not inclined to do so at the moment.
No. 656     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 4:43 PM     
LOL. This week a company traded on the Nasdaq as Long Island Iced Tea Corp ~ LTEA, changed their name to Long Blockchain, even though they have no exposure to blockchain technology. The new name took effect upon the market open on Thursday. In the like 30 minutes the stock jumped from a previous day close of $2.44 to $13.37. Over a 400% gain. Apparently investors thought it was a new company related to crypto currency technology.
No. 657     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 4:50 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

LOL. This week a company traded on the Nasdaq as Long Island Iced Tea Corp ~ LTEA, changed their name to Long Blockchain, even though they have no exposure to blockchain technology. The new name took effect upon the market open on Thursday. In the like 30 minutes the stock jumped from a previous day close of $2.44 to $13.37. Over a 400% gain. Apparently investors thought it was a new company related to crypto currency technology.


I have read since that this technique is a pretty rampant "trick" currently being played by companies to boost their stock price. They are changing their business names and/or website domain names to reflect they are related to cryptocurrencies in some manner, when in fact they are not.
No. 658     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 8:11 PM     
Yet another well respected Billionaire who says Bitcoin is a scam.

Bitcoin SCAM warning: Currency is ‘pyramid scheme’ says top investor who predicted crash

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/833706/Bitcoin-scam-price-news-cryptocurrency-pyramid-scheme-forecast

"CRYPTOCURRENCY Bitcoin is a nothing more than a fad or pyramid scheme style scam, according to billionaire investor Howard Marks.

By LANA CLEMENTS
PUBLISHED: 12:06, Thu, Jul 27, 2017 | UPDATED: 12:26, Thu, Jul 27, 2017

"The respected Wall Street boss warned clients against investing in the digital money, which has surged to record highs this year.

But the co-chairman of Oaktree Capital said Bitcoin has little value and its priced has been pushed up by speculators.

Mr Marks previously predicted both the financial crisis and that the dotcom bubble would burst, according to CNBC.

He told clients: "In my view, digital currencies are nothing but an unfounded fad (or perhaps even a pyramid scheme), based on a willingness to ascribe value to something that has little or none beyond what people will pay for it."

The investor compared cryptocurrencies to the Tulip mania of 1637, the South Sea bubble of 1720 and the internet bubble of 1999.

He added: "Serious investing consists of buying things because the price is attractive relative to intrinsic value.

"Speculation, on the other hand, occurs when people buy something without any consideration of its underlying value or the appropriateness of its price."

Bitcoin suffered a crash earlier this month but has since bounced back and is now up by almost nearly 160 per cent this year.

Its success has prompted values to increase in other digital currencies.

Ethereum cryptocurrency is up around 2,300 per cent in year to date.

The digital currencies limited supply has caused some experts to compare it to safe havens, such as gold.

And a number of experts have predicted Bitcoin's value will reach much higher in the coming years, if it becomes more mainstream.

Sheba Jafari, the head of technical strategy at Goldman Sachs could reach $3,691, from current levels of around $2,600.

No. 659     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 8:34 PM     
Another thing I have noticed is that Bitcoin is not, "safe" either.

Anyone who thinks otherwise either isn't telling you the truth or hasn't been paying attention to the news and what has been happening all over the world with Bitcoin Exchanges.

There are literally hundreds of cases out there of, "Bitcoin Exchanges" which have been hacked and had their Bitcoins stolen.

Some running into the hundreds of millions of dollars!

Bitcoin Ponzi Scheme: New Coin, Old Scam?

http://americanmonetaryassociation.org/bitcoin-ponzi-scheme-new-coin-old-scam/

"The Bitcoin is looking more and more like traditional money every day. In just a few short years, the upstart digital currency has gone from a mere novelty to a multimillion dollar trading commodity subject to many of the ills that plague “real” money backed by national and international banks. The latest step: a massive “Ponzi” scheme that bilked millions from Hong Kong Bitcoin investors.

Created in 2008, Bitcoin went public with its first transaction in 2009. Touted as the first completely democratic, decentralized form of currency, the digital coin was welcomed as a way for anybody to conduct transactions anywhere in the world in private and independent of the regulations and control of traditional banking.

In the years since that first Bitcoin transaction, the cybercurrency has had a dizzying run that saw it accepted for transactions involving things like in vitro fertilization, luxury cars, travel, college tuition, real estate – and drug dealing. Bitcoin even entered the international currency markets, trading for prices reaching as high as $200 against established currencies including the dollar, euro and yen.

Established banks in the US and abroad took a wary view of the Bitcoin, with state bank in some countries refusing to deal with it – and others declaring it an outright threat. But still the Bitcoin continued to flourish, thanks to private Bitcoin exchanges that sprang up around the world, primarily in Asia.

The Bitcoin suffered a massive wave of bad publicity that in some ways validated the claims of its worst critics when in 2014 the digital coin was implicated in the takedown of the huge online drug marketplace Silk Road. Run by the notorious Dread Pirate Robert, the site was meeting place of buyers and sellers of all kinds of illegal goods and services – and to no one’s surprise, the virtually anonymous Bitcoin.

The FBI and international authorities shut down Silk Road and confiscated its stash of Bitcoin, to be later distributed among the agencies involved in the operation. Bitcoin survived – but so did its reputation as a tool for illegal activity and money laundering.

Bitcoin transactions take place with the help of Bitcpon exchanges, online sites where users can exchange hard currency for coins and vice versa. The most prominent of these, Mt Gox, failed spectacularly in 2014, amid reports it had lost nearly 745,000 BTC (Bitcoin), which at the time was worth about $400 million. Since then, several other independently operated exchanges have sprung up, including Bitstamp and Bitfinex.

The Mt Gox incident was the best-known case in which a Bitcoin exchange folded, taking masses of money with it. But Mt Gox wasn’t directly implicated in fraud. Now, though, the Hong Kong based exchange MyCoin, is – as the world’s newest coinage becomes implicated in a type of fraud that’s nearly a century old – the Ponzi scheme.

Like Mt Gox, MyCoin closed down abruptly in the early day of February 2015. The online exchange completely disappeared – taking an estimated $386 million USD in client investments with it. And events leading up to that vanishing act strongly suggest an updated version of the venerable Ponzi scheme.

The Ponzi scheme, named for Carlo Pnnzi, a con man who perfected it back in 1920, is an investment scam that makes its money not from investing clients’ money in profitable investments, but from bringing in more new investors. Eventually the scheme collapses without a constant stream of new participants.

That seems to be what happened with MyCoin. Investors told local authorities that not log before it vanished, the company changed its trading rules, forbidding investors from exchanging all their Bitcoins unless they brought in new investors.

Cases like MyCoin, Mt Gox and Silk Road point up the fact that, by its very nature, Bitcoin is a largely unregulated – and unregualtable – currency. But those highly publicized struggles also serve as a reminder that in just a few short years, the digital coin has made significant inroads into the world’s financial structure.

As investors keeping a close eye on the fate of the dollar and other “traditional” currencies are realizing, the Bitcoin is here to stay – and it’s a force to be reckoned with. (Top image: Flickr/BTCkeychain)"

Sources:

Baipal, Prableen, “ A Look At the Most Popular Bitcoin Exchanges.” Investopedia. investopedia.com. 19 Nov 2014

Kelleher, John. “Bitcoin Mass Hysteria: The Disaster That Brought Down Mt Gox.” Investopedia. investopedia.com. 2 Sept 2014

Rosenfield, Everett. “$386M Allegedly Missing, As Investors Fear Bitcoin Ponzi.” CNBC Investing. cnbc.com. 9 Feb 2015.
No. 660     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 8:51 PM     
I think it will too. it may and probably will rise higher, perhaps much higher before it eventually comes crashing down. But crash it will. It has already done so at least 3 times with it's value plummeting down to nothing.

And when it does an awful lot of people will lose and lose big time.

Why the bitcoin party could end in tears
By THE CONVERSATION 6 December 2017

https://techcentral.co.za/bitcoin-party-end-tears/78566/

"With the price of bitcoin reaching record highs of more than US$12 000, more and more ordinary people consider investing in the cryptocurrency. The recent price surge, however, comes with tremendous risks. Investors should be prepared for the possibility that they could lose their entire investment.

Bitcoin was launched in 2008 by an anonymous author under the name of Satoshi Nakamoto as a means of transacting among participants without the need for intermediaries. Since the beginning of this year, the price of bitcoin has increased by more than 1 300% as more and more consumers flock to it hoping to profit off its increasing popularity and the associated increase in value.

Cryptocurrencies are not currencies at all. As the Financial Times explains, bitcoin is a string of computer codes which means that new bitcoins can be created — up to an agreed limit — by computers that gain the right to do so by solving complex puzzles. Transactions are recorded in a database called a blockchain.

The South African Reserve Bank has expressed its openness to blockchain technologies. But it has also highlighted potential risks to consumers
Bitcoin, like other assets like gold, doesn’t yield income. You have to sell it to realise any value. And, like gold and other currencies, it can be transferred peer to peer.

Part of the nervousness about bitcoin is that, along with other cyptocurrencies, it challenges the traditional role of banks and central banks. In the classical world, banks act as intermediaries by providing loans out of the deposits they took and from funding from the central bank. The central bank uses the rate at which it provides this funding as a lever to ensure price stability. The introduction of cryptocurrencies threatens this model because banks are no longer necessary to intermediate funds and there is no central bank to ensure that prices are stable.

The more immediate fears about bitcoin centre on the recent dramatic rise in its value. There’s nervousness in the market that a flash crash might be imminent after the cryptocurrency tumble by more than $1 300 in minutes on the bitcoin exchange Bitfinex. It did recover to levels above $12 400 on Wednesday.

The flash crash echoes longstanding warnings that the bitcoin party is set to end in tears. Most recently Jamie Dimon, CEO of JPMorgan, one of the world’s largest investment banks declared that he would fire any employee trading bitcoin for being stupid.

Stiglitz
In a highly unusual alliance, his words were echoed by economics Nobel laureate Joseph Stiglitz, who has gone even further arguing that bitcoin ought to be outlawed.

All of these are clear warning signs that the professionals do not trust the lofty promises of crypto enthusiasts.

There is no doubt that bitcoin — and in particular blockchain, the technology behind it — has the potential to revolutionise the financial services industry.



A blockchain functions as a transparent and incorruptible digital ledger of economic transactions, recorded in chronological order, that operates on a peer-to-peer network.

Fundamentally, the technology allows exchange of value to occur in an environment of peers with conflicting interests without the need for trusted intermediaries. That, in effect, wipes out the need for banks or financial services companies which fulfil this role.

The use of the technology is not limited to financial transactions. Virtually anything of value can be traded on a blockchain.

No matter how useful the underlying blockchain technology is, or how widely it can be applied, there are real and substantial risks involved in bitcoin
But no matter how useful the underlying blockchain technology is, or how widely it can be applied, there are real and substantial risks involved in bitcoin.

The first, and most significant risk is that compared to any currency, share, or gold, bitcoin is extremely volatile. The volatility of bitcoin to the US dollar is almost six times the volatility of the rand to dollar. While this is great in good times, it is potentially devastating for investors in bad times.

When professional investors decide on which assets to hold, they look at both the return and the volatility of the asset. Only investors with a healthy appetite for risk are willing to invest in risky, volatile assets. Usually these are finance professionals, for example in large investment banks or hedge funds.

Investors with a lower risk appetite, such as asset managers or pension funds, prefer assets with a somewhat lower return, but which are less volatile.

The rule of thumb is that the sophistication of an investor increases with the volatility of the asset she invests in. But with bitcoin this rule of thumb doesn’t hold true. More and more private investors have been flocking to bitcoin “exchanges” that have sprung up all over the Internet and that are aggressively advertised on social media.

There is a huge risk that bitcoin is already overvalued.

The practical use cases for bitcoin are limited. It doesn’t enable enough transactions to take place per second to be used as a replacement for a modern payment system. And it doesn’t offer any functionality other than pseudonymous transactions — transactions where the true identity of the counterparties is hidden.

Bitcoin is favoured by pyramid schemes, including the infamous MMM scheme in Nigeria. In a recent article, the Financial Times called bitcoin itself a pyramid scheme, much to the dismay of crypto enthusiasts. (A pyramid scheme is usually an illegal operation in which participants pay to join and profit mainly from payments made by subsequent participants. If no new people come in, it collapses.)

Regulatory risk
The third and possibly biggest risk is regulatory. In September 2017, the Chinese government outlawed bitcoin exchanges in mainland China, sending the price of bitcoin tumbling.

Despite the claim that bitcoin is a “global currency”, the reality is that 58% of all bitcoin mining happens in China. If at any point the Chinese government should decide to make bitcoin mining illegal, the price is likely to plunge into oblivion.

Other countries have also voiced concern. The Russian Central Bank recently issued a warning to investors on the risks of investing in cryptocurrencies, citing concerns about a bubble. This suggests that there might be a concerted crackdown.

Social media is alive with stories about friends of neighbours or distant cousins who have made a lot of money through bitcoin
Cryptocurrencies are banned in India as their use is a violation of foreign exchange rules. The Australian Reserve Bank has taken a different approach. It monitors the cryptocurrency market in a bid understand the underlying technology.

The South African Reserve Bank has expressed its openness to blockchain technologies. But it has also highlighted potential risks to consumers.

There are real risks that many consumers investing in cryptocurrency don’t fully understand. Advertisements promise that bitcoin can make you rich fast. And social media is alive with stories about friends of neighbours or distant cousins who have made a lot of money through bitcoin.

Without a doubt, these cases are real, and those who invested early can reap large benefits. But this is true in every bubble — from the dot-com bubble to the tulip mania. It’s also true in every pyramid scheme.

As always, investors should be extremely wary with any scheme that promises quick returns.The Conversation"

Written by Co-Pierre Georg, senior lecturer, African Institute for Financial Markets and Risk Management, and director, UCT Financial Innovation Lab, University of Cape Town, and Qobolwakhe Dube, PhD candidate at UCT

This article was originally published on The Conversation
No. 661     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 9:08 PM     
And from today's news...it looks like the price of Bitcoin has crashed 30% in one day, lol.From $17,500 to $12,000.

It has currently gone back up to

Bitcoin Plummets More Than 30% In Less Than A Day

Dec 22nd, 2017

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/22/business/bitcoin-plunges-more-than-25-percent-in-24-hours.html
No. 662     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 9:19 PM     
Bitcoin Is Crashing, Hard
After flirting with $20,000, the price of Bitcoin is plummeting.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/apps/a14486038/bitcoin-is-crashing-december-2017/

By Eric Limer And Associated Press
Dec 22, 2017

"Just before the holidays, the price of Bitcoin has taken a major downturn. After reaching a price of nearly $20,000 per Bitcoin over the past weekend, the price of the cryptocurrency is now down to $12,919 on the Coinbase exchange at the time of writing, marking the obliteration of more than a third of its total value in less than a week. Despite the precipitous drop, the price has not stabilized, and is experiencing extreme volatility. A mere month ago, Bitcoin was trading about $6,000.

Whether or not the cryptocurrency will somehow bounce back remains to be seen, but an upside of the crash is that it could take a bite out of Bitcoin's enormous energy footprintwhich was expected to increase wildly as its price increased. But with volatility like this, it's hard to make any guess what might happen next, except that people will certainly be paying close attention."

The Associated Press contributed to this report.
No. 663     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 10:21 PM     
Surprisingly, after a bloody Friday, Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash are both back in the green for the day, regaining their losses for the day and then some turning into a good day for both after all. Well, I hesitate to say that too soon. Got a couple more hour before the day is out.
No. 664     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 22, 2017 at 10:31 PM     
Received my payouts for Day 1 of the 4 new investments I made into one of the daily return investment programs. Life is blessed.
No. 665     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 7:55 AM     
Bitcoin making a nice recovery. Back over $15200 up about 15% in the past day.

Bitcoin Cash is the surprising one. Back over $3000 up more than 40% in the past day.

If going to invest in these things, you do have to be prudent and have a plan. Know your entrance point and have an exit strategy. Bitcoin was designed to be a decentralized currency, not necessarily an investment vehicle. It was after the fact that others devised and manipulated means to separate one from their money and put in their hands.

If into the investment "game" of cryptocurrencies, a lot of money is now being made when Bitcoin value drops. And the more it drops the better for those playing that end of the spectrum. Not all, but Bitcoin and some other digital currencies are now on the futures exchanges, thus they can be "shorted". Meaning you earn when they drop in value. Bitcoin's drastic drop this past week supposedly created several new millionaires. Depends on if they pulled the trigger on their options.
No. 666     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 8:09 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

Credible investment news sources are stating what is happening with Bitcoin is simply what is happening with most all digital currencies in the past 24 hours. All are down but 3. After such a successful year for most, investors are simply taking profits to not have to be concerned with such investments during the Holidays.


Final report was that all digital currencies were eventually down at some point on Friday. Bitcoin was actually down to as low as $10400 after being at $20000 just days prior.

It can sometimes be confusing/difficult to determine when something actually happened with digital currencies. Being most are globally traded currencies, often times what is reported to have happened on such as Friday, when it did happen it was still our Thursday here in the US.

Several times I have found myself reading some news on an investment at breakfast that such and such happened on such as Friday, and think huh it is only Friday morning now. Pop into my accounts and find it is already old news compared to what is currently happening. Some "investments" potentially move very quickly.
No. 667     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 8:34 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:
If into the investment "game" of cryptocurrencies, a lot of money is now being made when Bitcoin value drops. And the more it drops the better for those playing that end of the spectrum. Not all, but Bitcoin and some other digital currencies are now on the futures exchanges, thus they can be "shorted". Meaning you earn when they drop in value. Bitcoin's drastic drop this past week supposedly created several new millionaires. Depends on if they pulled the trigger on their options.


It was not my intent to follow this post with an update so quickly, but some investment news just "popped" into my inbox I thought I would share.

First let me say there is a lot of news out there related to digital currencies. Much if not most of it, regardless of how credible and known the hosting source is, is written by a contributing author that has no real direct experience with digital currencies. He simply knows that posting something mentioning digital currencies get clicks and views, and if he gets enough he may land a staff position on a publication versus simply being a contributing author.

Anyway, the news I just received indicates that Bitcoin's drive to $20000 was actually driven by its debut on the futures exchanges this past Monday. In just the first couple hours of trading, futures contracts on Bitcoin were trading at over $20000. Thus Bitcoin's spot price followed. With a typical investment it is the other way around. The spot price drives the futures price.

Thus relating back to my earlier post on Bitcoin being designed as a decentralized currency, not necessarily an investment vehicle. Again, it has been others after the fact devising and manipulating means to render Bitcoin an "investment".

Nevertheless, within the same article that shared the above on the futures debut, the following was also reported by Rakesh Sharma of Investopedia:

Ronnie Moas, founder of Standpoint Research, had predicted a price target of $5,000 for bitcoin, when it was trading at $2,600. This morning, he told CNBC that bitcoin will touch six figures and become the world’s most valuable currency.

According to Moas, bitcoin is similar to e-commerce behemoth Amazon.com in that it is a long term buy. “The way to play Amazon for the last 15 years was to buy it, hold it, and add on the dips," he said. "That's exactly the way I think people should be playing bitcoin."
No. 668     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 8:40 AM     
Survivor698 wrote:

According to Moas, bitcoin is similar to e-commerce behemoth Amazon.com in that it is a long term buy. “The way to play Amazon for the last 15 years was to buy it, hold it, and add on the dips," he said. "That's exactly the way I think people should be playing bitcoin."


This coincides with most my research. Even though some have become "rich" quickly with Bitcoin and many trying to, the name of the game is to accumulate and hold Bitcoin if looking at Bitcoin as an investment.
No. 669     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 1:49 PM     
From what I have read today, even if Bitcoin had stayed down at the $10400 it was at one point this week, most all involved would still have considerably more than they have ever invested into Bitcoin. Even with neglecting the Bitcoin Cash payouts that many Bitcoin holders received this week that would have also more than offset any loss that a few may have experienced. Bitcoin Cash has seen record increases this week. Bottom line, most likely all involved in Bitcoin are multiple times ahead in the game.
No. 670     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 23, 2017 at 6:32 PM     
An recent article from Friday...

Bitcoin plummets, reveals Ponzi scheme traits
BY BERT ELY, OPINION CONTRIBUTOR — 12/22/17 01:00 PM EST

http://thehill.com/opinion/finance/366059-cryptocurrencies-generate-no-real-value-thats-why-theyre-ponzi-schemes

"Several readers of my most recent op-ed on cyber currencies, “Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme, and it will collapse like one,” criticized my characterization of cyber currencies, and specifically bitcoin, as Ponzi schemes. I will explain why cyber currencies in fact are akin to a Ponzi scheme even if they are not criminal frauds.

Friday's unprecedented collapse of cyber currency prices reinforces my Ponzi scheme characterization of cyber currencies. Bitcoin, the dominate cyber currency, hit an all-time peak, slightly above $20,000 last Sunday morning before beginning a moderate price slide that accelerated in the early hours of Friday morning Eastern time.

ADVERTISEMENT
By late Friday morning, Bitcoin's price had dropped to $11,833, a 41-percent decline from Sunday's peak. Every other cyber currency reported on the coinmarketcap.com website showed similar, if not greater price declines. The decline in the market value of all cyber currencies exceeds $100 billion; bitcoin alone has lost almost $40 billion of market value.


The collapse of cyber currency prices over the last 24 hours powerfully reinforces my assertion that at their core, cyber currencies are Ponzi schemes, or certainly close Ponzi cousins. This price collapse also destroys any belief that cyber currencies represent a reliable store of value — anything but!

Ponzi schemes, such as the one Bernie Madoff operated for years, are fraudulent because they promise returns to investors that are totally illusory. Ponzi operators such as Madoff use cash received from recent investors to repay earlier investors, returning not only their original investment, but also a “profit” presumably earned by the operator while holding that “investment.” Ponzi operators also pocket a portion of what they collect from investors.

Since Ponzi schemes rarely invest in anything with a real or intrinsic value, such as stocks, bonds, property, businesses, etc., which generate real income, Ponzi schemes do not generate any real profits. The same is true for all cyber currencies — there is nothing real about them.

While cyber currencies do not have an operator, per se, “miners,” who produce and sell fresh “cryptocoins,” collectively are comparable to the operator of a Ponzi scheme. The coins that miners earn are the equivalent of what a Ponzi-scheme operator pockets from the funds he collects.

Put another way, cryptocoin mining generates a negative value-added — the mining activity consumes real resources, notably the electricity used by the miner’s computers, yet all this activity generates no real value, only a fictional asset that nonetheless can readily be bought and sold.

That cryptocoins have any market value — people willingly exchange dollars, euros, yen, etc., for cryptocoins like bitcoin — derives solely from the belief that the coins will continue to rise in value without end. As with Ponzi schemes, the greater fool theory is alive and well in the world of cyber currencies.

The greater liquidity — the ability to buy and sell large amounts of a cryptocoin without materially affecting its price — of bitcoin and other coins with large amounts in circulation does not constitute real value because the coins themselves have no substantive value. That is, being able to easily buy or sell large quantities of nothing hardly represents economic value.

Ponzi schemes inevitably crash when incoming cash from investors is no longer sufficient to cash out earlier investors and pay them a “profit,” too. Usually, the crash occurs when enough nervous investors suddenly try to cash in their investments, sucking out all of the operator’s cash. Once the operator begins to default on making payments upon demand or when promised, the game is over and that Ponzi scheme is no more.

The same phenomenon — the desire to quickly liquidate an investment before prices drop even more — will occur with cyber currencies as there will be far more sellers than buyers for a particular cryptocoin. That imbalance will quickly cause the price of that cryptocoin to plunge, as we saw so clearly on Friday. If investors bravely buying that cryptocoin as its price is dropping cannot arrest that price drop, then it will continue.

Since nothing of substance differentiates one cryptocoin from another, except possibly the rate at which they are mined or their perceived liquidity, contagion will quickly spread to other coins, as we saw Friday, much as a run on one bank can trigger runs on other banks. Unlike banks, though, there is no insurance comparable to bank deposit insurance to protect investors from a collapse in the market value of their cryptocoins.

Conceivably, futures contracts on specific cyber currencies or, eventually, cryptocoin shorting could help to cushion a plunge in cryptocoin prices, but given the infant stage of these futures contracts — they only recently became available for bitcoin — investors cannot place much confidence in hedging strategies to protect against a collapse in bitcoin’s price, much less cryptocoin prices generally. It will be interesting to see what impact today's price collapse will have on this futures market.

An additional threat to elevated cryptocoin prices is the proliferation of crypto currencies. As of noon Friday, Eastern time, coinmarketcap.com listed prices and current market capitalizations for 1,375 crypto currencies with a total valuation of $437 billion; bitcoin accounted for $205 billion, or 47.0 percent, of that valuation.

While bitcoin’s champions assert that the maximum supply of bitcoins will never exceed 21 million, in fact there is no legally enforceable guarantee that the supply of bitcoins could not be increased above 21 million.

Further, given that there is no substantive difference among cryptocoins — they all are equally illusionary and have no intrinsic value — no individual cryptocoin, not even bitcoin, will be immune to the price-depressing effects of a never-ending increase in the quantity of all cryptocoins.

Just as paper currency loses value when the printing press is cranked up and an economy is flooded with that currency (witness Venezuela today), so too will cryptocoins lose value when the quantity outstanding grows rapidly.

As cryptocoin investors wake up to this possibility, they will be much more inclined to sell rather than buy cryptocoins when coin prices begin a sustained decline. That certainly has been evident Friday, as many cryptocoin investors are rushing to sell their coins before prices drop further. That rush to sell must be especially intense among those who have leveraged their cryptocoin bets.

I will not venture a guess as to when or where the collapse in cryptocoin prices will finally bottom out, but if nothing else, this collapse should irreparably undermine the belief so many "investors" have had in cryptocurrencies. Viewing them as variants of a classic Ponzi scheme will help greatly to put cryptocurrencies in a proper perspective.

Bert Ely is the principal of Ely & Company, Inc., where he monitors conditions in the banking industry, monetary policy, the payments system and the growing federalization of credit risk."
No. 671     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 25, 2017 at 6:32 PM     
For a couple gifts this year I ordered the Omaha Steak packages. Actually got a better deal on them ordering direct from their website versus the radio and TV ads. For several others I simply did gift cards. Gave very few items directly as gifts this year.

Anyway, when gift card shopping, I became aware that you can now give gift cards of Bitcoins. In the past I have gifted Bitcoin by way of what is called a voucher, but never knew about the gift cards until recently.

BTW - At Christmas dinner today I heard many comments that I could have gave them Bitcoin for Christmas. One of them sitting there I recently did, but she never shared such to the others. In fact, that Bitcoin has now funded two business start-ups for her, leaving 1/3 of the proceeds invested returning and accumulating Bitcoin daily regardless of what the USD value of Bitcoin does.
No. 672     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 26, 2017 at 9:21 AM     
Bitcoin up almost $1800 this AM to about $15800. But a lot of top investment advisory services did rank Bitcoin a “BUY” under $20000 over the weekend. At the other extreme, with Bitcoin new to the futures exchanges as of last week, some are providing strategies on how to short Bitcoin and make money on a drop, and/or use a futures contract to hedge and make money on your BTC holdings no matter which way the value goes.

I.E., using a futures contract you can now self-insure against investment loss on your BTC same as we enjoy on more traditional investments.
No. 673     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 26, 2017 at 4:30 PM     
All I know is that those Bitcoin Commemorative Coins sure are popular on EBAY, man oh man.
No. 674     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 26, 2017 at 5:52 PM     
insular926 wrote:

All I know is that those Bitcoin Commemorative Coins sure are popular on EBAY, man oh man.


I have something like 30 of them in gold and silver plated. Have a bunch more that are just aluminum for novelty gifts.

I also have like 5 made out of gold or silver that in addition to the precious metal value itself, one is worth a full Bitcoin. These are one of the means of actually having physical Bitcoin per se. If it is a coin with an encrypted blockchain address on it, it is worth whatever the Bitcoin value is at that address. As long as you have not already transferred the BTC somewhere else.

You may can also per se own digital currencies physically via a paper wallet and a hard drive. Neither of which are live on a network/Internet, thus not able to be hacked in that manner. For that matter, your Bitcoin is essentially not likely to be hacked if you practice the available safety protocols even if held digitally online. Exchanges and services are maybe prone to being hacked, but even then with a credible and reputable exchange most your Bitcoin is relatively safe and/or insured against such a loss.

Most holders of Bitcoin do not have their holdings on an exchange anyways unless actively trading. Supposedly most buy and hold or create and hold. They only move the amount of BTC to an exchange they are preparing to make a transaction with. And even when there, the best exchanges and wallets provide insurance on your holdings and limit exposure.

Many exchanges practice protocols were as 100% of Bitcoin they are holding for customers is not accessible online. Only like 10-20 percent is actually accessible on the exchange, just enough is released online to cover active transactions. Most the holdings is in what is called "cold-storage" on hardware that is offline, thus not accessible to an online hack attempt. In fact, there are now pocketsize USB hardware wallets were as you may hold your own Bitcoin safe from being online.

On top of all that, most now have 2nd and 3rd factor authorization available to them, and if wise should be using it. Even with your Bitcoin online it is not accessible to even you unless you enter your password and/or then enter a code that is sent only to your phone that has to then be entered within so many seconds of attempting to access.

Yes, in the early days of such as Mt. Gox and a couple others, they supposedly got hacked. Lots of protection has been implemented since those days. For one thing, like I mentioned above, the Bitcoin simply is not held online to be hacked, it is held offline. Also there is speculation that the hacks that have happened were inside jobs. Not really hacks from a 3rd party. The speculations have become more serious with at least 3 employees of so called hacked exchanges having been found dead, suspected of being revenge killings. Not suicides and accidents as some news sources reported. But who knows.

Where there is a will there is eventually a way. Same as any other sources of valuables, someone will eventually find a way to hack. The game is to constantly change the technology to stay ahead of hackers, and probably more importantly, simply practice a diligent process of protecting yourself. With most hacks, the owner of the asset or data leaves enough information accessible to enable the hacker. Does not matter what it is, digital currencies, your charge card, and/or you bank accounts, etc..

Supposedly the Bitcoin blockchain itself has never been hacked. But I did read some blurb recently that indicates that even though maybe never really hacked per se to were as individuals lost any of their Bitcoin. If I understood correctly, someone created some invalid address and added them to the blockchain, rendering the potential to have received some network Bitcoin for free. I do not think they were successful at actually getting any Bitcoin.

Anyway, if you practice some due diligence, it not likely your Bitcoin is going to get hacked unless you expose some serious levels of privacy and/or opt for an exchange not properly vetted.
No. 675     Reply: Re: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 26, 2017 at 8:25 PM     
Survivor698 wrote:

insular926 wrote:

All I know is that those Bitcoin Commemorative Coins sure are popular on EBAY, man oh man.


I have something like 30 of them in gold and silver plated. Have a bunch more that are just aluminum for novelty gifts.

I also have like 5 made out of gold or silver that in addition to the precious metal value itself, one is worth a full Bitcoin. These are one of the means of actually having physical Bitcoin per se. If it is a coin with an encrypted blockchain address on it, it is worth whatever the Bitcoin value is at that address. As long as you have not already transferred the BTC somewhere else.

You may can also per se own digital currencies physically via a paper wallet and a hard drive. Neither of which are live on a network/Internet, thus not able to be hacked in that manner. For that matter, your Bitcoin is essentially not likely to be hacked if you practice the available safety protocols even if held digitally online. Exchanges and services are maybe prone to being hacked, but even then with a credible and reputable exchange most your Bitcoin is relatively safe and/or insured against such a loss.

Most holders of Bitcoin do not have their holdings on an exchange anyways unless actively trading. Supposedly most buy and hold or create and hold. They only move the amount of BTC to an exchange they are preparing to make a transaction with. And even when there, the best exchanges and wallets provide insurance on your holdings and limit exposure.

Many exchanges practice protocols were as 100% of Bitcoin they are holding for customers is not accessible online. Only like 10-20 percent is actually accessible on the exchange, just enough is released online to cover active transactions. Most the holdings is in what is called "cold-storage" on hardware that is offline, thus not accessible to an online hack attempt. In fact, there are now pocketsize USB hardware wallets were as you may hold your own Bitcoin safe from being online.

On top of all that, most now have 2nd and 3rd factor authorization available to them, and if wise should be using it. Even with your Bitcoin online it is not accessible to even you unless you answer like 1-3 secret questions that you create and/or then enter a code that is sent only to your phone that has to then be entered within so many seconds of attempting to access.

Yes, in the early days of such as Mt. Gox and a couple others, they supposedly got hacked. Lots of protection has been implemented since those days. For one thing, like I mentioned above, the Bitcoin simply is not held online to be hacked, it is held offline. Also there is speculation that the hacks that have happened were inside jobs. Not really hacks from a 3rd party. The speculations have become more serious with at least 3 employees of so called hacked exchanges having been found dead, suspected of being revenge killings. Not suicides and accidents as some news sources reported. But who knows.

Where there is a will there is eventually a way. Same as any other sources of valuables, someone will eventually find a way to hack. The game is to constantly change the technology to stay ahead of hackers, and probably more importantly, simply practice a diligent process of protecting yourself. With most hacks, the owner of the asset or data leaves enough information accessible to enable the hacker. Does not matter what it is, digital currencies, your charge card, and/or you bank accounts, etc..

Supposedly the Bitcoin blockchain itself has never been hacked. But I did read some blurb recently that indicates that even though maybe never really hacked per se to were as individuals lost any of their Bitcoin. If I understood correctly, someone created some invalid address and added them to the blockchain, rendering the potential to have received some network Bitcoin for free. I do not think they were successful at actually getting any Bitcoin.

Anyway, if you practice some due diligence, it not likely your Bitcoin is going to get hacked unless you expose some serious levels of privacy and/or opt for an exchange not properly vetted.


I like the solid gold ones!
No. 676     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 27, 2017 at 10:04 AM     
At one point early this AM, Bitcoin was up near $16500. Has backed off since then.

In reality, serious cryptocurrency users could care less about what the USD value is. The mindset of many has totally migrated to thinking in units of crypto. I am not totally there yet. In some ways I am. More and more I find myself in a mode of "how much Bitcoin is required" with no concern with the USD value. For me, the USD value only comes into play if do not desire to tap any current accumulations of BTC. On occasion I initiate a new investment exchanging some USD for BTC. But even then, if I have an immediate need for the BTC, the USD value is not the primary concern.

Many websites I frequent no longer even provide a price in USD or even accept USD as payment. They only accept crypto, often providing a substantial discount if payment is made with Bitcoin.
No. 677     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:00 PM     
Rickards: ‘Bitcoin is a Ponzi Scheme’

https://youtu.be/rotzgnrnfnY
No. 678     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:02 PM     
Bitcoin is the Biggest Ponzi Scheme In History

https://youtu.be/kOw15zYwmfM
No. 679     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:05 PM     
6 Reasons Why BitCOiN Is Doomed to Fail!

https://youtu.be/7Yfp-pkjG5Y
No. 680     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:06 PM     
How Bitcoin Will Fail

https://youtu.be/ahmWGCbJm-E
No. 681     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:10 PM     
PETER SCHIFF - Bitcoin may look profitable, this is a trap that you should never be fooled by - u

https://youtu.be/A9lTIHqdgQE
No. 682     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:13 PM     
"Anonymous" on Bitcoin...

Anonymous What They Aren't Telling You! Bitcoin Phenomenon!

https://youtu.be/v90SN7_0HhQ
No. 683     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:26 PM     
Bitcoin millionaire: Don't invest in bitcoin

https://youtu.be/oRX_8Op-2AM
No. 684     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 9:27 PM     
I wouldn't put $0.01 in Bitcoin or Cryptocurrenties

https://youtu.be/GzVO3nDEOgk
No. 685     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Dec 28, 2017 at 10:10 PM     
There are those whom seek truth, and then there are those whom just have to be able to say they were right or they told you so. Even if it takes "slinging enough mud on the wall" in hopes something maybe sticks just enough to justify them saying they were right, regardless of what is truth.
No. 686     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Dec 31, 2017 at 10:31 AM     
.
No. 687     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 1, 2018 at 10:42 AM     
Hardly a week does not go by that I am not contacted to write an article as a contributing author of crypto and other personal investment experience for many of the same publications that have been quoted in this thread. Although I may frequent their blogs/forums and provide a couple comments/reviews, I have simply declined the opportunities to write articles for lack of time.

In the coming year, I plan to do an assessment of how I am spending time and may revisit the opportunities for being such an author. The contacts for such have expanded to include other topics. Have even been contacted about doing a radio talk show. That one I am just not sure if I have the personality for. But the hosts of such programming state it would be little different than what they have already witnessed me do for others within various fields and/or topics I am experienced. I simply need to narrow it down to were as what I am most interested in sharing and/or most passionate about sharing.

Speaking of such, my brother-in-law has become a quite followed host of a YouTube channel on over the road trucking. As a result, he started a trucking consulting business which is thriving as a result of his channel. He too has recently been contacted to host a radio talk show, on over the road trucking of course.

Anyway, I have also had several contacts about creating channels on various topics of my experience on YouTube and Steemit. In late 2017 I took steps to initiate such with both venues, but have not populated them with content as of yet.

Did not mean to stray from the primary topic. It is simply a new year prompting some evaluation and ramblings of what to move on to next in life. The opportunities are endless.
No. 688     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 2, 2018 at 5:20 PM     
Looks as though I may have missed a bottom on BTC twice in the past 7 days or so. I planned to buy some for a new purchase/investment versus puling from my current stores if she dropped to $12500 or less. She has been there at least twice lately and I missed buying both times.

She is just shy of $15000 again at the moment. I will not purchase more directly at those kind of levels at this time, unless I really need BTC to make some other transaction. I have two accounts accumulating BTC every day, but I simply do not desire to tap those stores as of yet.
No. 689     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 6, 2018 at 5:32 PM     
Most cryptos across the board have made rallies since the first of the new year.

I hesitated on ETH, LTC and Ripple, missing great Buy opportunities. All three considerably up. I need to get my Kraven account funded so I may more readily move on these opportunities as they emerge.

BTC is nicely back up over &17000, but I have simply been riding what I have, accumulating more for free.

Doge is expected to experience a big rally this year. I already have a substantial store of Doge, essentially accumulated for free when it first emerged as a new crypto.
No. 690     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Jan 12, 2018 at 9:49 AM     
Chinese bitcoin miners eye sites in energy-rich Canada
Allison Lampert, Alexandra Harney, Brenda Goh

6 Min Read




MONTREAL/SHANGHAI (Reuters) - China’s Bitmain Technologies is eyeing bitcoin mining sites in Quebec, a company spokesman told Reuters, as expectations of a potential Chinese crackdown on cryptocurrency mining make the energy-rich Canadian province an attractive alternative.


China has grown into one of the world’s biggest sources of cryptocurrency mining but there are signs Beijing is increasing scrutiny of the sector’s players and may ask local authorities to regulate their power use. Bitmain Technologies, operator of some of the largest mining farms in the country, is among several companies looking to expand overseas.

Bitmain spokesman Nishant Sharma said in an e-mail on Friday that the company was looking at sites in Quebec and is in talks with regional power authorities in the province. It is also planning to expand in Switzerland.

Bitcoin mining consumes large quantities of energy because it uses computers to solve complex math puzzles to validate transactions in the cryptocurrency, which are written to the blockchain, or digital ledger. The first miner to solve the problem is rewarded in bitcoin and the transaction is added to the blockchain.

While Beijing has not issued any official edict on the bitcoin mines, two Chinese miners told Reuters that local authorities had grown more unwilling to allow expansion and had started to shut down some mines in late 2017, as China clamped down on cryptocurrencies.

Last September, Chinese authorities banned so-called initial coin offerings and ordered Beijing-based cryptocurrency exchanges to halt trading.

“We, and from what I understand many of our peers, are already making plans to go overseas,” said Li Wei, chief executive of ZQMiner, a Wuhan-based company that sells bitcoin mining equipment and has mines in three Chinese provinces.

Globally, regulators are increasingly voicing concerns about cryptocurrencies, which are not backed by any central bank, because of their volatility and worries about risks to investors. China, which has strict capital controls, is also worried that cryptocurrencies could facilitate illegal fund flows and breed financial risks.

In Canada, Hydro Quebec described a potential sales pipeline of around 30 large cryptocurrency miners after a campaign by the public utility to attract data centres to the province triggered a flurry of interest from bitcoin miners in 2017.

“Of the world’s top five largest blockchain players, we have at least three or four,” David Vincent, director of business development at Hydro Quebec distribution, said in an interview on Wednesday.
MANITOBA ALSO ATTRACTIVE

Stephane Paquet, a vice president of Montreal International, which promotes foreign investment in the province’s largest city, has called Quebec a place for “green bitcoin.”

According to Hydro Quebec, the province has an energy surplus equivalent to 100 Terawatt hours over 10 years. One terawatt hour powers 60,000 homes in Quebec during a year.

Neither Hydro Quebec nor Montreal International would divulge names of interested miners. Vincent said companies are eyeing operations from about 20 megawatts, the size of a data centre, to sites as large as 300 megawatts, about the size of a small aluminum smelter.

He expects some of the large companies to begin operations in Quebec this year and in early 2019. Bitmain’s spokesman said that Bitmain has been mining in Canada since 2016, but did not say where.

The challenge for miners is finding existing facilities in Quebec that already have buildings and other infrastructure in place to use the large energy supply required for cryptocurrency mining. A new facility would take about a year to be operational.


“We have the energy available,” said Eric Filion, customer vice-president for Hydro Quebec’s distribution division. “It’s a question of finding land and buildings quickly.”

Hydro Quebec, which offers some of the lowest electricity rates in North America, charges an industrial rate of $0.0248 per kilowatt hour (Kwh) (2.48 U.S. cents) for data centres and $0.0394/kwh (3.94 U.S. cents) for cryptocurrency customers. Customers would have to assume other start-up costs, Filion said.

Textiles and pulp and paper factories are particularly attractive to cryptocurrency mining companies.

Alain Bourdages, a company vice president at Montreal-based Resolute Forest Products Inc (RFP.N), said by phone that the company has been contacted by cryptocurrency companies about possibly sharing their existing production sites, or ones that are no longer in use.

“We are looking at this prudently,” he said. “It’s an interesting opportunity that could generate value.”

In central Canada’s Manitoba province, provincial government-owned utility Manitoba Hydro has fielded more than 100 inquiries from cryptocurrency miners in the past three months about specific sites, a company spokesman said.

The interest includes North American brokers who represent Chinese investors, attracted by Manitoba’s cheap power and potential reduced cooling requirements, spokesman Bruce Owen said. It is working with two large-scale cryptocurrency operations that want to set up in Manitoba, he said.

Manitoba’s power rates may soon rise, however. Manitoba Hydro is asking the province’s utilities board to approve a rate increase of 7.9 percent across the board, effective April 1, 2018. That is far larger than utility rate changes proposed last year in other provinces, including 0.7 percent in Quebec, according to Manitoba Hydro data.

Reporting by Allison Lampert in Montreal, Alexandra Harney and Brenda Goh in Shanghai; Additional reporting by Rod Nickel in Calgary; Editing by Grant McCool and Raju Gopalakrishnan
Our Standards:The Thomson Reuters Trust Principles.
No. 691     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 12, 2018 at 10:07 AM     
insular926 wrote:
MONTREAL/SHANGHAI (Reuters) - China’s Bitmain Technologies is eyeing bitcoin mining sites in Quebec,


Since like 2012/2013 Bitmain has hosted a considerable amount of mining for me, as well as drop shipped a lot of miners for me, with me ranking as one the most active US based resellers of Bitmain hardware online, were as many others have long come and gone.
No. 692     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jan 18, 2018 at 8:56 PM     
I see the price of bitcoin dropped 50% in one month from $20,000 down to $10,000 the other day.

https://www.recode.net/2018/1/17/16901466/bitcoin-price-cost-invest-cryptocurrencies-50-percent
No. 693     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 18, 2018 at 9:27 PM     
Simply a reasonable correction given recent events. As already shared, Bitcoin was artificially pushed higher in value when Bitcoin was accepted as a viable commodity for options trading on the leading traditional exchanges. At around the same time many holders of Bitcoin received their Bitcoin Cash settlements as a result of the forking/spin-off providing another Bitcoin crypto.

Technically Bitcoin did not really drop in value as much as it appears on the surface. Many more than made up the supposed drop in value with the Bitcoin Cash received, not to mention their potential profits from options contracts when Bitcoin options trading opened on the commodity exchanges.

There are actually now three components that comprise the value of what that one component was that made up that $10000-$20000 value less than 30 days ago. Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and Bitcoin options contracts. Of course the value of Bitcoin standing alone substantially dropped. It is now only one of three parts of what was one part less than 30 days ago. Whether any part of it is worth what it is now is in the eye of the beholder or wanna beholder.
No. 694     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  crayons   Gender: M   Age: 62   on  Jan 18, 2018 at 9:39 PM     
Ain/t got no time fer Crypto Crap Scams.
Lets put it this way...it's fantasy, it does
not exist, there not one physical crypto coin that
can be ordered,shipped,held or touched...
it's total BS.
No. 695     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 18, 2018 at 10:12 PM     
Actually, many of the recent crypto ICOs include a physical coin/token aspect. At the moment though, the token aspect appears to be little more than a novelty offering with some of them. A few do provide a coin made of a precious metal or represents the value of a precious metal. At a minimum, the physical aspect does allow the crypto to meet requirements of the marketplaces that provide buyer protection when a physical product is shipped. Many marketplaces do not provide buyer protection when the product is only delivered digitally.
No. 696     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Bullfighter279   Gender: M   Age: 103   on  Jan 19, 2018 at 12:38 AM     
Snake Oil, lol.
No. 697     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 20, 2018 at 3:03 PM     
Another thing recently going on with crypto values, even though by design the value of USD should not be the primary focus, the US dollar has experienced new lows since the start of 2018. Unfortunately with many twisting the desire for crypto currency to that of one as an "investment", the only primary meaningful value to those "investors" is correlated with the value of USD. A correction in the dollar value has resulted in a correction in crypto values.

What I have also found interesting, and really never thought about until it happened with events of the past 30 days, although Bitcoin was accepted as being able to be traded on major commodity exchanges was seen as a success amongst crypto promoters, at the same time opened Bitcoin to currency manipulation by bankers.

Bankers who saw Bitcoin as a threat sucking dollars away from and undermining the security of the ordained petrodollar world currency, using the commodities markets manipulated a pop of the Bitcoin bubble. Sparking massive selling of Bitcoin.

Bankers pushed the options contracts on Bitcoin to artificial highs increasing the value of Bitcoin itself, and then those same bankers knocked the skids out from under the options contracts. Typically the asset itself, in this case Bitcoin, establishes the value of options contracts. But bankers managed to manipulate them on the commodity exchanges same as other traditional currency options are now manipulated.

Bitcoin being accepted as credible as any other commodity on the exchanges, appears to be working against Bitcoin.
No. 698     Reply: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  insular926   Gender: M   Age: 57   on  Jan 20, 2018 at 6:15 PM     
You can supposedly buy Mavericks Tickets with Bitcoin so says Mark Cuban or it's in the works.
No. 699     Reply: Re: Re: The Truth About Bitcoin   
By:  Survivor698   Gender: M   Age: 104   on  Jan 20, 2018 at 7:04 PM     
insular926 wrote:

You can supposedly buy Mavericks Tickets with Bitcoin so says Mark Cuban or it's in the works.


Everything that I can currently buy with a credit or debit card, I can buy with Bitcoin.